Bible Discussion: Adam And Eve Explained In Greater Detail Part 1

Adam And Eve Explained In Greater Detail Part 1
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Red Dragon
2004-08-26 10:32:00 EST
>1. Where is Eden? In East Africa?
>No. Eden was in Present Iraq. The Bible said so in Gen. 2-14.
That's a guess.
No guess. Gen. 2-14 mentioned the Tigris and Euphrates River.

>3. When was Adam created by God.? What year?
> Rev. James Ussher, the Irish Bishop and Scholar computed that the Earth
>was created on 22 Oct. 4004 BC, based on the Genealogy of Christ as
>given in the Bible. Adam was created shortly after this. This date by
>Ussher was printed on the Top Page of Genesis in the Bible until 1900
when
>studies showed that it could not be correct, and removed by instruction of
>the Church Authority.
Why can't it be correct?


It cannot be correct because

1. Dinosaurs and the wooly Mammoth cannot be fitted into any period after
Adam. Dinos and Mammoth were before Adam. The dinos died out end of the
Cretaceous Period, 66 million years ago. The Mammoth died out about 18,000
years ago in China, 14,000 yrs ago in Britain, 13,000 yrs ago in Sweden.
and 12,000 years ago in Siberia. That's why their existence were silent in
the Bible.

2 In 1859, Charles Darwin in his book, the Origin of Species estimated
300 million years of Evolution at the very least to reach The Descent of
Man.

3. In about 1880, Lord Kelvin computed based on heat loss from a newly
created Earth, assuming it to be in a total molten state, to present day
temperature. He got 100 million years.

4. Computation based on sea salinity. In 1897, Professor of Geology at
Dublin Trinity College calculated the time it took the sea water to reach
present day salinity from a state of pure water. He got 90 million years.
That was just the age of the ocean,

5. In 1957 Clair Patterson of Caltech University measured the age of the
Earth based on Radioactive Uranium. He concluded with 4.6 billion years.

So 4004 BC as given by Rev Ussher is nothing in comparison and completely
wrong.

I saw an ancient bible at Gimli Icelandic Museum, North of Winnipeg,
(beside Lake Winnipeg) last month with Ussher's date over the first
chapter of Genesis.

Khoon.





Rico
2004-08-26 11:24:17 EST

"Red Dragon" <tskhoon@streamyx.com> wrote in message
news:412df4e9$1_2@news.tm.net.my...
> >1. Where is Eden? In East Africa?
> >No. Eden was in Present Iraq. The Bible said so in Gen. 2-14.
> That's a guess.
> No guess. Gen. 2-14 mentioned the Tigris and Euphrates River.
>
> >3. When was Adam created by God.? What year?
> > Rev. James Ussher, the Irish Bishop and Scholar computed that the
Earth
> >was created on 22 Oct. 4004 BC, based on the Genealogy of Christ as
> >given in the Bible. Adam was created shortly after this. This date by
> >Ussher was printed on the Top Page of Genesis in the Bible until 1900
> when
> >studies showed that it could not be correct, and removed by instruction
of
> >the Church Authority.
> Why can't it be correct?
>

No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
(current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was the
location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood cartography
when he described the location in Genisis.

>
> It cannot be correct because
>
> 1. Dinosaurs and the wooly Mammoth cannot be fitted into any period after
> Adam. Dinos and Mammoth were before Adam. The dinos died out end of
the
> Cretaceous Period, 66 million years ago. The Mammoth died out about
18,000
> years ago in China, 14,000 yrs ago in Britain, 13,000 yrs ago in Sweden.
> and 12,000 years ago in Siberia. That's why their existence were silent
in
> the Bible.

It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard the
ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their wives
were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since the
flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up somewhere
in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.
>
> 2 In 1859, Charles Darwin in his book, the Origin of Species estimated
> 300 million years of Evolution at the very least to reach The Descent of
> Man.
>
> 3. In about 1880, Lord Kelvin computed based on heat loss from a newly
> created Earth, assuming it to be in a total molten state, to present day
> temperature. He got 100 million years.
>
> 4. Computation based on sea salinity. In 1897, Professor of Geology at
> Dublin Trinity College calculated the time it took the sea water to reach
> present day salinity from a state of pure water. He got 90 million years.
> That was just the age of the ocean,
>
> 5. In 1957 Clair Patterson of Caltech University measured the age of the
> Earth based on Radioactive Uranium. He concluded with 4.6 billion years.
>

These computations 'may' be accurate in estimating the age of the earth, but
they do not give an estimate of the first instance of organic life.

> So 4004 BC as given by Rev Ussher is nothing in comparison and completely
> wrong.
>
> I saw an ancient bible at Gimli Icelandic Museum, North of Winnipeg,
> (beside Lake Winnipeg) last month with Ussher's date over the first
> chapter of Genesis.

Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam. (Genisis
1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after all
the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly states
that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth, including
the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.

When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of Genisis
we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis 1:14-19.
Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that we
know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from 1
second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our time.



Red Dragon
2004-08-28 02:42:19 EST
> No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
> 22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
> 21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
> Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
> (current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
> for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was
the
> location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood
cartography
> when he described the location in Genisis.

> It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard the
> ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their
wives
> were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
> juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since
the
> flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
> top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up
somewhere
> in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.
>
> Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
> date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam.
(Genisis
> 1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
> lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after
all
> the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
> fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly
states
> that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth,
including
> the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.
>
> When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
> they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of
Genisis
> we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis
1:14-19.
> Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that
we
> know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
> to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from
1
> second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our
time.

Rev Ussher claimed the Earth, not Adam, was created on 22 Oct 4004 BC.,
based on the Genealogy of Christ as given in the Bible. Of course he was
dead wrong. Eden is located at the confluence of the Tigris and Euphrates
river in present day Iraq as explain in Genesis 2-14. There is zero
possibility Ireland and Oceania being the Garden of Eden because.
1. The Bible meant it to be in present day Iraq.
2. All the characters of the descendants of Adam lived in Iraq and the
region of the Middle East, far from any Ocean. Moses wanted to paint the
picture of how man came about to this world, and gave the fable of two
morons, namely Adam and Eve, as a symbolic emergence of Man into this
world. . The story is full of spiritualism, magic and a biologically
impossible fruit that, gave the eater super intelligence. Similar to Snow
White, who ate the apple and went into a coma.

If baby dino and mammoth were to be in the ark, what happened to them after
the flood? Eaten up by the Lions and Tigers and became extinct?
The Dino and Mammoth from the study of fossils have proven to have lived
far far before Noah and has become extinct. Similarly, the study of
fossils has shown Man to originate from East Africa and eventually
migrated to all parts of the World including the Middle East. They were
the men before Adam.
Also the Ark and the Global Flooding never took place because
1. It would mean we are descendants of the Children of Noah and it is
impossible because people were already living in many parts of the world
far before Noah, with no break in their historical record nor any record of
Global flood. Example, the Egyptians, the Indians and the Chinese.
2. Geology wise, there is zero evidence of any Global Flooding.

The Bible in the museum gave the age of the Earth. Not Adam.
The Bible gave that Life Forms were created only after the creation of the
Sea. So organic life came only after all the Celestial bodies were created
and the Earth and Moon and Land and the Ocean. God said " Let the water
teem with living creatures " and life on earth began.
However, the anomaly is that in the Bible, the Bird came first before all
the land creatures. Evolution principal and fossil finds have determined
that birds came only after reptiles. This is where Moses had blundered.

Of course we cannot take the time in the bible literally. 7 days is not 7
times 24 hrs, but 4.6 billion years. Evidents from Stromatolitic fossils
showed that life forms started 3.5 billion years ago, during the Archean.
Eons.

Regards,
Khoon



















Pastor Dave
2004-08-28 05:30:58 EST
While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
Sat, 28 Aug 2004 14:42:19 +0800, "Red Dragon"
<*n@streamyx.com> screamed out:

>> No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
>> 22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
>> 21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
>> Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
>> (current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
>> for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was
>the
>> location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood
>cartography
>> when he described the location in Genisis.
>
>> It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard the
>> ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their
>wives
>> were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
>> juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since
>the
>> flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
>> top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up
>somewhere
>> in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.
>>
>> Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
>> date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam.
>(Genisis
>> 1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
>> lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after
>all
>> the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
>> fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly
>states
>> that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth,
>including
>> the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.
>>
>> When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
>> they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of
>Genisis
>> we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis
>1:14-19.
>> Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that
>we
>> know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
>> to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from
>1
>> second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our
>time.
>
>Rev Ussher claimed the Earth, not Adam, was created on 22 Oct 4004 BC.,
>based on the Genealogy of Christ as given in the Bible. Of course he was
>dead wrong. Eden is located at the confluence of the Tigris and Euphrates
>river in present day Iraq as explain in Genesis 2-14. There is zero
>possibility Ireland and Oceania being the Garden of Eden because.
>1. The Bible meant it to be in present day Iraq.
>2. All the characters of the descendants of Adam lived in Iraq and the
>region of the Middle East, far from any Ocean. Moses wanted to paint the
>picture of how man came about to this world, and gave the fable of two
>morons, namely Adam and Eve, as a symbolic emergence of Man into this
>world. . The story is full of spiritualism, magic and a biologically
>impossible fruit that, gave the eater super intelligence. Similar to Snow
>White, who ate the apple and went into a coma.
>
>If baby dino and mammoth were to be in the ark, what happened to them after
>the flood? Eaten up by the Lions and Tigers and became extinct?
>The Dino and Mammoth from the study of fossils have proven to have lived
>far far before Noah and has become extinct. Similarly, the study of
>fossils has shown Man to originate from East Africa and eventually
>migrated to all parts of the World including the Middle East. They were
>the men before Adam.
>Also the Ark and the Global Flooding never took place because
>1. It would mean we are descendants of the Children of Noah and it is
>impossible because people were already living in many parts of the world
>far before Noah, with no break in their historical record nor any record of
>Global flood. Example, the Egyptians, the Indians and the Chinese.
>2. Geology wise, there is zero evidence of any Global Flooding.
>
>The Bible in the museum gave the age of the Earth. Not Adam.
>The Bible gave that Life Forms were created only after the creation of the
>Sea. So organic life came only after all the Celestial bodies were created
>and the Earth and Moon and Land and the Ocean. God said " Let the water
>teem with living creatures " and life on earth began.
>However, the anomaly is that in the Bible, the Bird came first before all
>the land creatures. Evolution principal and fossil finds have determined
>that birds came only after reptiles. This is where Moses had blundered.
>
>Of course we cannot take the time in the bible literally. 7 days is not 7
>times 24 hrs, but 4.6 billion years. Evidents from Stromatolitic fossils
>showed that life forms started 3.5 billion years ago, during the Archean.
>Eons.

Now prove it all.



Pastor Dave Raymond

"Were they ashamed when they made an abomination?
They were not at all ashamed, nor did they know
to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall.
At the time I visit them, they shall be cast down,
says Jehovah." - Jeremiah 6:15

"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17

/
o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\


"If the solar system was brought about by an accidental
collision, then the appearance of organic life on this
planet was also an accident and the whole evolution of
man was an accident too. If so, then all our thought
processes are mere accidents - the accidental
by-product of the movement of atoms. And this holds
for the materialists' and astronomers' as well as for
anyone else's. But if their thoughts - i.e., of
materialism and astronomy - are merely accidental
by-products, why should we believe them to be true?
I see no reason for believing that one accident
should be able to give a correct account of all
the other accidents." - C.S. Lewis, God in the Dock



-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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Libertarius
2004-08-28 16:20:13 EST


Pastor Dave wrote:

> While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
> Sat, 28 Aug 2004 14:42:19 +0800, "Red Dragon"
> <tskhoon@streamyx.com> screamed out:
>
> >> No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
> >> 22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
> >> 21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
> >> Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
> >> (current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
> >> for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was
> >the
> >> location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood
> >cartography
> >> when he described the location in Genisis.
> >
> >> It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard the
> >> ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their
> >wives
> >> were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
> >> juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since
> >the
> >> flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
> >> top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up
> >somewhere
> >> in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.
> >>
> >> Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
> >> date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam.
> >(Genisis
> >> 1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
> >> lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after
> >all
> >> the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
> >> fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly
> >states
> >> that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth,
> >including
> >> the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.
> >>
> >> When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
> >> they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of
> >Genisis
> >> we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis
> >1:14-19.
> >> Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that
> >we
> >> know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
> >> to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from
> >1
> >> second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our
> >time.
> >
> >Rev Ussher claimed the Earth, not Adam, was created on 22 Oct 4004 BC.,
> >based on the Genealogy of Christ as given in the Bible. Of course he was
> >dead wrong. Eden is located at the confluence of the Tigris and Euphrates
> >river in present day Iraq as explain in Genesis 2-14. There is zero
> >possibility Ireland and Oceania being the Garden of Eden because.
> >1. The Bible meant it to be in present day Iraq.
> >2. All the characters of the descendants of Adam lived in Iraq and the
> >region of the Middle East, far from any Ocean. Moses wanted to paint the
> >picture of how man came about to this world, and gave the fable of two
> >morons, namely Adam and Eve, as a symbolic emergence of Man into this
> >world. . The story is full of spiritualism, magic and a biologically
> >impossible fruit that, gave the eater super intelligence. Similar to Snow
> >White, who ate the apple and went into a coma.
> >
> >If baby dino and mammoth were to be in the ark, what happened to them after
> >the flood? Eaten up by the Lions and Tigers and became extinct?
> >The Dino and Mammoth from the study of fossils have proven to have lived
> >far far before Noah and has become extinct. Similarly, the study of
> >fossils has shown Man to originate from East Africa and eventually
> >migrated to all parts of the World including the Middle East. They were
> >the men before Adam.
> >Also the Ark and the Global Flooding never took place because
> >1. It would mean we are descendants of the Children of Noah and it is
> >impossible because people were already living in many parts of the world
> >far before Noah, with no break in their historical record nor any record of
> >Global flood. Example, the Egyptians, the Indians and the Chinese.
> >2. Geology wise, there is zero evidence of any Global Flooding.
> >
> >The Bible in the museum gave the age of the Earth. Not Adam.
> >The Bible gave that Life Forms were created only after the creation of the
> >Sea. So organic life came only after all the Celestial bodies were created
> >and the Earth and Moon and Land and the Ocean. God said " Let the water
> >teem with living creatures " and life on earth began.
> >However, the anomaly is that in the Bible, the Bird came first before all
> >the land creatures. Evolution principal and fossil finds have determined
> >that birds came only after reptiles. This is where Moses had blundered.
> >
> >Of course we cannot take the time in the bible literally. 7 days is not 7
> >times 24 hrs, but 4.6 billion years. Evidents from Stromatolitic fossils
> >showed that life forms started 3.5 billion years ago, during the Archean.
> >Eons.
>
> Now prove it all.

===>There's no proof for any of it.
That is why the BIble is meant for credulous fools who want to believe
any fairy tale they wish, some will take them literally and some will claim
it is an allegory. -- L.


Red Dragon
2004-08-28 18:01:57 EST
> > >Of course we cannot take the time in the bible literally. 7 days is
not 7
> > >times 24 hrs, but 4.6 billion years. Evidents from Stromatolitic
fossils
> > >showed that life forms started 3.5 billion years ago, during the
Archean.
> > >Eons.
> >
> > Now prove it all.
>
> ===>There's no proof for any of it.
> That is why the BIble is meant for credulous fools who want to believe
> any fairy tale they wish, some will take them literally and some will
claim
> it is an allegory. -- L.

Precisely.
The Bible is a manual on how to get to heaven for those who believe there is
one. It is full of legends and folk lore. It is not a Science Book. For
those who are interested in the scientific fact, he must refer to a
science book. If you want to know more about the age of the earth and its
history, you need to refer to the Geology Book. If you want to know about
previous and extinct lifeforms, fossils and its interpretation, you need
to go to the Paleontology Book.

In science, nothing and no one is taken for granted. Results are based
on Experiment and Observation. Science is progressive. The Bible is not.

America previously lost to the Russian in the Space Race because of poor
attention to Science. The subject of Evolution was banned in school. There
was generally a fear to tread into fields contradicting the bible. Like
the times of the Inquisition in Europe, where heresy was punished at the
stake.
But since then, attitudes have changed drastically in efforts to race to
the Moon. Now scientific learning is emphasized.

Khoon





Pastor Dave
2004-08-29 11:25:48 EST
While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
Sun, 29 Aug 2004 06:01:57 +0800, "Red Dragon"
<*n@streamyx.com> screamed out:

>> > >Of course we cannot take the time in the bible literally. 7 days is
>not 7
>> > >times 24 hrs, but 4.6 billion years. Evidents from Stromatolitic
>fossils
>> > >showed that life forms started 3.5 billion years ago, during the
>Archean.
>> > >Eons.
>> >
>> > Now prove it all.
>>
>> ===>There's no proof for any of it.
>> That is why the BIble is meant for credulous fools who want to believe
>> any fairy tale they wish, some will take them literally and some will
>claim
>> it is an allegory. -- L.
>
>Precisely.
>The Bible is a manual on how to get to heaven for those who believe there is
>one. It is full of legends and folk lore. It is not a Science Book. For
>those who are interested in the scientific fact, he must refer to a
>science book. If you want to know more about the age of the earth and its
>history, you need to refer to the Geology Book. If you want to know about
>previous and extinct lifeforms, fossils and its interpretation, you need
>to go to the Paleontology Book.
>
>In science, nothing and no one is taken for granted. Results are based
>on Experiment and Observation. Science is progressive. The Bible is not.
>
>America previously lost to the Russian in the Space Race because of poor
>attention to Science. The subject of Evolution was banned in school. There
>was generally a fear to tread into fields contradicting the bible. Like
>the times of the Inquisition in Europe, where heresy was punished at the
>stake.
>But since then, attitudes have changed drastically in efforts to race to
>the Moon. Now scientific learning is emphasized.

I guess that means you can't prove your claims.



Pastor Dave Raymond

"Were they ashamed when they made an abomination?
They were not at all ashamed, nor did they know
to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall.
At the time I visit them, they shall be cast down,
says Jehovah." - Jeremiah 6:15

"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17

/
o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\


"Theology and ethics are inextricably bound together.
Yet under the supposed banner of unity, we have
harbored enemy ships - as long as they flew our flag.
That policy must change. Tolerating enemies of the
historic Christian faith as though they were our
brethren is not love, but adultery. The substance
of the faith is the only basis for unity."
- The Agony of Deceit, p23



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Sheep Defender
2004-09-02 22:01:19 EST
In article <BgnXc.8281$D7.1682@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "Rico"
<*j@bigpond.net.au.au> wrote:

>"Red Dragon" <tskhoon@streamyx.com> wrote in message
>news:412df4e9$1_2@news.tm.net.my...
>> >1. Where is Eden? In East Africa?
>> >No. Eden was in Present Iraq. The Bible said so in Gen. 2-14.
>> That's a guess.
>> No guess. Gen. 2-14 mentioned the Tigris and Euphrates River.
>>
>> >3. When was Adam created by God.? What year?
>> > Rev. James Ussher, the Irish Bishop and Scholar computed that the
>Earth
>> >was created on 22 Oct. 4004 BC, based on the Genealogy of Christ as
>> >given in the Bible. Adam was created shortly after this. This date by
>> >Ussher was printed on the Top Page of Genesis in the Bible until 1900
>> when
>> >studies showed that it could not be correct, and removed by instruction
>of
>> >the Church Authority.
>> Why can't it be correct?
>>
>
>No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
>22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
>21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
>Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
>(current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
>for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was the
>location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood cartography
>when he described the location in Genisis.

If our planet was flooded for a few years the continents wouldn't be
changed very much at all. Where do you get this notion?

>
>>
>> It cannot be correct because
>>
>> 1. Dinosaurs and the wooly Mammoth cannot be fitted into any period after
>> Adam. Dinos and Mammoth were before Adam. The dinos died out end of
>the
>> Cretaceous Period, 66 million years ago. The Mammoth died out about
>18,000
>> years ago in China, 14,000 yrs ago in Britain, 13,000 yrs ago in Sweden.
>> and 12,000 years ago in Siberia. That's why their existence were silent
>in
>> the Bible.
>
>It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard the
>ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their wives
>were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
>juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since the
>flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
>top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up somewhere
>in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.




Why would many large dinosaurs and mammoths would walk up onto a boat? We
should take care not to insult God with our cartoon notions.


>>
>> 2 In 1859, Charles Darwin in his book, the Origin of Species estimated
>> 300 million years of Evolution at the very least to reach The Descent of
>> Man.
>>
>> 3. In about 1880, Lord Kelvin computed based on heat loss from a newly
>> created Earth, assuming it to be in a total molten state, to present day
>> temperature. He got 100 million years.
>>
>> 4. Computation based on sea salinity. In 1897, Professor of Geology at
>> Dublin Trinity College calculated the time it took the sea water to reach
>> present day salinity from a state of pure water. He got 90 million years.
>> That was just the age of the ocean,
>>
>> 5. In 1957 Clair Patterson of Caltech University measured the age of the
>> Earth based on Radioactive Uranium. He concluded with 4.6 billion years.
>>
>
>These computations 'may' be accurate in estimating the age of the earth, but
>they do not give an estimate of the first instance of organic life.



We have 3.9 billion year old organisms dated by the same radiometric methods.


>
>> So 4004 BC as given by Rev Ussher is nothing in comparison and completely
>> wrong.
>>
>> I saw an ancient bible at Gimli Icelandic Museum, North of Winnipeg,
>> (beside Lake Winnipeg) last month with Ussher's date over the first
>> chapter of Genesis.
>
>Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
>date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam. (Genisis
>1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
>lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after all
>the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
>fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly states
>that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth, including
>the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.
>


Our sun and planets are only one third the age of the wider universe. The
age of the stars in our galaxy's nucleus have been statistically measured,
over and over, to be from 11 to 13 billion years old. There's a huge
number of them and they all agree.



>When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
>they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of Genisis
>we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis 1:14-19.
>Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that we
>know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
>to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from 1
>second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our time.


No, it can't be any longer than 14 billion years, according to the
configurations in the cosmic microwave background radiation.

Rico
2004-09-08 12:38:55 EST

"sheep defender" <sdsdsdsdsd@waithingforthelight.com> wrote in message
news:sdsdsdsdsd-0209042001200001@ras01-216-31-89-214.lru-dial.zianet.com...
> In article <BgnXc.8281$D7.1682@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "Rico"
> <hoganrj@bigpond.net.au.au> wrote:
>
> >"Red Dragon" <tskhoon@streamyx.com> wrote in message
> >news:412df4e9$1_2@news.tm.net.my...
> >> >1. Where is Eden? In East Africa?
> >> >No. Eden was in Present Iraq. The Bible said so in Gen. 2-14.
> >> That's a guess.
> >> No guess. Gen. 2-14 mentioned the Tigris and Euphrates River.
> >>
> >> >3. When was Adam created by God.? What year?
> >> > Rev. James Ussher, the Irish Bishop and Scholar computed that the
> >Earth
> >> >was created on 22 Oct. 4004 BC, based on the Genealogy of Christ
as
> >> >given in the Bible. Adam was created shortly after this. This date
by
> >> >Ussher was printed on the Top Page of Genesis in the Bible until
1900
> >> when
> >> >studies showed that it could not be correct, and removed by
instruction
> >of
> >> >the Church Authority.
> >> Why can't it be correct?
> >>
> >
> >No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
> >22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
> >21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
> >Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
> >(current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
> >for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was
the
> >location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood
cartography
> >when he described the location in Genisis.
>
> If our planet was flooded for a few years the continents wouldn't be
> changed very much at all. Where do you get this notion?
>

The bible records the flood as a world wide event. It takes less than two
years to travel from London to Sydney by wind powered ship. (The frist fleet
left England in 1787 and arrived on the east coast of Australia in January
1788). In south western New South Wales the Murray and Darling rivers
converge, (Just as the Tigris and Euprates converge, they divide again
further down stream). The lands of Iran and Iraq are both relatively flat,
so is most of Australia.

> >
> >>
> >> It cannot be correct because
> >>
> >> 1. Dinosaurs and the wooly Mammoth cannot be fitted into any period
after
> >> Adam. Dinos and Mammoth were before Adam. The dinos died out end of
> >the
> >> Cretaceous Period, 66 million years ago. The Mammoth died out about
> >18,000
> >> years ago in China, 14,000 yrs ago in Britain, 13,000 yrs ago in
Sweden.
> >> and 12,000 years ago in Siberia. That's why their existence were
silent
> >in
> >> the Bible.
> >
> >It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard
the
> >ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their
wives
> >were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
> >juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since
the
> >flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
> >top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up
somewhere
> >in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.
>
>
>
>
> Why would many large dinosaurs and mammoths would walk up onto a boat? We
> should take care not to insult God with our cartoon notions.
>

Being unclean animals there would only be two of every spiecies of dinosaur
and mammoth entering the ark, just as there were two of every spiecies of
cat that entered the ark. It is not an insult to God to assume something
which is unkown.


>>
>> 2 In 1859, Charles Darwin in his book, the Origin of Species estimated
>> 300 million years of Evolution at the very least to reach The Descent of
>> Man.
>>
>> 3. In about 1880, Lord Kelvin computed based on heat loss from a newly
>> created Earth, assuming it to be in a total molten state, to present
day
>> temperature. He got 100 million years.
>>
>> 4. Computation based on sea salinity. In 1897, Professor of Geology at
>> Dublin Trinity College calculated the time it took the sea water to reach
>> present day salinity from a state of pure water. He got 90 million
years.
>> That was just the age of the ocean,
>>
>> 5. In 1957 Clair Patterson of Caltech University measured the age of the
>> Earth based on Radioactive Uranium. He concluded with 4.6 billion years.
>>
>
>These computations 'may' be accurate in estimating the age of the earth,
but
>they do not give an estimate of the first instance of organic life.


>We have 3.9 billion year old organisms dated by the same radiometric
methods.

Which has been proven inncorrect on many occasions


>
>> So 4004 BC as given by Rev Ussher is nothing in comparison and completely
>> wrong.
>>
>> I saw an ancient bible at Gimli Icelandic Museum, North of Winnipeg,
>> (beside Lake Winnipeg) last month with Ussher's date over the first
>> chapter of Genesis.
>
>Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
>date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam. (Genisis
>1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
>lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after all
>the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
>fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly
states
>that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth,
including
>the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.
>

>Our sun and planets are only one third the age of the wider universe. The
age of the stars in our galaxy's nucleus have been statistically measured,
over and over, to be from 11 to 13 billion years old. There's a huge
number of them and they all agree.


Did they carbon date the sun and all the other stars? If not then where is
your proof

>When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
>they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of
Genisis
>we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis 1:14-19.
>Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that
we
>know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
>to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from 1
>second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our time.

>No, it can't be any longer than 14 billion years, according to the
configurations in the cosmic microwave background radiation.

Time is irrelevant to God, time is a man made system of counting days.




Sheep Defender
2004-09-08 21:21:05 EST
In article <zAG%c.23940$D7.13509@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "Rico"
<*j@bigpond.net.au.au> wrote:

>"sheep defender" <sdsdsdsdsd@waithingforthelight.com> wrote in message
>news:sdsdsdsdsd-0209042001200001@ras01-216-31-89-214.lru-dial.zianet.com...
>> In article <BgnXc.8281$D7.1682@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "Rico"
>> <hoganrj@bigpond.net.au.au> wrote:
>>
>> >"Red Dragon" <tskhoon@streamyx.com> wrote in message
>> >news:412df4e9$1_2@news.tm.net.my...
>> >> >1. Where is Eden? In East Africa?
>> >> >No. Eden was in Present Iraq. The Bible said so in Gen. 2-14.
>> >> That's a guess.
>> >> No guess. Gen. 2-14 mentioned the Tigris and Euphrates River.
>> >>
>> >> >3. When was Adam created by God.? What year?
>> >> > Rev. James Ussher, the Irish Bishop and Scholar computed that the
>> >Earth
>> >> >was created on 22 Oct. 4004 BC, based on the Genealogy of Christ
>as
>> >> >given in the Bible. Adam was created shortly after this. This date
>by
>> >> >Ussher was printed on the Top Page of Genesis in the Bible until
>1900
>> >> when
>> >> >studies showed that it could not be correct, and removed by
>instruction
>> >of
>> >> >the Church Authority.
>> >> Why can't it be correct?
>> >>
>> >
>> >No one can accurately say that Adam was created on 10/22/4004BC (or
>> >22/10/4004BC). It could easily be said that he (Adam) was created on the
>> >21st of October if the previous stated date were the correct date in
>> >Ireland, as that would have been the date of the antipodes of Ireland
>> >(current counting go forward to get the time there. logically the reverse
>> >for BC counting). It is entirely possible that the area of Oceania was
>the
>> >location of the Garden of Eden since Moses didn't have pre flood
>cartography
>> >when he described the location in Genisis.
>>
>> If our planet was flooded for a few years the continents wouldn't be
>> changed very much at all. Where do you get this notion?
>>
>
>The bible records the flood as a world wide event. It takes less than two
>years to travel from London to Sydney by wind powered ship. (The frist fleet
>left England in 1787 and arrived on the east coast of Australia in January
>1788). In south western New South Wales the Murray and Darling rivers
>converge, (Just as the Tigris and Euprates converge, they divide again
>further down stream). The lands of Iran and Iraq are both relatively flat,
>so is most of Australia.
>
>> >
>> >>
>> >> It cannot be correct because
>> >>
>> >> 1. Dinosaurs and the wooly Mammoth cannot be fitted into any period
>after
>> >> Adam. Dinos and Mammoth were before Adam. The dinos died out end of
>> >the
>> >> Cretaceous Period, 66 million years ago. The Mammoth died out about
>> >18,000
>> >> years ago in China, 14,000 yrs ago in Britain, 13,000 yrs ago in
>Sweden.
>> >> and 12,000 years ago in Siberia. That's why their existence were
>silent
>> >in
>> >> the Bible.
>> >
>> >It's entirely possible that juvenile Dinosaus and Mammoths were aboard
>the
>> >ark, since we are only told that Noah, his wife and his sons and their
>wives
>> >were adults at the time it is logical to suggest that all animals were
>> >juviniles. They were not in the ark for more than 2 years. Also since
>the
>> >flood waters came from above and below the earth, it is possible that the
>> >top layers of sediment on the day before the flood began, ended up
>somewhere
>> >in the middle of the sediment once the waters dried up.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Why would many large dinosaurs and mammoths would walk up onto a boat? We
>> should take care not to insult God with our cartoon notions.
>>
>
>Being unclean animals there would only be two of every spiecies of dinosaur
>and mammoth entering the ark, just as there were two of every spiecies of
>cat that entered the ark. It is not an insult to God to assume something
>which is unkown.

There were over a million species of Dinosauria, not to mention other
contemporaneous reptiles and early mammals. That adds up to many millions
of giant animals on the ark. You should rethink your logistics.

Just pondering such nonsense is like slapping God in the face. Do you
believe that God wants you to remain so unappreciative and irreverent?


>>>
>>> 2 In 1859, Charles Darwin in his book, the Origin of Species estimated
>>> 300 million years of Evolution at the very least to reach The Descent of
>>> Man.
>>>
>>> 3. In about 1880, Lord Kelvin computed based on heat loss from a newly
>>> created Earth, assuming it to be in a total molten state, to present
>day
>>> temperature. He got 100 million years.
>>>
>>> 4. Computation based on sea salinity. In 1897, Professor of Geology at
>>> Dublin Trinity College calculated the time it took the sea water to reach
>>> present day salinity from a state of pure water. He got 90 million
>years.
>>> That was just the age of the ocean,
>>>
>>> 5. In 1957 Clair Patterson of Caltech University measured the age of the
>>> Earth based on Radioactive Uranium. He concluded with 4.6 billion years.
>>>
>>
>>These computations 'may' be accurate in estimating the age of the earth,
>but
>>they do not give an estimate of the first instance of organic life.
>
>
>>We have 3.9 billion year old organisms dated by the same radiometric
>methods.
>
>Which has been proven inncorrect on many occasions

Cite just one "occasion" or quit lying about God's creation. It's very
dangerous because it will poison your relationship with Him.


>>
>>> So 4004 BC as given by Rev Ussher is nothing in comparison and completely
>>> wrong.
>>>
>>> I saw an ancient bible at Gimli Icelandic Museum, North of Winnipeg,
>>> (beside Lake Winnipeg) last month with Ussher's date over the first
>>> chapter of Genesis.
>>
>>Just to clarify, did the ancient bible that you saw in the museum give the
>>date of the age of the earth or the date of the creation of Adam. (Genisis
>>1:1 In the begining when God created the universe). Were the organic
>>lifeforms on earth created during the creation of the universe or after all
>>the planets were created (verses 14-19 say the stars were created on the
>>fourth day). When was the universe itself created, the bible clearly
>states
>>that the creation of the universe and the organic things on earth,
>including
>>the creation of stars and earths moon, were two different creation events.
>>
>
>> Our sun and planets are only one third the age of the wider universe. The
>> age of the stars in our galaxy's nucleus have been statistically measured,
>> over and over, to be from 11 to 13 billion years old. There's a huge
>> number of them and they all agree.
>
>
>Did they carbon date the sun and all the other stars? If not then where is
>your proof

Have you surveyed any of the evidence described in natural science books?
It's all available from recent discoveries, with causes and effects
explained.

>>When you read accounts of how Jews calculate the begining and end of a day
>>they (the accounts) all say from sun set to sun set. In the book of
>Genisis
>>we read that the sun was not created until the fourth day, Genisis 1:14-19.
>>Owing to the fact that we know the sun sets once every 24 hours, and that
>we
>>know the sun was not created until the fourth day, it is entirely possible
>>to assume that the first three days (in Gods time) could be anything from 1
>>second to 4,230,243,743,085,085,432,098,503,458,045,823+ years in our time.
>
>>No, it can't be any longer than 14 billion years, according to the
>>configurations in the cosmic microwave background radiation.
>
>Time is irrelevant to God, time is a man made system of counting days.

Beware that you don't become irrelevant to God. Your willful ignorance
certainly tries my patience.

God cares about your heart, not your silly little ego stories from a
primitive tradition you've become so fond of. Pray to God for the energy
to learn about some of the true complexity of His creation.

Defender
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