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 Pastor Dave 2004-08-02 12:25:43 EST http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/2nd.html Matthew 24, commonly known as "the Olivet discourse", is our Lord's prophecies regarding His so-called "second coming". Verse 3 is the most important verse in this whole chapter, because the entirety of Matthew 24 is in response to this specific question asked in verse 3 by the apostles. If you don't understand their question, you will never understand Jesus' answer. We must be sure we understand the question first. Pastor Dave Raymond "Were they ashamed when they made an abomination? They were not at all ashamed, nor did they know to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall. At the time I visit them, they shall be cast down, says Jehovah." - Jeremiah 6:15 "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17 / o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::> \ Christians are the light of the world, but the switch has to be turned on. -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----

 Pastor Dave 2004-08-02 16:37:03 EST While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on Mon, 2 Aug 2004 15:01:42 -0400, "Melchizedek" <*k@as-if.com> screamed out: > >"Pastor Dave" wrote in message news:q4qsg0l3od2mi6t28o3msuog7laiie2hlc@4ax.com... >> >> >> http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/2nd.html >> >> Matthew 24, commonly known as "the Olivet discourse", >> is our Lord's prophecies regarding His so-called >> "second coming". Verse 3 is the most important verse >> in this whole chapter, because the entirety of Matthew >> 24 is in response to this specific question asked in >> verse 3 by the apostles. If you don't understand their >> question, you will never understand Jesus' answer. We >> must be sure we understand the question first. >> > How true, but Your opinion is flawed..... :-D. It isn't MY opinion. :) I didn't write it. > Thy Kingdom Come >by Dr. Chuck Missler > > ftp://\in:out@65.127.169.45/=DRIVE=bibleweb-drive/=CD-R=thy-kingdom-come/index-web.html > >But in the last days it shall come to pass, Hebrews 1:1-2 1) God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, 2) Hath IN THESE LAST DAYS spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Now when was that written? Pastor Dave Raymond "Were they ashamed when they made an abomination? They were not at all ashamed, nor did they know to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall. At the time I visit them, they shall be cast down, says Jehovah." - Jeremiah 6:15 "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17 / o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::> \ The church does not determine what Scripture teaches; Scripture determines what the church teaches. If a tradition or experience is contrary to the teachings of Scripture, it is not of the Lord. Reason is a significant authority. But it too, must be placed under the dominion of Scripture. In other words, we cannot seek Biblical truths, while questioning the authority of the Bible. -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----

 Oldwetdog 2004-08-03 14:20:21 EST Pastor Dave wrote: > > http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/2nd.html > > Matthew 24, commonly known as "the Olivet discourse", > is our Lord's prophecies regarding His so-called > "second coming". Verse 3 is the most important verse > in this whole chapter, because the entirety of Matthew > 24 is in response to this specific question asked in > verse 3 by the apostles. If you don't understand their > question, you will never understand Jesus' answer. We > must be sure we understand the question first. > > Mat. 24:3. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? FIRST: There are three parts to the apostles question, or Three questions: a, When shall these things be? b, what shall be the sign of thy coming? c, (what shall be the sign) of the end of the world? Prior to this verse, He had described some events. What were those events? and did those events have anything to do with 'the end of the world'? or did at least one of those described events have something to do with the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70? If the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70 did not have anything to do with the end of the world, then your assertion, above, is in error, OR we need to locate His description of that event. Since the end of the world *and* the destruction of Jerusalem did not occur in the lifetime of *that* generation, then some of them must still be alive. 33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Next, in verse 33, "it" could mean the destruction of Jerusalem, or "these things" could mean the end of this world, but since both those events did not occur in the lifetime of His/their generation, "it" could not be both. And next, in verse 34, He said "all these things...." there is no rational/Truthful way to eliminate some of these named events from the term "all" *unless* He was describing two sets of events. The first set of events was the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, and the second set of events is "His coming and the end of the world." In this case (two sets of events) the term "all" must include all the events He described as "end-time" events, and all those events *must* occur in the lifetime of ONE generation. Any student of scripture who loves Truth will compare the description of the Olivette Discourse as given by both Matthew and Luke, and compare the significant difference between them. Do they, Matthew and Luke, describe two sets of events? Otherwise, as preterist do, just ignore the Truth by distorting the meaning of the term "generation" and ignoring the TWO sets of events described by Luke and Matthew. Preterist doctrine is a lie of Satan. owd There is a study of end-time events available, free, at: http://www.xprt.net/~servitum/ -- +-<[:-)>>>- oldwetdog

 Pastor Dave 2004-08-04 07:53:39 EST While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on Tue, 03 Aug 2004 11:20:21 -0700, oldwetdog screamed out: >Pastor Dave wrote: > >> >> http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/2nd.html >> >> Matthew 24, commonly known as "the Olivet discourse", >> is our Lord's prophecies regarding His so-called >> "second coming". Verse 3 is the most important verse >> in this whole chapter, because the entirety of Matthew >> 24 is in response to this specific question asked in >> verse 3 by the apostles. If you don't understand their >> question, you will never understand Jesus' answer. We >> must be sure we understand the question first. >> >> > >Mat. 24:3. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came >unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and >what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? > >FIRST: There are three parts to the apostles question, or Three questions: >a, When shall these things be? >b, what shall be the sign of thy coming? >c, (what shall be the sign) of the end of the world? > >Prior to this verse, He had described some events. What were those >events? and did those events have anything to do with 'the end of the >world'? or did at least one of those described events have something to >do with the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70? > >If the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70 did not have anything to do >with the end of the world, then your assertion, above, is in error, OR >we need to locate His description of that event. > >Since the end of the world *and* the destruction of Jerusalem did not >occur in the lifetime of *that* generation, then some of them must still >be alive. This is a common tactic in the end timers argument, but it doesn't hold water, because it's not based on what Jesus said, but rather, what an incorrect English translation says. See below. >33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is >near, even at the doors. >34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all >these things be fulfilled. > >Next, in verse 33, "it" could mean the destruction of Jerusalem, or >"these things" could mean the end of this world, but since both those >events did not occur in the lifetime of His/their generation, "it" could >not be both. > >And next, in verse 34, He said "all these things...." there is no >rational/Truthful way to eliminate some of these named events from the >term "all" *unless* He was describing two sets of events. The first set >of events was the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, and the second set >of events is "His coming and the end of the world." In this case (two >sets of events) the term "all" must include all the events He described >as "end-time" events, and all those events *must* occur in the lifetime >of ONE generation. > >Any student of scripture who loves Truth will compare the description of >the Olivette Discourse as given by both Matthew and Luke, and compare >the significant difference between them. Do they, Matthew and Luke, >describe two sets of events? > >Otherwise, as preterist do, just ignore the Truth by distorting the >meaning of the term "generation" and ignoring the TWO sets of events >described by Luke and Matthew. > > >Preterist doctrine is a lie of Satan. That's an interesting claim, but one you're not able to prove. The word Jesus used, should not be translated, "world". That would be the Greek word, "kosmos" and it isn't found there, in the original Greek. The word there is, "aion", which means, "an age". The verse actually reads... "And when he is sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples came near to him by himself, saying, Tell us, when shall these be? and what is the sign of thy presence, and of the full END OF THE AGE?" - Matthew 24:3 [YLT] "And as He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, Tell us, when will these things be? And, What is the sign of Your coming and of the END OF THE AGE?" - Matthew 24:3 [LITV] "As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will this be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the CLOSE OF THE AGE?"" - Matthew 24:3 [RSV] "Then as He is sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached Him privately, saying, "Tell us when these [things] will be? And what [is] the sign of Your Arrival and of the CONCLUSION OF THE AGE?"" - Matthew 24:3 [ALT] "And as he was sitting upon the mount of Olives the disciples came to him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be, and what is the sign of thy coming and the COMPLETION OF THE AGE?" - Matthew 24:3 [Darby] "Afterwards He was on the Mount of Olives and was seated there when the disciples came to Him, apart from the others, and said, "Tell us when this will be; and what will be the sign of your Coming and of the CLOSE OF THE AGE?"" - Matthew 24:3 [WNT] "And as He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will this be, and what will be the sign of your coming, and of the CONSUMMATION OF THE AGE?"" - Matthew 24:3 [MRC] Pastor Dave Raymond "Were they ashamed when they made an abomination? They were not at all ashamed, nor did they know to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall. At the time I visit them, they shall be cast down, says Jehovah." - Jeremiah 6:15 "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17 / o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::> \ "Species that were once thought to have turned into others have been found to overlap in time with these alleged descendants. In fact, the fossil record does not convincingly document a single transition from one species to another." (Stanley, S.M., The New Evolutionary Timetable: Fossils, Genes, and the Origin of Species, 1981, p. 95) -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----