Bible Discussion: Passover Is NOT Called Easter

Passover Is NOT Called Easter
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Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 00:14:42 EST

"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
| >The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
| >*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
process,
|
| The Passover is one day, not a week.
|


Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
when the AV which contains the error, proves you wrong? And
why have you not yet responded to that little word
"INTENDED" (which is enough to prove you in error, let alone
the grammar and all the other scriptures).

The Celebration Festival is 8 days long, and has been shown
so for centuries... The Passover starts on the 14th of the
month, and the other part of it starts on on the 15th, the
feast of unleavened bread starts (#Le 23:5-6).... ...into
the the last 7 days of the Passover is for the unleavened
bread feast, and I have already expressed to you that, while
it does have it's on name at times, it is a major part of
the Passover. All 8 days is classified as Passover to Jews,
however, "...between the evenings (PLURAL) is the Passover
to Jehovah" (#Le 23:6 c)...

I been with Hebrew since the late 1970's, and have been
educated from Jews as well, it is their festival, and their
long history... we simply should not be rewriting the Bible,
or a culture's history; OH, first let mention that I am
trying to format scripture references for OLB User Notes and
Topics modules.

Passover was the name given to the chief of the three great
historical annual festivals of the Jews. It was kept in
remembrance of the Lord's passing over the houses of the
Israelites #Ex 12:13 when the first born of all the
Egyptians were destroyed. (you seem to have got this far,
what, only to leap over all the rest up to #Ac 12:4 ? As I
said, As I said before, it is ALSO called the "feast of
unleavened bread" #Ex 23:15 Mr 14:1 Ac 12:3 because during
its celebration no leavened bread was to be eaten or even
kept in the household #Ex 12:15 (you need to go forward
BEYOND #Ex 12$! - the mode changes, like in others things in
life, and in the past) And I have already quoted you only
one verse of many, #Mt 26:17).... The word afterwards came
to denote the lamb that was slain at the feast
#Mr 14:12-14
#1Co 5:7

#Mr 14:12 ¶ And the first day of unleavened bread, when they
killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt
thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the
passover? {killed: or, sacrificed} (see
#Mr 14:13-15 in your
AV Bible) ...

#Mr 14:16 And his disciples went forth, and came into the
city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made
ready the passover.

Please note of how unleavened bread is mentioned BEFORE
Passover!, (just like you have already been written
Saturday and shown only one simple verse, which was all that
is needed, #Mt 26:17), and note how Passover is mentioned
in the SAME verse AFTER unleavened bread, TWICE! And a THIRD
time in the last...

...not to mention, it points out at the same time, that it
is the FIRST day of unleavened bread, which is also refered
to as the Passover in the 1st AND last verse - The first
verse, again, "Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that
thou mayest eat the passover?",

the last verse (#Mr 14:16) with the question (THREE verse
later.):

"and they made ready the PASSOVER." (EMPHASIS MINE).. AFTER
the 1st Day of unleavened bread! And there is MUCH more
where this comes from, your AV Bible - and I haven't even
begun yet, and very well shock your senses....I shall pop
your bubble first... hehehe :-}

AGAIN, can you type the word INTEND, and what about the
***IMPERFECT TENSE *** (not a PAST TENSE) usages in #
Ac 12:3 ?

WHERE is your PAST TENSE which you claim "... the
unleavened bread and/or passover was overwith (no pun
intended [your words]) ? Why can't you find the PAST TENSE?


Be back after slim fast :-)







Steve Hayes
2004-07-19 04:35:57 EST
On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
<clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> wrote:

>
>"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
>message news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
>| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
>| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
>| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
>|
>|
>| >The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
>| >*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
>process,
>|
>| The Passover is one day, not a week.
>|
>
>
>Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
>when the AV which contains the error, proves you wrong? And
>why have you not yet responded to that little word
>"INTENDED" (which is enough to prove you in error, let alone
>the grammar and all the other scriptures).

The English chose to call Pascha "Easter", so it was anmd is called that in
English.

You might not like it, but that's the way it is.



--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Pastor Dave
2004-07-19 09:49:38 EST
While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
<clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:


>"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
>message news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
>| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
>| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
>| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
>|
>|
>| >The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
>| >*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
>process,
>|
>| The Passover is one day, not a week.
>|
>
>
>Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,

Why do you keep changing the subject, when it is
pointed out to you that the Passover was one day?


>The Celebration Festival is 8 days long, and has been shown
>so for centuries... The Passover starts on the 14th of the
>month, and the other part of it starts on on the 15th, the
>feast of unleavened bread starts (#Le 23:5-6)....

"the other part of it"? I'm sorry, that isn't very
scholarly. Read Exodus 11 & 12. The Passover was ONE
NIGHT. You can play all of the hocus pocus games you
want with the text, it's not going to change that.


>...into
>the the last 7 days of the Passover is for the unleavened
>bread feast, and I have already expressed to you that, while
>it does have it's on name at times, it is a major part of
>the Passover. All 8 days is classified as Passover to Jews,
>however, "...between the evenings (PLURAL) is the Passover
>to Jehovah" (#Le 23:6 c)...

I don't care what some Jews may call it. I ONLY care
what the Bible says. I think God knows what He wanted.
Just because there are Jews that CALL IT the Passover
Week, that does not MAKE IT the Passover Week. The
week is the Feast of Unleavened Bread, which FOLLOWS
the Passover, which is one night. Unless you're trying
to say that God "passed over" Egypt for a whole week?

The Passover lamb was eaten on Passover and none of it
was to be left until morning. Why? Because the night
before was Passover and the lamb must be eaten on THAT
night, which was PASSOVER night.

Note Exodus 12:14... "You must celebrate THIS DAY as a
religious festival to remind you of what I, the LORD,
have done. Celebrate it for all time to come."

Now note Exodus 12:15, where God starts talking about
the week that follows... "The LORD said, "For seven
days you must not eat any bread made with yeast---eat
only unleavened bread. On the first day you are to get
rid of all the yeast in your houses, for if anyone
during those seven days eats bread made with yeast, he
shall no longer be considered one of my people."

The first night is the Passover, the next week is the
Feast of Unleavened Bread. LOOK AT EXODUS 12!


>I been with Hebrew since the late 1970's, and have been
>educated from Jews as well, it is their festival, and their
>long history... we simply should not be rewriting the Bible,
>or a culture's history; OH, first let mention that I am
>trying to format scripture references for OLB User Notes and
>Topics modules.
>
>Passover was the name given to the chief of the three great
>historical annual festivals of the Jews. It was kept in
>remembrance of the Lord's passing over the houses of the
>Israelites #Ex 12:13 when the first born of all the
>Egyptians were destroyed. (you seem to have got this far,
>what, only to leap over all the rest up to #Ac 12:4 ? As I
>said, As I said before, it is ALSO called the "feast of
>unleavened bread" #Ex 23:15 Mr 14:1 Ac 12:3

According to Exodus 12:7, that's what the week is. And
Exodus 23:15 and Leviticus 23:6 and many other
references.

Look at the following. This states it VERY CLEARLY.

Leviticus 23:5-6

5) In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is
the LORD'S passover.
6) And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the
feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye
must eat unleavened bread.

Now there it is. The 14th day at even, is the
Passover. Starting on the 15th day, is the Feast of
Unleavened Bread. It doesn't matter what Jews today
call it. That is irrelevant to the word of God. Many
Jews also claimed Jesus wasn't the Messiah and many
still do. Shall we take their word for that too?


>#Mr 14:12 ¶ And the first day of unleavened bread, when they
>killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt
>thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the
>passover? {killed: or, sacrificed} (see
>#Mr 14:13-15 in your
>AV Bible) ...

That is because the entire festival could be called
Unleavened Bread, as I have said repeatedly, because
unleavened bread was prepared and eaten on the eve of
the Passover.

"In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month
at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one
and twentieth day of the month at even." - Exodus 12:18

As I said, the entire feast was the Feast of Unleavened
Bread. The first night was the Passover. While they
ate unleavened bread throughout the whole celebration,
they did not eat the Passover throughout the whole
celebration. That had to be eaten that first night and
none could be left until morning.


>WHERE is your PAST TENSE which you claim "... the
>unleavened bread and/or passover was overwith (no pun
>intended [your words]) ? Why can't you find the PAST TENSE?

You are misrepresenting my words. I did not say that
the Feast of Unleavened Bread was over with. I have
said very clearly, that the Passover was over. That
only lasted one night. The Feast of Unleavened Bread
was still in progress and he would not be waiting for
that which had passed, to pass.



± Pastor Dave Raymond ±

"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16

"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17

/
o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\


"If life had evolved into its wondrous profusion of
creatures little by little, Dr. Eldredge argues, then
one would expect to find fossils of transitional
creatures which were a bit like what went before them
and a bit like what came after. But no one has yet
found any evidence of such transitional creatures.
This oddity has been attributed to gaps in the fossil
record which gradualists expected to fill when rock
strata of the proper age had been found. In the last
decade, however, geologists have found rock layers of
all divisions of the last 500 million years and no
transitional forms were contained in them." (The
Guardian Weekly, 26 Nov 1978, vol 119, no 22, p. 1)



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Pastor Dave
2004-07-19 09:50:55 EST
While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
Mon, 19 Jul 2004 08:35:57 GMT, hayesmstw@hotmail.com
(Steve Hayes) screamed out:

>On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
><clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
>>message news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
>>| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
>>| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
>>| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
>>|
>>|
>>| >The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
>>| >*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
>>process,
>>|
>>| The Passover is one day, not a week.
>>|
>>
>>
>>Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
>>when the AV which contains the error, proves you wrong? And
>>why have you not yet responded to that little word
>>"INTENDED" (which is enough to prove you in error, let alone
>>the grammar and all the other scriptures).
>
>The English chose to call Pascha "Easter", so it was anmd is called that in
>English.
>
>You might not like it, but that's the way it is.

He doesn't seem to realize, Tyndale coined the word
"Passover" and he chose not to translate it as such in
that verse, for a reason. He obviously knew what God's
word said about this festival of unleavened bread.



± Pastor Dave Raymond ±

"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16

"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17

/
o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\


Patience is a virtue which carries a lot of wait.



-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 16:23:33 EST

"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:kvinf018afuc0uidbf81ffasghhab27j6s@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
:"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com| wrote in
:message
:| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
:| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
:| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net| screamed out:
:|
:|
::The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
::*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
process,
:|
:| The Passover is one day, not a week.
:|
:
:Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
|
| Why do you keep changing the subject, when it is
| pointed out to you that the Passover was one day?
|


I have made it quite clear and provide abundant
scriptural support that the Passover is CELEBRATED 8
Days. If you are refering to the actual angel/spirit of
death through Egypt, that was less the one day... more
like a third or fourth, or half at the most.


:The Celebration Festival is 8 days long, and has been
:so for centuries... The Passover starts on the 14th of
:month, and the other part of it starts on on the 15th,
:feast of unleavened bread starts (#Le 23:5-6)....
|
| "the other part of it"? I'm sorry, that isn't very
| scholarly. Read Exodus 11 & 12. The Passover was ONE
| NIGHT. You can play all of the hocus pocus games you
| want with the text, it's not going to change that.
|
|
:...into the the last 7 days of the Passover is for
:the unleavened bread feast, and I have already
:expressed to you that, it does have it's on name
:at times, it is a major part of the Passover. All
:8 days is classified as Passover to however,
:"...between the evenings (PLURAL) is the Passover
:to Jehovah" (#Le 23:6 c)...
|
| I don't care what some Jews may call it.

Obviously so, since you wish to ignore their history
(not yours)... WHOM were they, that were rescued from
400 YEARS of slavery? WHOM were they that suffered hard
labors, and the whips striping them? And what result
(plague) was it that triggered Pharoah to FINALLY let
YHWH's people go? Did you suffer this fate of hard and
difficult slavery for so many years? Dear friend(s),
how could it be of any surprise that the last plague of
when the spirit of death passed over the Egyptians in
one night, and since that was the final straw for
Pharoah, beyond just one day? For other little things,
even of joy, have often been for a period of time
beyond (and even around) the one date that initiated
it... I celebrated my birthday for 2 or 3 days, even
though the date of birth itself is just that one date,
June 1. Even Exodus 12 (at least in the Masoretic)
proves the celebration extended beyond one day, and the
following scriptures (some of which I already quoted)
over the centuries confirm it as well.

Now, my dear friend, I see what you say, and confess to
putting my hands on my waist, but not in bullying, or
in hostility, or anger, but in and with curiousity, and
the same is with I hold my hands out in wonder, and the
scratching of my head... so think not, of this wonder
as illfully, or being illful to you... I do not
understand why you claim what you do, then reflect
seemingly different... let it go... let it go...

Be back shortly... with the rest.



Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 16:36:59 EST


"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:kvinf018afuc0uidbf81ffasghhab27j6s@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
:"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com| wrote in
:message
:| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
:| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
:| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net| screamed out:
:|
:|
::The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
::*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
process,
:|
:| The Passover is one day, not a week.
:|
:
:Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
|

| I ONLY care what the Bible says.

Even though I yet to see that, and you have so far seem to
prove otherwise, (which is subject to change I hope), it is
great to hear... and now let's see if what you say is true
at this stage: go back and read the flood of scriptures
(from the Holy Bible, in your own AV translation), I have
already quoted you - or do you want even more? But at this
point, why bother quoting more?

#1) I have yet to see you answer to ANY of those scriptures
(to beat it all, the very words of Jesus Christ(!),
which are in your own AV Bible, which you claim you
ONLY care what the Bible says... hello? Your REMOVES
those scriptures.


#2) or the word "INTENDED",


#3) or to come up with some explicit
PAST TENSE for KOINE Greek.


Can you reply to any of these 3? Can you stop ducking
from even one of them? Oh, my dear friend, to think
that you could actually reply to one of the three here,
a glimmering spark to come forth out of my eye upon the
computer monitor... to think you could reply to two of
them, a beam of light could shine forth out of my eye,
to think that you could reply to all 3, oh such a
glistening that could scintillate from my eye...

And I add another, when (if ever) you capture the
strength to do them all 3... show me ANY passage in the
COMPLETE Bible, where passover and it's days of
unleavened bread are not together within the same
paragraph(s) and context - Hello?

It is one thing to try and justify a mistranslation,
but it is another thing to remove words from the bible,
(e.g. Boulomenus [1014]) and change others, which
basically is REMOVING one word (ehsan) and ADDING
another (ehtan[?]) - Not to mention, in doing so
grammatically damages to rest of the context...

Is Deuteronomy 4:2 still in your Bible? Think you might
leap up from Exodus 12 to it? To know the Torah is to
know ALL of it.


| I think God knows what He wanted.

I know what God wanted, I have read it, and I have
presented you with a handful of scriptures, and I have
already quoted a part of #Le 23:6 (part c). You have
the Literal Translation Of The Bible, (LITV), and you
can compare it with the Masoretic (which was a main
them with Green that his translations could be weighed
with the originals it purports to translate, and even
encouraged... "...between the evenings is the Passover
to Jehovah" - it is ONLY to YHWH that is the Passover
is between the evenings... the joy of being freed from
slavery, it is an 8 day CELEBRATION (the first 2 days
have a custom with the Passover (which I have already
pointed out), thus, you cannot seperate the unleavened
bread feast and The Passover for the Jews, or Bibically
either... and why would YHWH deem it necessary to let
them know in the Torah (HIS Law), that to HIM the
Passover is between the evenings if it were not
otherwise to the Jews? That makes no sense from your
views, but YHWH was not rescued from slavery, and what
do you think YHWH thinks, or might think, that you must
think about Him pointing this out in the Torah? That He
was just being redundant or not all wise knowing and
intellecual, etc.?

Break Time again...




"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:kvinf018afuc0uidbf81ffasghhab27j6s@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
| >"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
| >message
news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
| >| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| >| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| >| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
| >|
| >|
| >| >The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT
TENSE,
| >| >*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
| >process,
| >|
| >| The Passover is one day, not a week.
| >|
| >
| >
| >Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
|
| Why do you keep changing the subject, when it is
| pointed out to you that the Passover was one day?
|
|
| >The Celebration Festival is 8 days long, and has been
shown
| >so for centuries... The Passover starts on the 14th of
the
| >month, and the other part of it starts on on the 15th,
the
| >feast of unleavened bread starts (#Le 23:5-6)....
|
| "the other part of it"? I'm sorry, that isn't very
| scholarly. Read Exodus 11 & 12. The Passover was ONE
| NIGHT. You can play all of the hocus pocus games you
| want with the text, it's not going to change that.
|
|
| >...into
| >the the last 7 days of the Passover is for the unleavened
| >bread feast, and I have already expressed to you that,
while
| >it does have it's on name at times, it is a major part of
| >the Passover. All 8 days is classified as Passover to
Jews,
| >however, "...between the evenings (PLURAL) is the
Passover
| >to Jehovah" (#Le 23:6 c)...
|
| I don't care what some Jews may call it. I ONLY care
| what the Bible says. I think God knows what He wanted.
| Just because there are Jews that CALL IT the Passover
| Week, that does not MAKE IT the Passover Week. The
| week is the Feast of Unleavened Bread, which FOLLOWS
| the Passover, which is one night. Unless you're trying
| to say that God "passed over" Egypt for a whole week?
|
| The Passover lamb was eaten on Passover and none of it
| was to be left until morning. Why? Because the night
| before was Passover and the lamb must be eaten on THAT
| night, which was PASSOVER night.
|
| Note Exodus 12:14... "You must celebrate THIS DAY as a
| religious festival to remind you of what I, the LORD,
| have done. Celebrate it for all time to come."
|
| Now note Exodus 12:15, where God starts talking about
| the week that follows... "The LORD said, "For seven
| days you must not eat any bread made with yeast---eat
| only unleavened bread. On the first day you are to get
| rid of all the yeast in your houses, for if anyone
| during those seven days eats bread made with yeast, he
| shall no longer be considered one of my people."
|
| The first night is the Passover, the next week is the
| Feast of Unleavened Bread. LOOK AT EXODUS 12!
|
|
| >I been with Hebrew since the late 1970's, and have been
| >educated from Jews as well, it is their festival, and
their
| >long history... we simply should not be rewriting the
Bible,
| >or a culture's history; OH, first let mention that I am
| >trying to format scripture references for OLB User Notes
and
| >Topics modules.
| >
| >Passover was the name given to the chief of the three
great
| >historical annual festivals of the Jews. It was kept in
| >remembrance of the Lord's passing over the houses of the
| >Israelites #Ex 12:13 when the first born of all the
| >Egyptians were destroyed. (you seem to have got this far,
| >what, only to leap over all the rest up to #Ac 12:4 ? As
I
| >said, As I said before, it is ALSO called the "feast of
| >unleavened bread" #Ex 23:15 Mr 14:1 Ac 12:3
|
| According to Exodus 12:7, that's what the week is. And
| Exodus 23:15 and Leviticus 23:6 and many other
| references.
|
| Look at the following. This states it VERY CLEARLY.
|
| Leviticus 23:5-6
|
| 5) In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is
| the LORD'S passover.
| 6) And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the
| feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye
| must eat unleavened bread.
|
| Now there it is. The 14th day at even, is the
| Passover. Starting on the 15th day, is the Feast of
| Unleavened Bread. It doesn't matter what Jews today
| call it. That is irrelevant to the word of God. Many
| Jews also claimed Jesus wasn't the Messiah and many
| still do. Shall we take their word for that too?
|
|
| >#Mr 14:12 ¶ And the first day of unleavened bread, when
they
| >killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where
wilt
| >thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the
| >passover? {killed: or, sacrificed} (see
| >#Mr 14:13-15 in your
| >AV Bible) ...
|
| That is because the entire festival could be called
| Unleavened Bread, as I have said repeatedly, because
| unleavened bread was prepared and eaten on the eve of
| the Passover.
|
| "In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month
| at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one
| and twentieth day of the month at even." - Exodus 12:18
|
| As I said, the entire feast was the Feast of Unleavened
| Bread. The first night was the Passover. While they
| ate unleavened bread throughout the whole celebration,
| they did not eat the Passover throughout the whole
| celebration. That had to be eaten that first night and
| none could be left until morning.
|
|
| >WHERE is your PAST TENSE which you claim "... the
| >unleavened bread and/or passover was overwith (no pun
| >intended [your words]) ? Why can't you find the PAST
TENSE?
|
| You are misrepresenting my words. I did not say that
| the Feast of Unleavened Bread was over with. I have
| said very clearly, that the Passover was over. That
| only lasted one night. The Feast of Unleavened Bread
| was still in progress and he would not be waiting for
| that which had passed, to pass.
|
|
| --
|
| ± Pastor Dave Raymond ±
|
| "As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
| to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
| thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
| before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
|
| "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
| the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17
|
| /
| o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
| \
|
|
| "If life had evolved into its wondrous profusion of
| creatures little by little, Dr. Eldredge argues, then
| one would expect to find fossils of transitional
| creatures which were a bit like what went before them
| and a bit like what came after. But no one has yet
| found any evidence of such transitional creatures.
| This oddity has been attributed to gaps in the fossil
| record which gradualists expected to fill when rock
| strata of the proper age had been found. In the last
| decade, however, geologists have found rock layers of
| all divisions of the last 500 million years and no
| transitional forms were contained in them." (The
| Guardian Weekly, 26 Nov 1978, vol 119, no 22, p. 1)
|
|
|
| -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News
=-----
| http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the
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| -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers!
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Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 17:17:02 EST

"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:kvinf018afuc0uidbf81ffasghhab27j6s@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
:"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com| wrote in
:message
:| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
:| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
:| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net| screamed out:
:|
:|
::The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
::*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
process,
:|
:| The Passover is one day, not a week.
:|
:
:Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
|


| Just because there are Jews that CALL IT the Passover
| Week, that does not MAKE IT the Passover Week. The

"Passover WEEK" ??? You alter scripture and the words
of others.. you share some commonalities with those
involved in false teachings, like Kenyonism, The
666/616/Beast(s) Magicians, Individual Cults (as that
which was in Waco, etc.). I Have a SEARCH feature to
search all of my posts, and there is no such post!!!
You want to try to justify a mistranslation by
rewriting scriptures, and rewriting the posts too, eh?
And does not bother you, in the least? I clearly emphasized
that:

The * __C E L E B R A T I O N__ of The Passover is 8 Days
*

Does to help as to what I have said? And that
CELEBRATION is refered to as such, In Acts, and many
other scriptures.

| week is the Feast of Unleavened Bread, which FOLLOWS
| the Passover, which is one night. Unless you're trying
| to say that God "passed over" Egypt for a whole week?
| The Passover lamb was eaten on Passover and none of it
| was to be left until morning. Why? Because the night
|

The lamb of the first day of the "Passover
CELEBRATION", this is also something special about the
first two days of the Passover CELEBRATION of The
Jews... something about dishes...

| before was Passover and the lamb must be eaten on THAT
| night, which was PASSOVER night

The Passover Of The Jews is an 8 day CELEBRATION, 1 day
of that, two days of this, and 7 days of that, and hard
to tell what else in the 8 days.

|
| Note Exodus 12:14... "You must celebrate THIS DAY as a
| religious festival to remind you of what I, the LORD,
| have done. Celebrate it for all time to come."
|
| Now note Exodus 12:15, where God starts talking about
| the week that follows... "The LORD said, "For seven
| days you must not eat any bread made with yeast---eat
| only unleavened bread. On the first day you are to get
| rid of all the yeast in your houses, for if anyone
| during those seven days eats bread made with yeast, he
| shall no longer be considered one of my people."
|
| The first night is the Passover, the next week is the
| Feast of Unleavened Bread. LOOK AT EXODUS 12!


Hello? I have looked it and all the rest! INTEGRAL
CONTEXT, Sass Parakaloh!!! You have already been quoted
the other parts in the Torah, which you seeming elude
from, and not to mention, other scriptures in the
Tanach as well, INCLUDING the Greek Scriptures, which
reminds me, come back up here several thousand years,
we are referring to the Book Of Acts! Cherete??? When
you do that, then maybe you will stop altering the
underlying languages of the scriptures? Hello??? You
know, the things you have been transnavigating from?
Can you at least focus yourself in the Book Of Acts,
were you are so far, removing, adding, and altering
greek words in the very AV itself?


|


Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 17:19:11 EST


"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:kvinf018afuc0uidbf81ffasghhab27j6s@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
:"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com| wrote in
:message
:| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
:| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
:| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net| screamed out:
:|
:|
::The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT TENSE,
::*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
process,
:|
:| The Passover is one day, not a week.
:|
:
:Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
|

:I been with Hebrew since the late 1970's, and have been
:educated from Jews as well, it is their festival, and their
:long history... we simply should not be rewriting the
Bible,
:or a culture's history; OH, first let mention that I am
:trying to format scripture references for OLB User Notes
and
:Topics modules.
:
:Passover was the name given to the chief of the three
great
:historical annual festivals of the Jews. It was kept in
:remembrance of the Lord's passing over the houses of the
:Israelites #Ex 12:13 when the first born of all the
:Egyptians were destroyed. (you seem to have got this far,
:what, only to leap over all the rest up to #Ac 12:4 ? As I
:said, As I said before, it is ALSO called the "feast of
:unleavened bread" #Ex 23:15 Mr 14:1 Ac 12:3
|
| According to Exodus 12:7, that's what the week is. And
| Exodus 23:15 and Leviticus 23:6 and many other
| references.
|
| Look at the following. This states it VERY CLEARLY.
|
| Leviticus 23:5-6
|
| 5) In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is
| the LORD'S passover.
| 6) And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the
| feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye
| must eat unleavened bread.
|
| Now there it is. The 14th day at even, is the
| Passover. Starting on the 15th day, is the Feast of
| Unleavened Bread. It doesn't matter what Jews today
| call it. That is irrelevant to the word of God. Many
| Jews also claimed Jesus wasn't the Messiah and many
| still do. Shall we take their word for that too?
|

These are scriptures which I qouted you, and now you
are quoting them in a manner to remove the Hebrew BA
and replace it VEMA? Please, I told you before I have
been with Hebrew with the 70's... isn't it bad enough
already that you try to justify a mistranslation by
tossing up commentaries that alter the underlying
langauage, which have NOT yet even addressed, but now,
you tamper with the very holy Torah itself - Please, I
can only stomach but so much.

Also, it is a poor analogy you use here... We are
Americans know our holidays that is specific to the
U.S., like Independence Day, Labor Day, so if anyone
that grew up in another country of another language,
shall that rewrite the shades and meanings of our
celebrations?


|
:#Mr 14:12 ¶ And the first day of unleavened bread, when
they
:killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where
wilt
:thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the
:passover? {killed: or, sacrificed} (see
:#Mr 14:13-15 in your
:AV Bible) ...
|
| That is because the entire festival could be called
| Unleavened Bread, as I have said repeatedly, because
| unleavened bread was prepared and eaten on the eve of
| the Passover.
|
| "In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month
| at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one
| and twentieth day of the month at even." - Exodus 12:18
|

And as I said, the unleavened bread is a part of the
CELEBRATION of the Passover. You did not answer to the other
ones.

| As I said, the entire feast was the Feast of Unleavened
| Bread. The first night was the Passover. While they
| ate unleavened bread throughout the whole CELEBRATION,
| they did not eat the Passover throughout the whole
| CELEBRATION. That had to be eaten that first night and
| none could be left until morning.
|
|
:WHERE is your PAST TENSE which you claim "... the
:unleavened bread and/or passover was overwith (no pun
:intended [your words]) ? Why can't you find the PAST TENSE?
|
| You are misrepresenting my words. I did not say that
| the Feast of Unleavened Bread was over with. I have
| said very clearly, that the Passover was over. That
| only lasted one night. The Feast of Unleavened Bread
| was still in progress and he would not be waiting for
| that which had passed, to pass.
|

Same thing - you alter my words as well as the
scriptures... you *seem* (in your writings) to be more
interest in man, tyndale, then YHWH - So I will write
it in more clarity, coming off my very own words which
YOU provide in your qoute:

WHERE is your PAST TENSE which you claim "... the
unleavened bread
***** AND / OR <---- *******
PASSOVER was overwith (no pun intended [your words]) ?

Obviously, if you can't see the very words I write upon
your screen, I do not see how you can read the Bible
without missing words, like "INTEND". To say either is
"over" rewrites the underlying Greek, and you cannot
even turn to the likes of W&H in this matter for your
new rewritten and alteration of the Greek, and you seem
to constantly hide away on that... and THAT, is my beef
here, not issues explicity to the Passover and it's
celebration of it... not only have I provided you
scriptures and notations WITHOUT rewriting the Greek of
Acts 12:3-23, but not only have you have started out
with commentary to rewrite it, you evolved in rewriting
it even more here and there, in both Hebrew and Greek.
And I can rest my case on that alone, but If you cannot
directly respond to that, save yourself the time of
circumventing, otherwise, I ask again, "Why can't you
find the PAST TENSE?" Saying either part was over still
rewrites the underlying Greek... and THAT is the BOTTOM
Line. It alone PROVES Tyndale, ye god, and KJV *were*
in error. On that, I rest my case.

One of the Guardians of the Sacred Deposit,
CRH


Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 17:27:18 EST

"Steve Hayes" <hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40fb768c.163069352@news.saix.net...
| On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> wrote:
|
| >
| >"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
| >message
news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
| >| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| >| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| >| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
| >|
| >|
| >| >The phrase in parenthesis () is in the IMPERFECT
TENSE,
| >| >*NOT* PAST TENSE. The Passover had began and was in
| >process,
| >|
| >| The Passover is one day, not a week.
| >|
| >
| >
| >Why do you continue to try and justify a mistranslation,
| >when the AV which contains the error, proves you wrong?
And
| >why have you not yet responded to that little word
| >"INTENDED" (which is enough to prove you in error, let
alone
| >the grammar and all the other scriptures).
|
| The English chose to call Pascha "Easter", so it was anmd
is called that in
| English.
|
| You might not like it, but that's the way it is.

Not quite... English was in use about the time of Christ,
and we are taught regarding English, the grammar, stems,
it's evolment, and etc. The word for Easter was for
something else, and still at this point is not a translation
for pascha. That was not my place of speaking anyway, it was
just keeping intact the underlying Greek of the English,
just as I would your work, if from another language into
English... I been a writer for 30+ yrs, so maybe it is a
sympathy issue on by part? *GRIN*

Shine On,
Clifton

|
|
| --
| Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
| http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
| E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full
stop org full stop uk


Clifton Hodges
2004-07-19 17:27:18 EST

"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:kvinf018afuc0uidbf81ffasghhab27j6s@4ax.com...
| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| Mon, 19 Jul 2004 04:14:42 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
|
|
| >"Pastor Dave" <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in
| >message
news:7rdif0tn3gihdbiiopq1lrete69hhp59go@4ax.com...
| >| While skydiving off of the Empire State Building on
| >| Sat, 17 Jul 2004 12:23:41 GMT, "Clifton Hodges"
| >| <clifton-ray-hodges@spamoutverizon.net> screamed out:
| >|
| >|


THIS IS A RECORDING :-}


#1) I have yet to see you answer to ANY of those scriptures
(to beat it all, the very words of Jesus Christ(!),
which are in your own AV Bible, which you claim you
ONLY care what the Bible says... hello? Your REMOVES
those scriptures.


#2) or the word "INTENDED",


#3) or to come up with some explicit
PAST TENSE for KOINE Greek.


Can you reply to any of these 3? Can you stop ducking
from even one of them? Oh, my dear friend, to think
that you could actually reply to one of the three here,
a glimmering spark to come forth out of my eye upon the
computer monitor... to think you could reply to two of
them, a beam of light could shine forth out of my eye,
to think that you could reply to all 3, oh such a
glistening that could scintillate from my eye...

And I add another, when (if ever) you capture the
strength to do them all 3... show me ANY passage in the
COMPLETE Bible, where passover and it's days of
unleavened bread are not together within the same
paragraph(s) and context - Hello?


CAN YOU ADDRESS THIS SPECIFIC ISSUE *ONLY* ?

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