Vegetarian Discussion: Whats The Story On SOLGAR Vitamins These Days?

Whats The Story On SOLGAR Vitamins These Days?
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Gloria
2007-11-11 14:22:55 EST
Looking to find a supplier for B12 nuggets and came across Boots
Herbal Stores which actually translates to www.solgar.co.uk

Is this the same SOLGAR there were complaints about here?

Message-ID: <2a3186b8.0107030422.14fc485@posting.google.com>
http://tinyurl.com/3ak6lt which is a 2001 post and the links have long
since expired, however the Internet archive has a few pages left
http://tinyurl.com/36ew3v

The solgar website states
www.solgar.co.uk is owned and operated by Boots Herbal Stores in the
UK

I see there have also been concerns about old claims they made (now
dropped) about Vitamin D3 being veggie!

So what's the current news on these people?


Who do you use for your vitamins? (UK)

Pearl
2007-11-11 16:00:18 EST
"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:kpkej3pls48dolgrcopubpg18ofrc5n2qo@4ax.com...
> Looking to find a supplier for B12 nuggets and came across Boots
> Herbal Stores which actually translates to www.solgar.co.uk
>
> Is this the same SOLGAR there were complaints about here?
>
> Message-ID: <2a3186b8.0107030422.14fc485@posting.google.com>
> http://tinyurl.com/3ak6lt which is a 2001 post and the links have long
> since expired, however the Internet archive has a few pages left
> http://tinyurl.com/36ew3v
>
> The solgar website states
> www.solgar.co.uk is owned and operated by Boots Herbal Stores in the
> UK
>
> I see there have also been concerns about old claims they made (now
> dropped) about Vitamin D3 being veggie!
>
> So what's the current news on these people?
>
>
> Who do you use for your vitamins? (UK)

I'm in Ireland, but one suggestion is to check the range available in
your local health food shop and look at the labels. Another option is
to order direct from a sound company. A search I just did online
gave me this for example:

'Green Valley is a natural health company dedicated to meeting the
needs of the health conscious and ethically concerned consumers of
the UK and beyond.

All of the vitamins, nutritional supplements, herbal remedies and natural
products that we supply contain ingredients that are as natural as possible.
In short, our products are good for you and good for the environment.
This means that you can purchase from Green Valley with confidence,
knowing that you are supporting a company that shares your ethical beliefs.

Every vitamin, supplement and natural product is suitable for a vegetarian
or vegan diet (many are registered with the Vegetarian society and Vegan
society too.)
...'
http://www.gvtc.co.uk/




Gloria
2007-11-11 17:27:09 EST
On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 21:00:18 -0000, "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie>
wrote:

>"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:kpkej3pls48dolgrcopubpg18ofrc5n2qo@4ax.com...
>> Looking to find a supplier for B12 nuggets and came across Boots
>> Herbal Stores which actually translates to www.solgar.co.uk
>>
>> Is this the same SOLGAR there were complaints about here?
>>
>> Message-ID: <2a3186b8.0107030422.14fc485@posting.google.com>
>> http://tinyurl.com/3ak6lt which is a 2001 post and the links have long
>> since expired, however the Internet archive has a few pages left
>> http://tinyurl.com/36ew3v
>>
>> The solgar website states
>> www.solgar.co.uk is owned and operated by Boots Herbal Stores in the
>> UK
>>
>> I see there have also been concerns about old claims they made (now
>> dropped) about Vitamin D3 being veggie!
>>
>> So what's the current news on these people?
>>
>>
>> Who do you use for your vitamins? (UK)
>
>I'm in Ireland, but one suggestion is to check the range available in
>your local health food shop and look at the labels. Another option is
>to order direct from a sound company. A search I just did online
>gave me this for example:
>
>'Green Valley is a natural health company dedicated to meeting the
>needs of the health conscious and ethically concerned consumers of
>the UK and beyond.
>
>All of the vitamins, nutritional supplements, herbal remedies and natural
>products that we supply contain ingredients that are as natural as possible.
>In short, our products are good for you and good for the environment.
>This means that you can purchase from Green Valley with confidence,
>knowing that you are supporting a company that shares your ethical beliefs.
>
>Every vitamin, supplement and natural product is suitable for a vegetarian
>or vegan diet (many are registered with the Vegetarian society and Vegan
>society too.)
>...'
>http://www.gvtc.co.uk/
>

Thanks.

Not very impressed with their apparent lack of knowledge on B12
though!

"Vitamin B12 is part of the water soluble B-Complex and is not stored
in the body. Vitamin B12 is considered a generic term for a group of
compunds called Corrinoids that have a cobalt atom at their centre.
Cyanocobalamin is the most well known form of Vitamin B12. Vegetarians
and vegans may have an increased need for this vitamin as it does not
appear to be bio-available from vegetable sources and is found almost
exclusively in animal tissues"

I have also just discovered the upcoming EU directive on supplements
means they will only be allowed to sell RDA% as a maximum!

Pearl
2007-11-12 06:38:42 EST
"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:n80fj35lsqn74fpug7hmhtidp8opv15jrj@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 21:00:18 -0000, "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:kpkej3pls48dolgrcopubpg18ofrc5n2qo@4ax.com...
> >> Looking to find a supplier for B12 nuggets and came across Boots
> >> Herbal Stores which actually translates to www.solgar.co.uk
> >>
> >> Is this the same SOLGAR there were complaints about here?
> >>
> >> Message-ID: <2a3186b8.0107030422.14fc485@posting.google.com>
> >> http://tinyurl.com/3ak6lt which is a 2001 post and the links have long
> >> since expired, however the Internet archive has a few pages left
> >> http://tinyurl.com/36ew3v
> >>
> >> The solgar website states
> >> www.solgar.co.uk is owned and operated by Boots Herbal Stores in the
> >> UK
> >>
> >> I see there have also been concerns about old claims they made (now
> >> dropped) about Vitamin D3 being veggie!
> >>
> >> So what's the current news on these people?
> >>
> >>
> >> Who do you use for your vitamins? (UK)
> >
> >I'm in Ireland, but one suggestion is to check the range available in
> >your local health food shop and look at the labels. Another option is
> >to order direct from a sound company. A search I just did online
> >gave me this for example:
> >
> >'Green Valley is a natural health company dedicated to meeting the
> >needs of the health conscious and ethically concerned consumers of
> >the UK and beyond.
> >
> >All of the vitamins, nutritional supplements, herbal remedies and natural
> >products that we supply contain ingredients that are as natural as possible.
> >In short, our products are good for you and good for the environment.
> >This means that you can purchase from Green Valley with confidence,
> >knowing that you are supporting a company that shares your ethical beliefs.
> >
> >Every vitamin, supplement and natural product is suitable for a vegetarian
> >or vegan diet (many are registered with the Vegetarian society and Vegan
> >society too.)
> >...'
> >http://www.gvtc.co.uk/
> >
>
> Thanks.
>
> Not very impressed with their apparent lack of knowledge on B12
> though!
>
> "Vitamin B12 is part of the water soluble B-Complex and is not stored
> in the body.

I see what you mean. Vitamin B12 is stored in the liver.

> Vitamin B12 is considered a generic term for a group of
> compunds called Corrinoids that have a cobalt atom at their centre.
> Cyanocobalamin is the most well known form of Vitamin B12. Vegetarians
> and vegans may have an increased need for this vitamin as it does not
> appear to be bio-available from vegetable sources and is found almost
> exclusively in animal tissues"

Emphasis added -

'Suzuki1 (1995, Japan) studied 6 vegan children eating a genmai-
saishoku (GS) diet, which is based on high intakes of brown rice
and contains plenty of sea vegetables, including 2-4 g of nori
per day ("dried laver"); as well as hijiki, wakame, and kombu.
The foods are *organically grown* and many are *high in
cobalt* (buckwheat, adzuki beans, kidney beans, shiitake, hijiki).
Serum B12 levels of the children are shown:

Results of Suzuki.1
age(yrs) years vegan sB12
7.1 4.4 520
7.7 4.4 720
8.6A 8.6 480
8.8A 8.8 300
12.7 10 320
14.6 10 320
average 443 (\ufffd 164)
A - Exclusively breast-fed until 6 months old. Mothers had been
vegan for 9.6 and 6.5 yrs prior to conception. Both mothers
consumed 2 g of nori per day.
..'
http://www.veganhealth.org/b12/plant

'The Bacterial Flora of Humans
..
'(8) While E. coli is a consistent resident of the small intestine,
many other enteric bacteria may reside here as well, including
Klebsiella, Enterobacter and Citrobacter.

1. The normal flora synthesize and excrete vitamins in excess of
their own needs, which can be absorbed as nutrients by the host.
For example, enteric bacteria secrete Vitamin K and Vitamin B12,
and lactic acid bacteria produce certain B-vitamins.
.. '
http://textbookofbacteriology.net/normalflora.html

The B12-Cobalt Connection
http://www.championtrees.org/topsoil/b12coblt.htm

'Mineral content: This may be the most important nutritional difference
between organic and regular produce since heavy use of fertilizer inhibits
absorption of some minerals, which are likely to be at lower levels to
begin with in soils that have been abused. This may be caused in part
by the lack of beneficial mycorrhizae fungi on the roots since high levels
of fertilizer tend to kill them. Standard diets tend to be low in various
minerals, resulting in a variety of problems including osteoporosis.
..'
http://math.ucsd.edu/~ebender/Health%20&%20Nutrition/Foods/organic.html

For the 'omnivores' reading this...

'Are You Vitamin B12 Deficient?

Nearly two-fifths of the U.S. population may be flirting with
marginal vitamin B12 status-that is, if a careful look at nearly 3,000
men and women in the ongoing Framingham (Massachusetts)
Offspring Study is any indication. Researchers found that 39 percent
of the volunteers have plasma B12 levels in the "low normal" range-
below 258 picomoles per liter (pmol/L).

While this is well above the currently accepted deficiency level
of 148 pmol/L, some people exhibit neurological symptoms at the
upper level of the deficiency range, explains study leader Katherine
L. Tucker. She is a nutritional epidemiologist at the Jean Mayer
USDA Human Nutrition Research Center on Aging at Tufts
University in Boston.

"I think there's a lot of undetected vitamin B12 deficiency out there,"
says Tucker. She noted that nearly 9 percent of the study population
fell below the current deficiency level. And more than 16 percent fell
below 185 pmol/L. "Many people may be deficient at this level,"
she says. "There is some question as to what the clinical cutoff for
deficiency should be."

Deficiency can cause a type of anemia marked by fewer but larger
red blood cells. It can also cause walking and balance disturbances,
a loss of vibration sensation, confusion, and, in advanced cases,
dementia. The body requires B12 to make the protective coating
surrounding the nerves. So inadequate B12 can expose nerves to
damage.

Tucker and colleagues wanted to get a sense of B12 levels spanning
the adult population because most previous studies have focused on the
elderly. That age group was thought to be at higher risk for deficiency.
The researchers also expected to find some connection between dietary
intake and plasma levels, even though other studies found no association.
Some of the results were surprising. The youngest group-the 26 to 49
year olds-had about the same B12 status as the oldest group-65 and up.
"We thought that low concentrations of B12 would increase with age,"
says Tucker. "But we saw a high prevalence of low B12 even among
the youngest group."

The good news is that for many people, eating more fortified cereals
and dairy products can improve B12 status almost as much as taking
supplements containing the vitamin. Supplement use dropped the
percentage of volunteers in the danger zone (plasma B12 below 185
pmol/L) from 20 percent to 8. Eating fortified cereals five or more
times a week or being among the highest third for dairy intake reduced,
by nearly half, the percentage of volunteers in that zone-from 23 and
24 percent, respectively, to 12 and 13 percent.

The researchers found no association between plasma B12 and meat,
poultry, and fish intake, even though these foods supply the bulk of B12
in the diet. "It's not because people aren't eating enough meat," Tucker
says. "The vitamin isn't getting absorbed." The vitamin is tightly bound
to proteins in meat and dairy products and requires high acidity to cut
it loose. As we age, we lose the acid-secreting cells in the stomach. But
what causes poor absorption in younger adults? Tucker speculates that
the high use of antacids may contribute. But why absorption from dairy
products appears to be better than from meats is a question that needs
more research. Fortified cereals are a different story. She says the
vitamin is sprayed on during processing and is "more like what we get
in supplements."

-By Judy McBride, Agricultural Research Service Information Staff.
This research is part of Human Nutrition, an ARS National Program
(#107) described on the World Wide Web. Katherine L. Tucker is
at the Jean Mayer USDA-ARS Human Nutrition Research Center on
Aging at Tufts University, 711 Washington St., Boston, MA 02111;
..
"Are You Vitamin B12 Deficient?" was published in the August 2000
issue of Agricultural Research magazine.

http://www.epic4health.com/areyouvitb12.html

> I have also just discovered the upcoming EU directive on supplements
> means they will only be allowed to sell RDA% as a maximum!

Great 'news' for the pharm' industry.. Typical of a mad, mad world...







Gloria
2007-11-12 08:26:51 EST
On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:38:42 -0000, "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie>
wrote:

>"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:n80fj35lsqn74fpug7hmhtidp8opv15jrj@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 21:00:18 -0000, "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:kpkej3pls48dolgrcopubpg18ofrc5n2qo@4ax.com...
>> >> Looking to find a supplier for B12 nuggets and came across Boots
>> >> Herbal Stores which actually translates to www.solgar.co.uk
>> >>
>> >> Is this the same SOLGAR there were complaints about here?
>> >>
>> >> Message-ID: <2a3186b8.0107030422.14fc485@posting.google.com>
>> >> http://tinyurl.com/3ak6lt which is a 2001 post and the links have long
>> >> since expired, however the Internet archive has a few pages left
>> >> http://tinyurl.com/36ew3v
>> >>
>> >> The solgar website states
>> >> www.solgar.co.uk is owned and operated by Boots Herbal Stores in the
>> >> UK
>> >>
>> >> I see there have also been concerns about old claims they made (now
>> >> dropped) about Vitamin D3 being veggie!
>> >>
>> >> So what's the current news on these people?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Who do you use for your vitamins? (UK)
>> >
>> >I'm in Ireland, but one suggestion is to check the range available in
>> >your local health food shop and look at the labels. Another option is
>> >to order direct from a sound company. A search I just did online
>> >gave me this for example:
>> >
>> >'Green Valley is a natural health company dedicated to meeting the
>> >needs of the health conscious and ethically concerned consumers of
>> >the UK and beyond.
>> >
>> >All of the vitamins, nutritional supplements, herbal remedies and natural
>> >products that we supply contain ingredients that are as natural as possible.
>> >In short, our products are good for you and good for the environment.
>> >This means that you can purchase from Green Valley with confidence,
>> >knowing that you are supporting a company that shares your ethical beliefs.
>> >
>> >Every vitamin, supplement and natural product is suitable for a vegetarian
>> >or vegan diet (many are registered with the Vegetarian society and Vegan
>> >society too.)
>> >...'
>> >http://www.gvtc.co.uk/
>> >
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Not very impressed with their apparent lack of knowledge on B12
>> though!
>>
>> "Vitamin B12 is part of the water soluble B-Complex and is not stored
>> in the body.
>
>I see what you mean. Vitamin B12 is stored in the liver.
>
>> Vitamin B12 is considered a generic term for a group of
>> compunds called Corrinoids that have a cobalt atom at their centre.
>> Cyanocobalamin is the most well known form of Vitamin B12. Vegetarians
>> and vegans may have an increased need for this vitamin as it does not
>> appear to be bio-available from vegetable sources and is found almost
>> exclusively in animal tissues"
>
>Emphasis added -
>
>'Suzuki1 (1995, Japan) studied 6 vegan children eating a genmai-
>saishoku (GS) diet, which is based on high intakes of brown rice
>and contains plenty of sea vegetables, including 2-4 g of nori
>per day ("dried laver"); as well as hijiki, wakame, and kombu.
>The foods are *organically grown* and many are *high in
>cobalt* (buckwheat, adzuki beans, kidney beans, shiitake, hijiki).
>Serum B12 levels of the children are shown:
>
>Results of Suzuki.1
>age(yrs) years vegan sB12
>7.1 4.4 520
>7.7 4.4 720
>8.6A 8.6 480
>8.8A 8.8 300
>12.7 10 320
>14.6 10 320
>average 443 (± 164)

Blimey they're great figures. Considering the norm is supposedly
around 200!

>A - Exclusively breast-fed until 6 months old. Mothers had been
>vegan for 9.6 and 6.5 yrs prior to conception. Both mothers
>consumed 2 g of nori per day.
>..'
>http://www.veganhealth.org/b12/plant
>
>'The Bacterial Flora of Humans
>..
>'(8) While E. coli is a consistent resident of the small intestine,
>many other enteric bacteria may reside here as well, including
>Klebsiella, Enterobacter and Citrobacter.
>
>1. The normal flora synthesize and excrete vitamins in excess of
>their own needs, which can be absorbed as nutrients by the host.
>For example, enteric bacteria secrete Vitamin K and Vitamin B12,
>and lactic acid bacteria produce certain B-vitamins.
>.. '
>http://textbookofbacteriology.net/normalflora.html
>
>The B12-Cobalt Connection
>http://www.championtrees.org/topsoil/b12coblt.htm
>
>'Mineral content: This may be the most important nutritional difference
>between organic and regular produce since heavy use of fertilizer inhibits
>absorption of some minerals, which are likely to be at lower levels to
>begin with in soils that have been abused. This may be caused in part
>by the lack of beneficial mycorrhizae fungi on the roots since high levels
>of fertilizer tend to kill them. Standard diets tend to be low in various
>minerals, resulting in a variety of problems including osteoporosis.
>..'
>http://math.ucsd.edu/~ebender/Health%20&%20Nutrition/Foods/organic.html
>
>For the 'omnivores' reading this...
>
>'Are You Vitamin B12 Deficient?
>
> Nearly two-fifths of the U.S. population may be flirting with
>marginal vitamin B12 status-that is, if a careful look at nearly 3,000
>men and women in the ongoing Framingham (Massachusetts)
>Offspring Study is any indication. Researchers found that 39 percent
>of the volunteers have plasma B12 levels in the "low normal" range-
>below 258 picomoles per liter (pmol/L).
>
> While this is well above the currently accepted deficiency level
>of 148 pmol/L, some people exhibit neurological symptoms at the
>upper level of the deficiency range, explains study leader Katherine
>L. Tucker. She is a nutritional epidemiologist at the Jean Mayer
>USDA Human Nutrition Research Center on Aging at Tufts
>University in Boston.
>
> "I think there's a lot of undetected vitamin B12 deficiency out there,"
>says Tucker. She noted that nearly 9 percent of the study population
>fell below the current deficiency level. And more than 16 percent fell
>below 185 pmol/L. "Many people may be deficient at this level,"
>she says. "There is some question as to what the clinical cutoff for
>deficiency should be."
>
> Deficiency can cause a type of anemia marked by fewer but larger
>red blood cells. It can also cause walking and balance disturbances,
>a loss of vibration sensation, confusion, and, in advanced cases,
>dementia. The body requires B12 to make the protective coating
>surrounding the nerves. So inadequate B12 can expose nerves to
>damage.
>
> Tucker and colleagues wanted to get a sense of B12 levels spanning
>the adult population because most previous studies have focused on the
>elderly. That age group was thought to be at higher risk for deficiency.
>The researchers also expected to find some connection between dietary
>intake and plasma levels, even though other studies found no association.
>Some of the results were surprising. The youngest group-the 26 to 49
>year olds-had about the same B12 status as the oldest group-65 and up.
>"We thought that low concentrations of B12 would increase with age,"
>says Tucker. "But we saw a high prevalence of low B12 even among
>the youngest group."
>
> The good news is that for many people, eating more fortified cereals
>and dairy products can improve B12 status almost as much as taking
>supplements containing the vitamin. Supplement use dropped the
>percentage of volunteers in the danger zone (plasma B12 below 185
>pmol/L) from 20 percent to 8. Eating fortified cereals five or more
>times a week or being among the highest third for dairy intake reduced,
>by nearly half, the percentage of volunteers in that zone-from 23 and
>24 percent, respectively, to 12 and 13 percent.
>
> The researchers found no association between plasma B12 and meat,
>poultry, and fish intake, even though these foods supply the bulk of B12
>in the diet. "It's not because people aren't eating enough meat," Tucker
>says. "The vitamin isn't getting absorbed." The vitamin is tightly bound
>to proteins in meat and dairy products and requires high acidity to cut
>it loose. As we age, we lose the acid-secreting cells in the stomach. But
>what causes poor absorption in younger adults? Tucker speculates that
>the high use of antacids may contribute. But why absorption from dairy
>products appears to be better than from meats is a question that needs
>more research. Fortified cereals are a different story. She says the
>vitamin is sprayed on during processing and is "more like what we get
>in supplements."
>
>-By Judy McBride, Agricultural Research Service Information Staff.
>This research is part of Human Nutrition, an ARS National Program
>(#107) described on the World Wide Web. Katherine L. Tucker is
>at the Jean Mayer USDA-ARS Human Nutrition Research Center on
>Aging at Tufts University, 711 Washington St., Boston, MA 02111;
>..
>"Are You Vitamin B12 Deficient?" was published in the August 2000
>issue of Agricultural Research magazine.
>
>http://www.epic4health.com/areyouvitb12.html
>
>> I have also just discovered the upcoming EU directive on supplements
>> means they will only be allowed to sell RDA% as a maximum!
>
>Great 'news' for the pharm' industry.. Typical of a mad, mad world...

But like the lunacy over the maximum numbers of paracetamol
etc........stung the pocket big time overnight :-(

Pearl
2007-11-12 09:17:37 EST
"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:0vkgj3dq7n4136i3k1ji9sapk77uho3dgs@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:38:42 -0000, "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:n80fj35lsqn74fpug7hmhtidp8opv15jrj@4ax.com...
> >> On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 21:00:18 -0000, "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> >"Gloria" <letsstandup2bullies@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:kpkej3pls48dolgrcopubpg18ofrc5n2qo@4ax.com...
> >> >> Looking to find a supplier for B12 nuggets and came across Boots
> >> >> Herbal Stores which actually translates to www.solgar.co.uk
> >> >>
> >> >> Is this the same SOLGAR there were complaints about here?
> >> >>
> >> >> Message-ID: <2a3186b8.0107030422.14fc485@posting.google.com>
> >> >> http://tinyurl.com/3ak6lt which is a 2001 post and the links have long
> >> >> since expired, however the Internet archive has a few pages left
> >> >> http://tinyurl.com/36ew3v
> >> >>
> >> >> The solgar website states
> >> >> www.solgar.co.uk is owned and operated by Boots Herbal Stores in the
> >> >> UK
> >> >>
> >> >> I see there have also been concerns about old claims they made (now
> >> >> dropped) about Vitamin D3 being veggie!
> >> >>
> >> >> So what's the current news on these people?
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Who do you use for your vitamins? (UK)
> >> >
> >> >I'm in Ireland, but one suggestion is to check the range available in
> >> >your local health food shop and look at the labels. Another option is
> >> >to order direct from a sound company. A search I just did online
> >> >gave me this for example:
> >> >
> >> >'Green Valley is a natural health company dedicated to meeting the
> >> >needs of the health conscious and ethically concerned consumers of
> >> >the UK and beyond.
> >> >
> >> >All of the vitamins, nutritional supplements, herbal remedies and natural
> >> >products that we supply contain ingredients that are as natural as possible.
> >> >In short, our products are good for you and good for the environment.
> >> >This means that you can purchase from Green Valley with confidence,
> >> >knowing that you are supporting a company that shares your ethical beliefs.
> >> >
> >> >Every vitamin, supplement and natural product is suitable for a vegetarian
> >> >or vegan diet (many are registered with the Vegetarian society and Vegan
> >> >society too.)
> >> >...'
> >> >http://www.gvtc.co.uk/
> >> >
> >>
> >> Thanks.
> >>
> >> Not very impressed with their apparent lack of knowledge on B12
> >> though!
> >>
> >> "Vitamin B12 is part of the water soluble B-Complex and is not stored
> >> in the body.
> >
> >I see what you mean. Vitamin B12 is stored in the liver.
> >
> >> Vitamin B12 is considered a generic term for a group of
> >> compunds called Corrinoids that have a cobalt atom at their centre.
> >> Cyanocobalamin is the most well known form of Vitamin B12. Vegetarians
> >> and vegans may have an increased need for this vitamin as it does not
> >> appear to be bio-available from vegetable sources and is found almost
> >> exclusively in animal tissues"
> >
> >Emphasis added -
> >
> >'Suzuki1 (1995, Japan) studied 6 vegan children eating a genmai-
> >saishoku (GS) diet, which is based on high intakes of brown rice
> >and contains plenty of sea vegetables, including 2-4 g of nori
> >per day ("dried laver"); as well as hijiki, wakame, and kombu.
> >The foods are *organically grown* and many are *high in
> >cobalt* (buckwheat, adzuki beans, kidney beans, shiitake, hijiki).
> >Serum B12 levels of the children are shown:
> >
> >Results of Suzuki.1
> >age(yrs) years vegan sB12
> >7.1 4.4 520
> >7.7 4.4 720
> >8.6A 8.6 480
> >8.8A 8.8 300
> >12.7 10 320
> >14.6 10 320
> >average 443 (\ufffd 164)
>
> Blimey they're great figures.

They are indeed great figures. Kelp can be taken in supplement form.

'Kelp

The kelps generally include the many large brown types of seaweed
and are among the most familiar forms found on North American coasts.
Some have fronds up to 200 ft (61 m) long. Kelps are especially abundant
in Japan, and various foods known as kombu are made from them. They
are used chiefly as chemical reagents and for dietary deficiencies in people.

Kelp contains nearly 30 minerals. It is rich in iodine, calcium, sulphur and
silicon. It also contains phosphorus, iron, sodium, potassium, magnesium,
chlorine, copper, zinc and manganese. It has a small amount of barium,
boron, chromium, lithium, nickel, silver, titanium, vanadium, aluminum,
strontium, bismuth, chlorine, cobalt, gallium, tin and zirconium. Kelp is
rich in B-complex vitamins. It contains vitamin A, C, E and G. It also
contains anti-sterility vitamin S, and it has anti-hemorrhage vitamin K.

Kelp is a good promoter of glandular health. It is beneficial for
hypothyroidism as it controls the thyroid and regulates the metabolism,
which helps digest food. Kelp can rebalance thyroid metabolism, resulting
in successful weight management. It is helpful in the nourishment of the
body with its ability to stimulate metabolism. Kelp has shown the reversal
of many conditions caused by a thyroid imbalance including stomach and
respiratory disorders.

Kelp has a beneficial effect on many disorders of the body. It is called a
sustainer to the nervous system and the brain, helping the brain to
function normally. It is essential during pregnancy. And it has been shown
to prevent heart diseases.

http://www.samsonssecret.com/ingredients/kelp.html

> Considering the norm is supposedly around 200!

It was found in the Framingham (Massachusetts) Offspring Study
that 39 percent of the 3,000 volunteers had plasma B12 levels
below 258 pmol/L - the "low normal" range. The currently
accepted deficiency level is 148 pmol/L, but it is stated that many
people may be deficient at plasma B12 levels below 185 pmol/L.

Just to clarify.

> >A - Exclusively breast-fed until 6 months old. Mothers had been
> >vegan for 9.6 and 6.5 yrs prior to conception. Both mothers
> >consumed 2 g of nori per day.
> >..'
> >http://www.veganhealth.org/b12/plant
> >
> >'The Bacterial Flora of Humans
> >..
> >'(8) While E. coli is a consistent resident of the small intestine,
> >many other enteric bacteria may reside here as well, including
> >Klebsiella, Enterobacter and Citrobacter.
> >
> >1. The normal flora synthesize and excrete vitamins in excess of
> >their own needs, which can be absorbed as nutrients by the host.
> >For example, enteric bacteria secrete Vitamin K and Vitamin B12,
> >and lactic acid bacteria produce certain B-vitamins.
> >.. '
> >http://textbookofbacteriology.net/normalflora.html
> >
> >The B12-Cobalt Connection
> >http://www.championtrees.org/topsoil/b12coblt.htm
> >
> >'Mineral content: This may be the most important nutritional difference
> >between organic and regular produce since heavy use of fertilizer inhibits
> >absorption of some minerals, which are likely to be at lower levels to
> >begin with in soils that have been abused. This may be caused in part
> >by the lack of beneficial mycorrhizae fungi on the roots since high levels
> >of fertilizer tend to kill them. Standard diets tend to be low in various
> >minerals, resulting in a variety of problems including osteoporosis.
> >..'
> >http://math.ucsd.edu/~ebender/Health%20&%20Nutrition/Foods/organic.html
> >
> >For the 'omnivores' reading this...
> >
> >'Are You Vitamin B12 Deficient?
> >
> > Nearly two-fifths of the U.S. population may be flirting with
> >marginal vitamin B12 status-that is, if a careful look at nearly 3,000
> >men and women in the ongoing Framingham (Massachusetts)
> >Offspring Study is any indication. Researchers found that 39 percent
> >of the volunteers have plasma B12 levels in the "low normal" range-
> >below 258 picomoles per liter (pmol/L).
> >
> > While this is well above the currently accepted deficiency level
> >of 148 pmol/L, some people exhibit neurological symptoms at the
> >upper level of the deficiency range, explains study leader Katherine
> >L. Tucker. She is a nutritional epidemiologist at the Jean Mayer
> >USDA Human Nutrition Research Center on Aging at Tufts
> >University in Boston.
> >
> > "I think there's a lot of undetected vitamin B12 deficiency out there,"
> >says Tucker. She noted that nearly 9 percent of the study population
> >fell below the current deficiency level. And more than 16 percent fell
> >below 185 pmol/L. "Many people may be deficient at this level,"
> >she says. "There is some question as to what the clinical cutoff for
> >deficiency should be."
> >
> > Deficiency can cause a type of anemia marked by fewer but larger
> >red blood cells. It can also cause walking and balance disturbances,
> >a loss of vibration sensation, confusion, and, in advanced cases,
> >dementia. The body requires B12 to make the protective coating
> >surrounding the nerves. So inadequate B12 can expose nerves to
> >damage.
> >
> > Tucker and colleagues wanted to get a sense of B12 levels spanning
> >the adult population because most previous studies have focused on the
> >elderly. That age group was thought to be at higher risk for deficiency.
> >The researchers also expected to find some connection between dietary
> >intake and plasma levels, even though other studies found no association.
> >Some of the results were surprising. The youngest group-the 26 to 49
> >year olds-had about the same B12 status as the oldest group-65 and up.
> >"We thought that low concentrations of B12 would increase with age,"
> >says Tucker. "But we saw a high prevalence of low B12 even among
> >the youngest group."
> >
> > The good news is that for many people, eating more fortified cereals
> >and dairy products can improve B12 status almost as much as taking
> >supplements containing the vitamin. Supplement use dropped the
> >percentage of volunteers in the danger zone (plasma B12 below 185
> >pmol/L) from 20 percent to 8. Eating fortified cereals five or more
> >times a week or being among the highest third for dairy intake reduced,
> >by nearly half, the percentage of volunteers in that zone-from 23 and
> >24 percent, respectively, to 12 and 13 percent.
> >
> > The researchers found no association between plasma B12 and meat,
> >poultry, and fish intake, even though these foods supply the bulk of B12
> >in the diet. "It's not because people aren't eating enough meat," Tucker
> >says. "The vitamin isn't getting absorbed." The vitamin is tightly bound
> >to proteins in meat and dairy products and requires high acidity to cut
> >it loose. As we age, we lose the acid-secreting cells in the stomach. But
> >what causes poor absorption in younger adults? Tucker speculates that
> >the high use of antacids may contribute. But why absorption from dairy
> >products appears to be better than from meats is a question that needs
> >more research. Fortified cereals are a different story. She says the
> >vitamin is sprayed on during processing and is "more like what we get
> >in supplements."
> >
> >-By Judy McBride, Agricultural Research Service Information Staff.
> >This research is part of Human Nutrition, an ARS National Program
> >(#107) described on the World Wide Web. Katherine L. Tucker is
> >at the Jean Mayer USDA-ARS Human Nutrition Research Center on
> >Aging at Tufts University, 711 Washington St., Boston, MA 02111;
> >..
> >"Are You Vitamin B12 Deficient?" was published in the August 2000
> >issue of Agricultural Research magazine.
> >
> >http://www.epic4health.com/areyouvitb12.html
> >
> >> I have also just discovered the upcoming EU directive on supplements
> >> means they will only be allowed to sell RDA% as a maximum!
> >
> >Great 'news' for the pharm' industry.. Typical of a mad, mad world...
>
> But like the lunacy over the maximum numbers of paracetamol
> etc........stung the pocket big time overnight :-(

Follow the money. Every time.





Ann
2007-11-23 11:56:03 EST
"pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie> expounded:

>Kelp is a good promoter of glandular health. It is beneficial for
>hypothyroidism as it controls the thyroid and regulates the metabolism,
>which helps digest food. Kelp can rebalance thyroid metabolism, resulting
>in successful weight management. It is helpful in the nourishment of the
>body with its ability to stimulate metabolism. Kelp has shown the reversal
>of many conditions caused by a thyroid imbalance including stomach and
>respiratory disorders.

Will it help with hyperthyroidism?
--
Ann
e-mail address is not checked

Pearl
2007-11-23 13:02:41 EST
"Ann" <annbal@newsguy.com> wrote in message news:hg1ek31tbb31o4aohia1s6al70hutfkohd@4ax.com...
> "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie> expounded:
>
> >Kelp is a good promoter of glandular health. It is beneficial for
> >hypothyroidism as it controls the thyroid and regulates the metabolism,
> >which helps digest food. Kelp can rebalance thyroid metabolism, resulting
> >in successful weight management. It is helpful in the nourishment of the
> >body with its ability to stimulate metabolism. Kelp has shown the reversal
> >of many conditions caused by a thyroid imbalance including stomach and
> >respiratory disorders.
>
> Will it help with hyperthyroidism?

Contraindicated, and generally speaking it is probably better to
incorporate kelp occasionally in a varied (organic vegan) diet,
rather than taking a supplement. I'm thinking of trace minerals.



Laurie
2007-11-25 23:56:00 EST
Ann wrote:
> "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie> expounded:
>
>> Kelp is a good promoter of glandular health. It is beneficial for
>> hypothyroidism as it controls the thyroid and regulates the
>> metabolism, which helps digest food. Kelp can rebalance thyroid
>> metabolism, resulting in successful weight management. It is
>> helpful in the nourishment of the body with its ability to
>> stimulate metabolism. Kelp has shown the reversal of many
>> conditions caused by a thyroid imbalance including stomach and
>> respiratory disorders.
Any scientific citations to back up these outrageous statements?

Laurie

--
Scientifically-credible info on human diet:
http://ecologos.org/ttdd.html
news:alt.food.vegan.science

Pearl
2007-11-26 06:58:27 EST
"Laurie" <no@spam.com> wrote in message news:13kkkf4hlh59f19@corp.supernews.com...
> Ann wrote:
> > "pearl" <tea@signguestbook.ie> expounded:
> >
> >> Kelp is a good promoter of glandular health. It is beneficial for
> >> hypothyroidism as it controls the thyroid and regulates the
> >> metabolism, which helps digest food. Kelp can rebalance thyroid
> >> metabolism, resulting in successful weight management. It is
> >> helpful in the nourishment of the body with its ability to
> >> stimulate metabolism. Kelp has shown the reversal of many
> >> conditions caused by a thyroid imbalance including stomach and
> >> respiratory disorders.
>
> Any scientific citations to back up these outrageous statements?

I posted that.

'Herbs

Some of the herbs used by herbalists to support the thyroid include kelp
(nereocytis luetkana or laminaria hyperborea), alfalfa (medicago sativa),
burdock (arctium lappa, previously known as lappa officinalis), and
scullcap (scutellaria lateriflora) [55-57]. As a rule, these herbs contain
minerals and phytonutrients which can nutritionally support the thyroid
[58,59].

Kelp is the classic herb that is used for thyroid support [38,57]. It is
high in minerals [60,61] and may have immune-enhancing properties [61].
Kelp has long been used to provide nutritional support for the thyroid
gland [3,38,43,62]. Gary Null, Ph.D., has written, "Kelp can rebalance
thyroid metabolism, resulting in successful weight management and the
reversal of many conditions which are caused by a thyroid imbalance,
including stomach and respiratory disorders" [43]. One study concluded
that 'living food' eating vegetarians need to consume kelp (or take kelp
supplements) in order to maintain normal iodine levels for proper thyroid
functioning [62]. Kelp and other sea vegetables are rich food sources of
iodine, which may be their most active nutritional ingredient [38]. It has
been recently been reported that kelp may be able to effect TSH levels
[59]. Kelp is a food [58,62]. Although it is categorized by the American
Herbal Products Association as "Class 2d - Therapeutic use is not
recommended in hyperthyroidism; long-term use is not recommended"
[58], this contradicts other findings which suggests it is beneficial, for at
least certain vegetarians, long-term [62]. Also, it appears that it is the
quantity of kelp that may have negative effects [57,59], as opposed to
kelp itself (the danger of inducing hyperthyroidism exists when it supplies
over 150 grams of iodine per day [57], a massively high amount). Some
evidence suggests negative effects of kelp or iodine-containing
supplements on thyroid serum results is often [62,], but not always [64],
temporary.
...'
http://www.healthresearch.com/thyroids.html

> Laurie
>
> --
> Scientifically-credible info on human diet:
> http://ecologos.org/ttdd.html
> news:alt.food.vegan.science


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