Dog Discussion: Bark Collar? Which One?

Bark Collar? Which One?
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Tom Ginkel
2008-07-31 13:37:33 EST
I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog, but often goes to the fence
and barks excessively. A little barking is good, but I don't want to
alienate the neighbors with constant yapping. Will an anti-bark collar
help? She is very trainable and remembers unpleasant consequences very
well.

Thanks for any help.

Tom
t*l@mchsi.com



Human_And_Animal_Behaviour_Forensic_Sciences_Research_Laboratory
2008-07-31 13:57:40 EST
HOWEDY Tom,

"Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:xLmkk.223490$TT4.169005@attbi_s22...

Welcome to The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely
Simply Amazing, Majestic Grand Master Puppy, Child,
Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferret, Monkey, SpHOWES, And Horsey
Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY
SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Training Method
Manual Forums And Human And Animal Behavior Forensic
Sciences Research Laboratory.

I'm Jerry Howe, The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin
Insanely Simply Amazing, Majestic Grand Master
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferret, Monkey,
SpHOWES, And Horsey Wizard, Director Of
Trainin an Research.

I've got forty five years of EXXXPERIENCE raising
and training mostly giant breed working dogs for families
and security specializing in temperament and behavior
problems and protection <{}: ~ ) >

Here's your own FREE COPY of The Sincerely Incredibly
Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing, Majestic Grand Master
Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferret, Monkey, SpHOWES,
And Horsey Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY
INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End
Training Method Manual:
http://www.freewebs.com/thesimplyamazingpuppywizard/777witsendmanual.htm

The actual INSTRUCTION begins on the third page "*777*
Wits' End Method", abHOWET 1/4 down the page starting
with "Here's ALL the INFORMATION you NEED" and my
phone # and instructions to CALL ANY TIME.

There you will find ALL the FREE information you need
to pupperly handle raise and train your pets and family.
Just follow the instructions PRECISELY and ASK me if
you need any additional FREE HEELP <{}': ~ ) >

You'll likeWIZE find ETHICAL nutrition and heelth
care practices taught on the heelth page *(third link
on the left side) of my website.

> I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog,

And you only want the BEAST for him <{}: ~ ) >

> but often goes to the fence and barks excessively.

Barkin is a SYMPTOM of SUMPTHIN WRONG.

> A little barking is good, but I don't want to alienate
> the neighbors with constant yapping.

All you gotta do is PRAISE HIM.

LIKE THIS:

"Estel J. Hines" <ejhi...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:w86dna9lBfNZgbTdRVn-hA@comcast.com...

Until i read the Jerry method of Bark reductioon,
it went something like this with our 11
month old puppy "Yoshi"

Yoshi: Bark, bark,

us: HUSH Youshi

Yoshi: Bark, bark......................

us: Hush Youshi

Yoshi BARK, BARK, BARK, ...........

it stopped when Yoshi got tired barking

We decided to try the Jerry method:

Yoshi: BARK, BARK

US: GOOD Yoshi, Good Boy, who is it?

Yoshi: Bark, Bark

US: It's ok, good boy Yoshi, We know them

Yosh without fail, now stops after we say that.

I must say, it is so much more fun, when we
can praise him, to deal with things like this

Thanks Jerry

ps: We are just starting to go thru the Jerry
Papers, and learn how to live with our son
"Yoshi", whom we love very much.
--
Best Regards,

Estel J. Hines

-------------------------

AND LIKE THIS:

"Brandy Kurtz" <KraftyKur...@wmconnect.com>
wrote in message
news:2f66e35d.0407302331.1f18b8c6@posting.google.com...

Hello everyone! We have a 2 1/2 year old male

Well I just printed out the Amazing Puppy
Wizard info, so I haven't actually started
to train yet.

Today a salesman knocked on the door, and Pokey
was going balisstic. I calmly go to the window
to see who it is, and off-handly say Good Boy,
It's a stranger, Good Boy.

Pokey shut right up, gave me a quizical look,
and came and sat beside my feet!

OMG, I could not believe it!

I was totally floored, as this has been his
behavior since a pup. Just wanted to update,
and Pokey and I are hitting the sack...;)

Brandy

-----------------------

AND LIKE THIS:

Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 9:06 AM

Hello.

I never posted here (or anywhere) before.
I never trained or owned a dog before this
year.

I downloaded the Wit's End, read it, corresponded
with Mr. Howe and trained my dog to come and to
stop barking in a weekend.

Our dog, Jake, had been treated with kindness the
whole time we had him, about 10 months, but his
earlier life is unknown.

I worked on the hot-cold exercise for about 30
minutes when he suddenly "got it". After that
he came to me every time with no hesitation.

I used the cans filled with pennies to teach him
not to bark. If he now starts to bark, I go to the
door or window, say "Good Boy, its' alright" and
he usually calms down right away.

A couple of times I had to get the cans
out again to reinforce the behavior.

We feel a strong bond with this animal
and he is very eager to accept our love.

So with all the vitriolic spewing going on,
I have to believe Mr. Howe is right.

His method worked for us.

I don't know if it would have been quite
as effective if we had tried another method first.

Florence

-----------------------------

AND LIKE THIS:

From: "Marisa" <mari...@hotmail.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 2002

Subject: one day

I started some of the simple techniques in
Jerrys manual today.

The family pack exercise.... come command.....
that's all so far though.

I did get the proper equipment as well.
20 foot leash, cans with pennies partially
crushed, flat collar, etc.

I have also stopped any negative reinforcment
such as loud "No" and "Bad girl Sonique!"
(Sonique is my Jack russell) and holding her
back, which I normally MUST do or she'll jump
and nip sometimes, but always jumping and barking.

Already tonight some has started working.
When someone came to the door, Sonique
went nuts as usual.

I said "Thank you Sonique!"
"It's o.k. girl, thank you!"

And we got a total of about 6 barks and then
no jumping on guests, no biting, growling
or the worst, the continued barking she
normally does.

She accepted my praise, and trooted around,
still excited over guests, but she was WAY
more under control.

Even my roomates noticed this.

She repeated this same thing
without all her normal fuss later
when another two friends came over.

So I do need more time, going to keep with it
another day, another month whatever until I
know I am getting results, although I must say,
so far I am impressed with my dog.

She really responds to praise better than
she ever has responded to treats as distraction
from the guests and doorbell, or me yelling
"bad girl! go away now! shoosh up!" all the time.

I am also verbally praising her everytime
she makes eye contact with me. so hopefully
things will continue going well!-

- Marisa

From: "0513chgo" <0513c...@nixspam.net>
Date: Thu, 16 May 2002
Subject: Re: Jerry Howe

Marshall Dermer wrote in message ...
> In articleSsyE8.20247$t8_.12...@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>
> "Marisa" <mari...@hotmail.com> writes:
>
>> So I downloaded your Wits End today,
>> and I have started reading, and I am
>> planning on using it from now on and
>> see what results I get.
>
> Marisa you have much hard reading
> ahead of you because Jerry's manual
> is verbose and spends about as many
> lines condeming other approaches as
> describing what to do.

Please leave Marisa be and let her be happy
with training her dog the way she wants to!

From: "Jerry Howe" <jho...@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Jerry Howe

He CAN'T.

He's fighting for his career and reputation...he's F'd.

Jerry.

--------------------

> Will an anti-bark collar help?


"diddy" <none> wrote in message
news:Xns99E154DAFFD50diddydiddynet@216.196.97.142...

A dog trainer must succeed. By nature, "Command" mentality
makes dog trainers a curmudgeonly lot. The deeper a dog
behavior digs in, the more willing a good trainer is to do
what it takes to uproot the undesired behavior.

This willingness to tackle what results in a battle of wills
is well pronounced in dog trainers. And if you think that's
something, try horse trainer lists, where the ante is upped X
1000 pounds and poor results can KILL you!

However, "nice little horsey " types are rarely successful
in horse training and rather self extinguishing bringing
about more moderation in established techniques.

BWEEEAAAAHAHAAA~!

"I would not allow that behavior AT ALL. Inconsistancies
are going to come back and bite you. I don't understand
how, you as a trainer, don't comprehend this.

Having a 100% reliable dog does not
EVER allow for mitigated circumstances.

A well-trained dog is a lifestyle.

You teach a dog to LEAVE it. A dog should be
taught to obey. I can call any of my dogs off
in full chase and ask them to drop anything
they are doing, and they will.

I think that should be expected of any breed, and
those who do not teach "leave it" fundementals
atre missing the boat"

Subject: Re: untrainable beagle! NEED HELP

"diddy" <di...@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9834C98CEC696danny@216.196.97.142...
> in thread news:BO2Lg.4755$xV.1684@twister.nyroc.rr.com: "graham
> fandango!" <gmey...@maine.rr.com> whittled the following words:

> i have a ten year old beagle who i got from the animal
> shelter 5 years ago. its pretty clear he was abused in
> some form before he ended up in the shelter; when ever
> i reach for something, like the tv remote, too quickly he
> flinches. he gets scared when i sweep the kitchen floor
> and hides under the bed.

I have one too. I don't know her past history,or her age.

I use an antibark collar on her for my sanity. She's very
quiet, until I take it off. It doesn't train her not to bark,
because she barks when the collar is off. (beagles "Do
that")

There may not even be batteries in it, but she doesn't
bark... just in case.I'd supervise the first time you try
it, because I've heard of some dogs barking, and going
so spazzy over them that they died.

I really don't think you are going to train a dog that
age, especially a beagle, NOT to bark. I see your
options as being:

1) anti-bark collar
a)citronella
b)electronic
c)bark buster (your neighbors will
probably complain asmuch about
that as the howlng)
2) surgical debarking
3) placing the dog and accepting the consequences
4) moving

-----------------------

"diddy" <none> wrote in message
news:Xns9A74B7CCF8817diddydiddynet@216.196.97.142...
c <barneytoe@gmail.com> spoke these words of wisdom in news:
5a8c97ed-06aa-
4211-b345-b49062effd09@s37g2000prg.googlegroups.com:

> The shock is minimal and nothing to worry about.
>
> There are 2 different types that frequent this group:
> the high falutin city folk that believe dogs should be
> treated like children, and the answer for any problem
> is "enroll them in class and spend $300 to teach them
> not to do it, and put them in time-out, but be sure
> their paw socks are on before stepping outside if under
> 50 degrees, etc."

First, I know of a dog with an antibark collar, who
protested so violently, he spazzed out and killed himself.

He was found dead in his kennel the next morning.

What dog training schools charge $300?

------------

"Cappy the beagle killed one of my ducklings today.
Tuck grabbed a leg, and swallowed a leg and thigh
before I could get him.

a month ago, he almost died from swallowing a
chicken wing. Now I'm sweating all over again.

I think he's never going to be allowed out ever
again without a muzzle! (he seems alright thus far.

------------------------

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >

Re: Tuck's SAR experience

"diddy" <d...@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns982D2E8C7C9D6danny@216.196.97.142...
I just came in from putting chickens to bed, and Tuck
had my computer keyboard on the floor, and there are
now two keys missing.
Ornery git

-------------

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >

"diddy" <d...@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9839861A82FF6danny@216.196.97.142...
> in thread news:m1s5g2lsio01rsk9iisfcjotfqigmljjnp@4ax.com: Janet B
> <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> whittled the following words:
> Curious how many choose to crate a dog forever,
> whenever they leave the house and/or overnight,
> or how many choose to wean from household
> crate usage (usage being shutting the dog in the
> crate, not the dog choosing to hang out there) at
> some specific ages or maturity levels.
> Not for how long during a workday, but how
> long for a dog's lifespan?

I plan on crating Tuck whenever NOT supervised
(which isn't often.. he usually is with me) Until the
day that he quits tearing apart everything in sight
when I leave the room.

A dog proof room doesn't work.

He's figured out door knobs. He's figured out cupboards,
and he loves to tug open dresser drawers. He's not
interested in anything left out in the open.

He's into treasure hunting, figuring anything worth
secreting away is worth his effort discovering. He's
discovered the sock stash is in drawers.

Trash cans? --not interested.
Counter tops? --not interested
Counter tops -with food? --not interested
Dog food sitting on the floorin open bags? --not interested

razor blades from bathroom drawers? ... Very cool stuff!

Mom really gets bent too!

nope.. His crate is going to be occupied for
some time to come.

As for the beagle.. She's never been trustworthy.

She's getting senile and never will be trustworthy,
so a crate is in her future until she crosses the bridge.

Reka, no crate at no time, She lost her crate when she was
5 months old. Both Tuck, and reka hangout in crates by choice.

Reka dens in the bathtub usually. (kind of a crate) But she
likes the beagles vantage point, because the beagles crate
is on top of Tuck's. Right next to the window so she can see
out. Tuck prefers the compartment with a view as well.

I always have to vacate him (even though the crate on top is
too small for both elkhounds, it's their preferred lookout)
when I wantto stick in the beagle.

Reka sleeps under the bed at night or in the bathtub at night
if it's really hot. She sleeps in the bathtub by day when not
watching from the penthouse suite.

Tuck is not crated at night, and has chosen to sleep in
the closet. The beagle holds down the couch, night and day.

--------------

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >

> "diddy" <di...@whoops.I.said.WHAT?> wrote in message
> news:JS76a.9623
>
>> Taya had eaten over 5 POUNDS of summer sausage!

>> I just had to laugh, because otherwise, I'd have cried.
>
> is taya an elkie? no point in crying over ingested summer sausage
> is what my mom used to say. did she get the runs?

Taya IS a 1/2 a cup a day for food elkie. When i told mom and dad
that she ate 5 POUNDS, we all marveled, my goodness! Where did she
put it all!

She went to the emergency vet clinic last night in a snowstorm
along 60 miles of ice slick roads, & blowing snow. The price
wasn't bad $120 but she had pancreatitis.

Crap, I should have induced vomiting when I realized it had happened.

Going from a regular diet of ounces in a day to 5 pounds
was bound to cause problems!

She seemed fine at the time, and I didn't think about it.

It could have been worse. There was NO fat in those summer sausages,
because they were homemade. No greasy texture, and much better than
any you buy. Because there was no fat, I had figured pancreatits
wasn't going to be a factor.

Wrong again.

-------------------------

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >

Hey shit for brains? Eatin kats won't cause peritonitis:

From: diddy
(*.@nospam.diddy.net)
Subject: Re: What would you do in this situation?
Date: 2002-05-31 14:49:22 PST

Actually, I borrowed the vets office kitten once for a
couple days for school education on pet care and safe
handling as well as responsible pet ownership.
I kept the kitten over night in a crate within a crate
and yet my dog (yes, Angelic Danny, as well as Taya
and Toby tore that kittne to threads from between the
crate bars. (apparently he stuck his paws through the
crate to bat at the dogs. I was out doing yard work
and rushed in to find the little kittens pieces and
parts being torn through by ALL the dogs.

I called my girl friend to come get my dogs. I screamed
displeasure, and stalked out with the kitten. Danny, et
al spent 3 days in a kennel until I finally felt like I
could interact with them without doing bodily harm. All
three dogs were never touched, but knew they had done
something so unspeakable that I wouldn't associate with
them and they got banished.

To this day, Taya (mom and Dad's dog) and Danny will not
look at a cat. When confronted with one, Danny wees
himself and cowers hiding behind me for help.

I'm not saying this would work this way with all dogs, But mom
and dad now have a house cat, and she has never been
harmed by any of the dogs. Danny is there all the time,
unsupervised, and has no interest in harming the cat.

------------------------------

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >

Here's diddler trainin her neighbor's dog to stay HOWETA her garbage:

From: diddy (di...@diddy.net)
Subject: Re: Dog Shot, Neighbor Charged, Anchorage AK

I guess if I felt Danny was threatened, it's the way I would react.
There would be none left standing to deal with the threat just in
case.

If someone hurt him, I would not let borders or
continents stop me from pursuing justice.

Then again, I always feed Danny INSIDE. If someone is feeding
his dog outside, his own dog might not mean THAT much to him.

If he was feeding his dog outside though, many dogs are food
aggressive, and that could most certainly spark a dog aggression
thing. (and if the dog was penned quietly outside, what was it
doing in his yard?)

I shot a neighbors dog one night for chasing my horses and called
him to help me find it. I would do the same for threatening my dog.

My husband shot a dog that had been tearing up trash up and down
our road for years making an unbelievable mess. When we finally
killed the culprit, the whole road cheered. Animal control had never
been able in years to catch this critter. (we think it was feral it
was certainly unkempt enough to have been....and it had been shot
at by MANY of the neighbors, but it never frightened it off enough
to keep it from NOT tearing up the road the next trash day)

---------------

> She is very trainable and remembers unpleasant consequences very well.

Yeah. That's a RARE quality here abHOWETS <{}: ~ ( >

> Thanks for any help.

You're welcome <{}: ~ ) >

> Tom
> tginkel@mchsi.com


Date: December 29, 2006 5:47 AM

Subject: Re: Dog chewing up floors

in thread news:aad9p2hg0aei5nijqludfvqhb8g1l0jsaj@4ax.com:
Paula <mmmtobler...@earthlink.ent> whittled the following
words:

> I, for one, am glad that the Puppy Wizard comes across
> as a complete loon given what his advice is since it
> makes it less likely that people will take it instead
> of the advice of someone else I think gives better advice.

For the record, The Puppy wizard over-rates himself. But
"his" (tm) methods are pretty much tried and true methods
that trainers have used and some still use today.

There are better methods out there now. But the ones posted
in his manual (now that he has removed the advice to SPIKE
a dog's temperature to dangerous levels) are sound. they work..
no matter what we think of the puppy-wizard and his packaging...
"his methods" <cough> are just as valid as anyone else's

"His methods" can stand some updating, and he definitely
needs to look at some repackaging.

Hopefully others add a slicker delivery to grab attention,
but truthfully, when you look at the cat fights that go on
here, and stand back and watch in perspective, it's rather
hard to determine the sane ones from the lunatics.

In fact, an awful lot of people here come off looking
rather tainted. A person needs to have a good filtering
device to sort out the noise.

TPW just has a problem that's too painfully obvious.

--------------------

SEE??



Rocky
2008-07-31 14:19:37 EST
"Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@mchsi.com> said in
rec.pets.dogs.breeds:

[Follow-ups set to rec.pets.dogs.behavior]

> I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog, but often
> goes to the fence and barks excessively.

What do you currently do to stop this behaviour?

> A little barking is good,

In this case, I'd say that a little barking is not good. Dogs
deal easiest with black and white, and a little barking is
still barking.

> but I don't want to alienate the neighbors with
> constant yapping.

A very good goal. Some dog owners don't consider their
neighbours.

> Will an anti-bark collar help?

No. I have no problem with remote e-collars used properly,
but bark collars (set off by the bark) may lead to an
unintended increase in your fence fighting issue.

> She is
> very trainable and remembers unpleasant consequences very
> well.

Train her, then. A bark collar doesn't train.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

Bad Puppy
2008-07-31 14:25:39 EST

"Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:xLmkk.223490$TT4.169005@attbi_s22...
>I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog, but often goes to the
>fence and barks excessively. A little barking is good, but I don't want to
>alienate the neighbors with constant yapping. Will an anti-bark collar
>help? She is very trainable and remembers unpleasant consequences very
>well.
>
> Thanks for any help.
>
> Tom
> tginkel@mchsi.com

From: Shelley (shelleylisab...@yaNOSPAMhoo.com)
Subject: Re: no bark training revisited
Date: 2003-11-06 14:50:21 PST



>Typically, the dog stops barking within seconds.


I have to disagree with this. Not our dog. We tried
one (and never will again). When the doorbell rang,
he would tear over to the door and bark and bark
and bark with this collar on.

He'd end up screaming in pain and it continue to
zap him until it hit its maximum.


I will never torture my dog like that again.


--
Shelley & Rusty
http://www.bump.us/rusty


------------------------------

BARK! ZAP! SCREAM...ZAP ...SCREAM...ZAP... SCREAM...
ZAP... SCREAM...ZAP...SCREAM...ZAP ...SCREAM



"Susan Fraser" <chinch...@aol.comdog> wrote in message
news:20020208201202.29997.00000402@mb-md.aol.com...

> >Did you try it on your throat? Not very pleasant.

> Umm, yes. As a matter of fact, I did. It the sensation is actually much
> milder than it is on the palm, which has sweat glands and so conducts
> more.



You're full of crap.



"JC" <J...@nowhere.org> wrote in message
news:cUr17.3891$bs2.550009@news20.bellglobal.com...

A friend of mine told this story about his experience with a
shock-collar:

Jim's sister-in-law had a shock collar she wanted to use on
her dog stop it from barking. Not being very technical, she
brought it over for Jim to assemble and adjust. Jim got it all
put together and decided to try it on himself to see which
setting would be most appropriate.

With the collar around his neck, set on minimum, Jim tried
a little bark... woof.

Nothing.... Woof Woof. Nothing.... Bark. Nothing.... Bark
Bark. Nothing... BARK! ZAP! The collar worked! Unfortunately,
the zap was painful enough to make Jim scream with pain,
which the collar interpreted as another bark, which lead to
another ZAP!

Which made Jim scream again...

ZAP...SCREAM...ZAP...SCREAM... Eventually, Jim got the
collar off but it never survived the chance to end up on
the dog.

(Names have been changed to protect the stupid) : )

--------------------

>From the Dayton Daily News: 05.05.2001]
Lawsuit on dog's behalf could set legal precedent

Electrified collar burned family pet


By Cathy Mong
Dayton Daily News


VANDALIA | A civil lawsuit filed by a Vandalia family on
behalf of its injured dog could set legal precedent in Ohio,
says Dayton attorney Paul R. Leonard, an avowed animal
lover who wants the state to toughen its penalties for
abuse of pets.


Leonard, former Dayton mayor and state legislator in the
1970s, said the case of Boomer, a 4-year-old rambunctious
golden retriever burned by an electrified collar, is the first to
be filed by his newly formed Center for Animal Law and Advocacy.


The lawsuit, brought by Andrew and Alyce Pacher and
their children, Andrew III, and Sarah, against Invisible
Fence of Dayton, is set for a pretrial conference May
17 in Montgomery County Common Pleas Court.


Leonard, who has studied animal law the past 18 months
through Lewis and Clark College in Portland, Ore., is
incorporating his center as a nonprofit organization.
He said he hopes Boomer's case can put some bite into
what he describes as antiquated criminal laws regarding
animal cruelty.


Scott G. Oxley, the lawyer for the Centerville fence company,
has filed a motion to dismiss three of the five counts in the
lawsuit because he said that, under Ohio law, companion
animals are considered personal property.


"This (lawsuit) was filed by Boomer, that's how I read it,"
Oxley said. "It's my opinion that it's clear dogs cannot sue
under Ohio law. I would be surprised if a court would extend
to this dog an ability to file a lawsuit."


Leonard said Oxley is correct, but he's going to court because
the legislature has not toughened criminal laws. Leonard said
his center's focus is to use the civil courts to collect damages
when animals have been intentionally harmed or suffered from
someone's negligence.


"If judges aren't going to penalize them criminally, we'll go
after pocketbooks," Leonard said.


Leonard said "Animal-friendly" legislation gets "little or no
serious consideration" by lawmakers, "but I think the
movement is getting stronger. People are treating animals
more like family and less like property. I think the votes are
there."


Although 27 states recognize forms of inhumane and cruel
treatment of animals as felonies, Ohio does not. Only
Tennessee limits awards in civil lawsuits - $4,000 - based
on emotional distress and loss of companionship of a pet.


Ohio House Bill 108, introduced last year to increase
penalties for people who are abusive or cruel to companion
animals, died in committee, said Kevin Usilton, executive
director of the Humane Society of Greater Dayton. Ohio's
existing animal welfare laws have remained virtually
unchanged for 125 years and are among the country's
worst, he said.


The Pachers' lawsuit claims the fence company's negligence
caused Boomer to suffer psychological damage and physical
injuries.


The Pachers purchased Invisible Fence of Dayton's "Top Dog
Package," which cost $1,527.80 and advertised "praise-based
training" in its "classic conditioning techniques with radio
technology." An electrical wire is buried in the yard and the
dog wears a special collar that shocks the dog with electricity
if it goes beyond the fence.


Boomer repeatedly escaped the Pachers' back yard after
the fence was installed so the company's "pet consultant"
told the Pachers that Boomer needed sandbags attached
to his collar to slow him down so he'd get a "greater
correction " - a more prolonged zap of electricity transmitted
through a metal-pronged collar, according to court papers.


After a month, the Pachers asked for another consultation,
and this time a second collar - providing a total of six metal
prongs - was placed by the company representative snugly
around Boomer's neck, and the amount of electricity was
increased, the lawsuit states.


According to the Pachers' veterinarian, Boomer received
second-degree burns on his neck.


Usilton said the voltage appears to be a "brutal amount of
(electrical) charge to cause that kind of pain and injury,"
and said Boomer's owners should bear some responsibility
for the injuries.


Nevertheless, Usilton said the case might "bring to light the
stupid, antiquated laws" governing companion animals in Ohio.






Bad Puppy
2008-07-31 16:57:27 EST
HOWEDY matty you pathetic miserable stinkin
rotten lyin dog abusin punk thug coward active
acute chronic life-long incurable malignant malici-
HOWES mental case and illegal doggy day care
operator FRAUD and SCAM ARTIST,

"Rocky" <3dogs@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message
news:Fri9AEC82F33795Caustralianshepherdca@rocky-dog.com...
> Janet Boss <janet@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> said in
> rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
>
>> Rocky <3dogs@rocky-dog.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> but bark collars (set off by the bark) may lead to an
>>> unintended increase in your fence fighting issue.

You mean on accHOWENTA it HURTS the dog
when IT is AFRAID of sumpthin, matty?

>> I've found the opposite to be true. I use(d) a bark box
>> device though, so both MY dog and the dog behind me got
>> corrected at the same time.

OR you could just jerk an choke IT by hand.

LIKE THIS:

"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt

Or you could just SHOCK them.

LIKE THIS:

"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@mb-m18.aol.com...

He was next to me and I could see his neck
muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
Janet Boss

"sionnach" <rhyfe...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@ID-45033.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@mb-m17.aol.com...
> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher than a 5
> > > with it, even with an insensitive dog like a Lab.

An INSENSITIVE DOG???

> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
> > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.

Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?

janet CONtinues:
> > My dogs are not human children wearing fur- they are
> > DOGS. I don't have anything against electronic bark
> > collars, but they should be used in conjunction with
> > actually working at training your dog(s).

They're DUMB ANIMALS these MENTALLY ILL LYING
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.

-------------------

> That's an entirely different situation.

That so? Oh, you mean LIKE THIS:

"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92FEEC097E4AAaustralianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
>
> Linda wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> > When you compare using sound and
> > praise to solve a problem with using
> > shock collars, hanging, and punishment
> > how can you criticize the use of sound?

> There's nothing more to be said, then.
> You've made up your mind.

> But you've impressed me by mentioning

> that you're a professor with 30 years of
> experience.
\
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
>> I do know that hitting, hurting your dog
>> will often make the dog either aggressive
>> or a fear biter, neither of which we want
>> to do.
>
> And neither does anyone else, Jerome.
> No matter what Jerry Howe states.
>
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> BUT, giving you the benefit of the
> doubt, please provide a quote (an
> original quote, not from one of Jerry
> Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that
> shows a regular poster promoting or
> using an abusive form of training.
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of
> which you have read so many. While you're going
> through them, point out those which recommend
> shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you.
> --
> -Matt. Rocky's a Dog

In the followin SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH STUDY you may
substitute pronged spiked pinch or slip choke collars for shock
and add PUNISHMENT, SCOLDING, CRATING, and offering
and witholding rewards, attention, and affection:

Psychological Effects

At issue is the question, --Do electronic training
devices elicit psychological responses?

"This section cites several research studies in which the
psychological impact of the use of electronic training devices
was analyzed. It is difficult, at best, for anyone to determine
the full psychological effect of these devices or training methods
until we can agree on exactly what constitutes a stress signal in
a domestic dog. Not only do none of the researchers agree on
what it is, but it varies from dog to dog.

It is even more difficult for humans to determine the full effect
of shock on a dog (or any animal) due to the animal's hard-wired
need to hide pain in order to survive in the wild.

Training dogs with the help of the shock collar: Short and long
term behavioral effects. (Schilder, M. & van der Borga, J. (2004).
Applied Animal Behavior Science, 85, 319-334).

The goal of this study was to determine the behavioral changes in
dogs during training using electronic training collars. Thirty-two
dogs were divided into two groups, each receiving both general
obedience and protection training.

One group was trained with shock collars and the other group
without shock collars. The dogs trained with the shock collars
displayed signs of stress: lowering of body posture, high-pitched
yelps, barks and squeals, avoidance, redirected aggression, and
tongue flicking.

It was also noted by the authors that, even during play and relaxed
walking, the group of dogs trained with shock collars continued to
show signs of stress while in the company of their handler.

The authors concluded that shock-collar training is stressful;
receiving shocks is a painful experience to dogs; and the shock
group of dogs evidently learned that the presence of their owner
(or his commands) announced the reception of shocks, even
outside of the normal training context.

They suggest that the welfare of these shocked dogs is at
stake, at least in the presence of their owners.

This study has come under considerable fire because the experience
of the handlers and dogs is not clear, and the level of shock is not
stated. With that said, it does suggest that dogs are stressed by the
experience of being shocked during training.

---------------------

> I'm talking about apparent fence fighting,
> where both dogs are aggressing

ALL aggression is FEAR. ALL FEAR is CAUSED BY MISHANDLING.

LIKE THIS:

B.F. Skinner: Re-evaluation of Punishment:
Punishment, unfortunately traditionally overused,
actually has been proven not effective at long-
term behavioral change, and creatures will find
other ways of getting what it wants. In "Freedom
and the control of men" American Scholar, Winter
1955-56, 25, 47-65. 1956 he states:

If we no longer resort to torture in what we call
the civilized world, we nevertheless still make
extensive use of punitive techniques in both
domestic and foreign relations. And apparently for
good reasons. Nature if not God has created man
in such a way that he can be controlled punitively.

People quickly become skillful punishers (if not,
thereby, skillful controllers), whereas alternative
positive measures are not easily learned.

The need for punishment seems to have the support
of history, and alternative practices threaten the
cherished values of freedom and dignity.

Fear involved with punishment causes frustration:
with typical results loathing, hostility and apathy.
Skinner's teaching on the superiority of posittive
reinforcement's benefits for keeping desired behavior
have proved very valuable.

----------------------------

"Despite Skinner's clear denunciation of "negative
reinforcement" (1958) NEARLY EVER LEARNING
THEORY model involves the USE OF PUNISHMENT.
Of curse, Skinner has never to my knowledge, demonstrated
HOWE we escape the phenomenon that an expected
reward not received is experienced as a punishment
and can produce extensive and persistent aggression
(Azrin et al, 1966)."

"Motivation Of The Resistance To Coercion "-- PAVLOV:

"Reflexes of purpose and freedom" in the comparative
physiology of higher nervous activity, Institute of
Higher Nervous Activity and Neurophysiology, Academy
of Sciences, Moscow:

The most complex unconditioned "reflexes of aim and
freedom," discovered by I.P. Pavlov, are compared
with the "competence drive" and the "motivation of the
resistance to coercion," respectively, described by
contemporary ethologists.

On the basis of the unconditioned "reflex of purpose,"
conditioned reflexes were developed in which positive
emotions arising in connection with the perfection of
a skill, irrespective of its pragmatic significance at
a given moment, serve as the reinforcement.

The unconditioned "reflex of freedom" is regarded as a
phylogenetic precursor of the will, and its acute extinction
as the physiological mechanism of hypnosis. It was
demonstrated experimentally that the appearance of the
state of "animal hypnosis" (immobilization catatonia) in
rabbits is accompanied by the predominance of electrical
activity and heat production in the right hemisphere, i.e.,
by symptoms which are found in hypnosis in man.

Simonov PV</h4>
Publication Types:<ul><li>Review</li><li>Review,
tutorial</li></ul>PMID: 2215892, UI: 91015681</blockquote>
<doctype>

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-post/Entrez/query?uid=2215892&am
p;form=6&amp;db=m&amp;Dopt=bNeurosciBehavPhysiol1990May-Jun;
20(3):230-5

"...all the highest nervous activity, as it manifests
itself in the conditional reflex, consists of a continual
change of these three fundamental processes -- excitation,
inhibition and disinhibition," Ivan P. Pavlov

> and only yours is getting corrected -

You mean HURT and INTIMIDATED, don't you, matty <{}: ~ ( >

"Postitive emotions arising in connection
with the perfection of a skill, irrespective
of its pragmatic significance at a given
moment, serve as the reinforcement. IOW,
emotions, not outside rewards, are what
reinforces any behavior," Ivan Pavlov.

Sam Corson, Pavlov's Last Student Demonstrated At UofOH,
That Rehabilitation Of Hyperactive Dogs Can Easily And
Readily Be Done Using TLC. Tender Loving Care Is At The
Root Of The Scientific Management Of Doggies.

"All animals learn best through play," Lorenz.

> and with no idea where the zap is coming from.

Yeah. THAT'S HOWE COME you're suppHOWESED
to CONdition the dog to wearin the SHOCK collar for
a week or two PRYOR to GETTIN BURNED <{}: ~ ( >

OtherWIZE the dog will get "COLLAR WIZE" and
you won't be able to DISTRACT the dog when you
HURT IT AGAIN <{}'; ~ ) >

Of curse, you could just HURT and INTIMIDATE IT by hand.

LIKE THIS:

"Warning: Sometimes The Corrections Will Seem
Quite Harsh And Cause You To Cringe. This Is
A Normal Reaction The First Few Times It Happens,
But You'll Get Over It." mike duforth,
author: "CourteHOWES Canine."

"I have heard advice stating that you should pre-load
your dog for Bitter Apple for it to work as efficiently
as possible. What does this mean?

When you bring home the Bitter Apple for the first
time, spray one squirt directly into the dog's mouth
and walk away. The dog won't be too thrilled with
this but just ignore him and continue your normal
behavior."
--Mike Dufort
author of the zero selling book
"CourteHOWES Canines"

Janet B wrote:
> On Fri, 02 Dec 2005 14:44:14 -0500, Janet B
> <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com>, clicked their
> heels and said:

> Since you quoted me repeatedly, where does it say
> I beat dogs, choke dogs, scream at dogs, etc? Thanks
> for your clarification.

responding to my own post, I had to go back and look
at the original post, to remind myself what "we" are all
accused of doing:

"screaming, choking,
shocking, pinching, beating
the living crap out of your dogs"

Scream? no
Choke? no
Shock? e-collars are a lot more sophisticated than that
Pinch? if you want to classify a momentary discomfort
by a prong collar, go ahead, but unless you have first
hand experience with one, your opinion means nothing

Beat the living crap out of? hardly - no hitting exists

Janet.

lying frosty dahl writes:
"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.

With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'

Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.

Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,

Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.

Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in importance.

but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch

You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;

even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that

Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.

if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.

Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.

Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"

--------------------

"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And
Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump
With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl,
discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.

"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It
A Sharp Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack
Wouldn't Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't
Take It. I Still Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear
He Might Eat My Cat," melanie.

captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK" Makes A
Resounding Sound Distraction: "When You Chuck The Dog
The Sound Will Travel Up The Mandible To The Ears And
Give A Popping Sound To The Dog."

"Many People Have Problems Getting The Pinch
Right, Either They Do Not Pinch Enough, Or They
Have A Very Stoic Dog. Some Dogs Will Collapse
Into A Heap. About The Ear Pinch: You Must Keep
The Pressure Up," sindy "don't let the dog SCREAM"
mooreon, author of HOWER FAQ's pages on k9 web.

"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds To Pain
And Punishment, High Tolerance For Correction, Escalation
Of Correction To A Level Where The Dog Yelps When You
Punish Him, Thus Making The Experience One Which The
Dog Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon, RAAF.

On 26 Jun 2005 10:52:42 -0700, lucyaa...@claque.net, wrote:

> What does the "choke" in the "choke chain" stand for, then?
> Lucy

one reason I call them slip collars. Their is a correction involved,
and while it causes momentary discomfort, does not choke the dog.
OTOH, it is CAPABLE fo being used to do that, should a situation
warrant it.
--
Janet B
--------------------

From: "Deltones" <vibrov...@hotmail.com>
Date: 2 Dec 2005 10:55:41 -0800
Subject: Re: In defense of Jerry Howe's methods

Mary Healey wrote:
> I'm still asking for 5 original posts from people here at least
> 5 years to support your initial contention (NOT HURTING
> DOGS TO TRAIN THEM).

You're 0 for 2, so far.
That's 2 in 2 as far as I'm concerned but hey, if you insist. I'm
really curious to see what will be the justification this time. So
far we have:

Limited choking? Hey, it's limited, As
Neo would say: Woah, there is no choke.

Dogs pumped full of prozac? Hey, they're trippin
man. Remember Woodstock. Euh.... Woodwhat?

E-Collar? I'm sure some of you will come up with: But my
dog look so pretty with an electrified perm. Swoooon.

So on with the fun. Taken from the "Collars" thread,
started by Perry Templeton June 20 2005

Denis
------------

And here's another one from the same author, taken from the same thread:

167. Janet B
Jun 21, 12:03 pm show options
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 21:40:11 +0100, "Alison"

<*.@XYZallofus2.fsnet.co.uk>, wrote:
> I'm just wondering why you had to use choke chains to
> "train"your dogs especially as they are so small.

Oh geez - let's see - how many JRTs act like alligators
at the end of a leash? I personally prefer prong collars.

----------------

Let's go for the hat trick with the same author, taken from the same thread:

141. Janet B
Jun 27, 10:01 pm

I don't use choke chains. Not quite true - I use a jeweler's hex link
on Franklin at times - it's puuuuuurty. I know the "sound" thing
and all, and when training a dog in a non-group setting, that sound
may be a factor, but I think it fails in the context of a group class.

So, I prefer the better fitting nylon slip collars, and very often,
pinch collars (small link unless it's a freaky dog, then they need
the milder medium link).

But I use e-collars too. With one of my dogs and with some clients.
For circumstances where a physical collar and leash is not the right
answer. I'm sure Lucy has no clue what THAT means!
--
Janet B
----------------

> A bark collar could easily escalate this situation.

Yeah. We wouldn't wanna scare the dog.

Author and professional dog trainer LeeCharlesKelley wrote:

Thanks, Jerry, that's a helpful bit from the guy
who started it all. This shows what we've been
saying: that teaching the dog to play fetch,
regardless of its usefulness in the eventual
search part of the training program, is a
powerful motivator and reinforcer.

Of course these idiots (pardon my being blunt)
don't see using food and clickers as being a
form of coercion. Maybe they've been hypnotized
by Karen Pryor, et al:

Freeze Frame <{}: ~ ) >

From: canis55 <cani...@my-deja.com>
Date: 1999/09/28
Subject: Dear Marilyn Re. Ness

Dear Marilyn,

I just visited your updated site. The two Ness pages are great.
Freezing the video frames to reveal the emotional impact a
leash correction has on a dog was a wonderful idea.

Lee Kelley did something similar to a Brian Kilcommon video.

The difference is we were focusing on the emotional impact a
leash correction has on the trainer. When you do this to a training
video you can clearly see the tremendous emotional charge some
of these trainers are getting from hurting dogs.

It's a strange business, this dog training. I wonder what motivates
any of us to engage in it. I'm suspicious of anyone who says they
do it because they love dogs. I know a lot of people who claim to
love what dogs represent to them, and yet they don't become trainers.

I don't think this is because they love something else more.

I think there is a difference between loving what dogs represent
to us and loving what training them creates in us or even creates
in them for that matter.

It's a complicated process and perhaps many of us have lost sight
of what we're doing. I read books and articles that matter of factly
explain how to systematically inflict pain on dogs in an effort to
create a desire to perform tasks that I often see dogs performing of
their own accord. I know many of these behaviors can be shaped
and encouraged to the same degree of reliability without all the
violence and pain.

Where they can't (if that's the case), I wonder why we think
a dog should perform a task that is so repugnant to its nature,
that we must resort to violence and coercion to compel them
to participate.

Maybe I have far too much respect for dogs, but when I read
this stuff it sounds like slavery and involuntary servitude to me.

I can't see much difference between what we're doing to them
(for their own good) and what my country men did to the African
peoples for nearly half a century.

It's hard for me to accept that I'm surrounded by so much
madness, but I have to go with my heart on this one. Most
of what we demand from dogs--if not all of it--will be offered
willingly and enthusiastically if we only learn how to request
it in a manner they can comprehend.

If it turns out that I have to attack a dog to get it to do or to not do
something, then maybe the dog isn't supposed to do what I think it
should.

The whole thing's so complicated that I can't really express it. I
just know I don't like some of the stuff I'm seeing or reading about.
--
I trains'em as I sees'em.

----------------


HOWE COME would matty set his INFORMATIVE POSTS to
EXXXPIRE in six days like elegy, montana, diddler, professora
melanie chang, cindy title moore of k9web.com, and not so happy,
not so handsome, not so gentle jackass, not even jack morrison,
a.k.a. BIG DADDY a.k.a. DOGMAN a.k.a. tommy sorenson of
sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL and SHOCK COLLAR SALES??

Are they EMBARRASSED by their own words, the lyin animal
murderin punk thug coward mental cases frauds an SCAM ARTISTS?

matty aka Rocky EXXXPLAINS HOWE COME:

"Rocky" <2d...@rocky-dog.com> wrote
For reasons I'll only explain privately, I've gone no
archive, and it's a shame. Once in a while, while
looking for something else, I'll run into an old post
of mine. What an idiotic response! Whoops.

BWEEEAAAHAHAAAHAAHAAA!~!~!

You wanna see matty's 'obviHOWES LIES' and IDIOTIC RESPONSES??

Here's more from your PAL matty:

From: Rocky <2dogsREM...@rocky-dog.com.invalid>
Date: 24 Jul 2004 04:00:53 GMT
Local: Fri, Jul 23 2004 11:00 pm
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?

Cam said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> Everything he preaches is very positive, no
> correction, no punishment, all praise and love.

You are very wrong.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

From: Rocky <2d...@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 23 Nov 2003 02:40:42 GMT
Subject: Re: house training

steve braun said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> I dont like the insinuations that i am abusing
> my dog when i am NOT.

Then you may want to ignore the Puppy Wizard/Jerry Howe.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

From: Rocky <3da...@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 16 Aug 2002 18:40:54 GMT
Subject: Re: training a dog...
nancyj wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> The pressure meant a GOOD possibility if she could
> just push up hard enough, I'd understand. I did
> eventually <G>. I switched to a light tap!

Yup, once a dog learns to sit, a light tap
works as a reminder when they "forget".
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

But "NEVER HIT your dog", eh, matty?

From: "Nevyn" <greatd...@badmama.com.au>
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 20:05:45 +0800

Subject: Re: puppy wizzards training manual.

G'DAY STEVE.

I used to be like you.

Then I found a book...it was called... the
wits end dog training manual.... and then
there was light..and perfectly trained dogs.
--
Thankyou,
Nevyn
Nevyn E.D.
Veterinary Nurse & Animal Trainer
g*.@badmama.com.au

"Yu agonna get whats comin' to you...for
all the bad bad things you to do your...dog"
________________________

"steve braun" <twopointerp...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:2d60c10a.0311231915.68b1241d@posting.google.com...

> twopointerp...@aol.com (steve braun) wrote in message
<news:2d60c10a.0311231219.d2cf140@posting.google.com>...

> > Hello, Mr. puppy wizzard, how do i find a copy of
> > your manual. Do you have a link that takes me to it?
>
> > I think i would like to read it.
>
> > Now i have another question for you in regards to
> > walking your dog. How do you feel about the gentle
> > leader? I bought one for each of my pups and the
> > difference in walking them is unbelievable. If you are
> > not sure what the gentle leader is check out their web
> > site at www.premier.com. If you are as good as you say
> > you are i want to read your manual.
> > thanks,
> > Steve

> > P.s. by the way my pup doesnt pee as soon as i put
> > him in his crate its after he's been in for a while
> > and cant hold it anymore that he pee's

> Howdy, jerry,
> well i started reading your manual, Im going to
> perfectly honest with you I thought last night when
> i started reading your posts you were full of crap
> but the more i read the more i could tell that you
> really do care about dogs. That is why asked for
> a copy of your manual.
>
> I really like your analogy on barking that was very
> interesting and gave it a perspective i never even thought
> of. As far as your praising the dogs when they are
> misbehaving i still dont understand how that works (i
> didnt get all that far in the manual yet.
>
> But i must say my female was clawing at the couch so i
> praised her like you say to do, i praised her twice for
> it and she stopped and came over to me.
>
> So i think what you have to say has merit, And for one
> am anxious to finish the book and get started because
> i love my dogs and really am looking forward to interacting
> with them on a positive note all of the time.
>
> This may be a little premature jerry, but
> Thank you
> Steve

Rocky wrote:
> Robin said in rec.pets.dogs.health:
> > Jerry, you give the lying dog abusing punk thug coward
> > mental cases too much credit for the ability to influence

Naaah, The Amazing Puppy Wizard was just BAITING these lying
dog abusing punk thug coward mental cases again <{); ~ ) >

> You really are a piece of work.

INDEEDY, matty. Robin studied and followed the INSTRUCTIONS
in her FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual and REPORTED
her 100% NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS RIGHT HERE on The
Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums And SCHOOL Of HARD KNOCKS
And HUMAN And ANIMAL BEHAVIOR RESEARCH
LABORATORIES, matty <{); ~ ) >

You're settin in it <{); ~ ) >

> Keep this out of the health groups, 'kay?

Dogs DIE from separation anXXXIHOWESNESS, matty, JUST
LIKE HOWE your own DEATHLY ILL dog Rocky is DYIN from
STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE aka The Puppy
Wizard's SYNDROME, on accHOWENT of you're a lyin dog abusin
punk thug coward MENTAL CASE, matty, and you can't post here
abHOWETS nodoGgamenedMOORE <{); ~ ) >

> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92FEEC097E4AAaustralianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
>
> Linda wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> > When you compare using sound and
> > praise to solve a problem with using
> > shock collars, hanging, and punishment
> > how can you criticize the use of sound?

> There's nothing more to be said, then.
> You've made up your mind.

> But you've impressed me by mentioning

> that you're a professor with 30 years of
> experience.
\
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
>> I do know that hitting, hurting your dog
>> will often make the dog either aggressive
>> or a fear biter, neither of which we want
>> to do.
>
> And neither does anyone else, Jerome.
> No matter what Jerry Howe states.
>
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> BUT, giving you the benefit of the
> doubt, please provide a quote (an
> original quote, not from one of Jerry
> Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that
> shows a regular poster promoting or
> using an abusive form of training.
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of
> which you have read so many. While you're going
> through them, point out those which recommend
> shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you.
> --
> -Matt. Rocky's a Dog

> Rocky wrote:
> "Deltones" <vibrov...@hotmail.com> said in
> rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
>
> > After your defense of "Limited" choking, what
> > would be the point? Where I come from, choking
> > is choking. It's never limited.
>
> So, you can't point out abuse where none occurs.
> Thank you for your contribution.
>-
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

From: Rocky (2...@rocky-dog.com)
Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations
Date: 2004-10-19 19:42:54 PST

Melanie L Chang said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> I try really hard not to yell. The times that I have,
> Solo joined in and then lunged to the end of the
>leash.

Or, at the other end of the spectrum, Rocky cowers,
thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out"
others' dogs at agility trials or training.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

---------------

Sometimes my "voice of god" startles human
and dog, especially when the human didn't
see the inappropriate behaviour. --Matt.
Rocky's a Dog.

"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92C1EC10BFE7australianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
Rosa Palm\ufffdn wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> Anybody else got bilingual dogs?

Long ago my Hebrew was pretty good - but now I
only use "Chutza"(throat clearing 'ch') - "Out" when
it's reallyreally important that my dogs get away from
something.

"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * mch...@lppi.ucsf.edu
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/

From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 10 Jun 2003 18:00:45 GMT
Subject: Re: Absolutely abysmal agility day

Robin Nuttall said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior

> One of the things that frustrates methe most about
> agility is that people seem to think that ALL dogs
> are fragile, shrinking flowers who cannot be
> corrected in any way.

Well, maybe one day -- when Friday doesn't take
correction so much to heart -- I'll try something
different. Right now, he's just getting the confidence
to work a few jumps ahead of me.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

"I crate Rocky, even though he's 8.5 years old, but
only when I'm gone during summertime days -
maybe an hour at the most. (Other than hot days,
my dogs are always with me.)

While Friday has been totally reliable unsupervised
from the day I got him from a rescue, Rocky has not.

Rocky will go looking for food even in areas where
there's no possibility of food.

The good thing is that he likes his crate, runs for
it when I ask, and gets food when he's in it.
--
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAAA!!!

From: Rocky (mbon...@sunada.com)
Subject: Re: Leg Humper
Date: 1999/09/14

B*.@aol.com (Jerry Howe) wrote in
<*.@bellsouth.net>:

> By "sticking your knee up," I can only presume
> that you are suggesting that the people knee the
> dog in the chest. If that's what you meant, just
> say it, instead of beating around the bush to avoid
> criticism from people like me. That kind of crap has
> got to stop, and that's why I'm here, to help wean
> you guys off of the abuse and into the proper methods
> of dealing with behavior problems.

Jerry, I was appreciating your explanation
up until this last paragraph.

Why did you blow it?

--Matt

"dallygirl" <kwickw...@hotmail.com> said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many
>cases causing more harm than good.

Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are an
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.

It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

=============

BWEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!!

Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal sgt grant teebon, RAAF:

"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds
To Pain And Punishment, High Tolerance For
Correction, Escalation Of Correction To A Level
Where The Dog Yelps When You Punish Him,
Thus Making The Experience One Which The Dog
Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon,
RAAF.

Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal captain
arthur haggerty, USArmy K-9 Corps:

captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK"
Makes A ResoundingSound Distraction: "When
You Chuck The Dog The Sound Will Travel Up
The Mandible To The Ears And Give A Popping
Sound To The Dog."

lying frosty dahl writes:

"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.

With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'

Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.

Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,

Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.

Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in importance.

but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch

You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;

even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that

Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.

if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.

Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.

Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"

==============

"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"

Koehler On Correcting The Housebreaking Backslider.

"If the punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house. An indelible impression
can sometimes be made by giving the dog a hard
spanking of long duration, then leaving him tied by
the mess he's made so you can come back at twenty
minute intervals and punish him again for the same
thing. (Dogs are REALLY stupid. J.H.)

In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment. It will be better for your dog,
as well as the house, if you really pour it on him."

"Housebreaking Problems:

"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"

Occasionally, there is a pup who seems determined to
relieve himself inside the house, regardless of how
often he has the opportunity to go outside. This dog
may require punishment. Make certain he is equipped
with a collar and piece of line so he can't avoid
correction.

When you discover a mess, move in fast, take him to
the place of his error, and hold his head close enough
so that he associates his error with the punishment.
Punish him by spanking him with a light strap or
switch. Either one is better than a folded newspaper.

It is important to your future relationship that you
do not rush at him and start swinging before you get
hold of him.

When he's been spanked, take him outside. Chances
are, if you are careful in your feeding and close
observation, you will not have to do much punishing.

Be consistent in your handling.

To have a pup almost house-broken and then force
him to commit an error by not providing an opportunity
to go outside is very unfair. Careful planning will
make your job easier.

The same general techniques of housebreaking apply
to grown dogs that are inexperienced in the house.

For the grown dog who was reliable in the house and
then backslides, the method of correction differs
somewhat. In this group of "backsliders" we have the
"revenge piddler." This dog protests being alone by
messing on the floor and often in the middle of a bed.


The first step of correction is to confine the dog
closely in a part of the house when you go away, so
that he is constantly reminded of his obligation. The
fact that he once was reliable in the house is proof
that the dog knows right from wrong, and it leaves
you no other course than to punish him sufficiently
to convince him that the satisfaction of his
wrongdoing is not worth the consequences. If the
punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house.

An indelible impression can sometimes be made
by giving the dog a hard spanking of long duration,
then leaving him tied by the mess he's made so you
can come back at twenty minute intervals and punish
him again for the same thing.

In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment.

It will be better for your dog, as well as the house,
if you really pour it on him.

---------------------

AIN'T GOT NO AGENDAS HERE, SEE??




Bad Puppy
2008-08-01 11:11:08 EST
HOWEDY janet you pathetic miserable stinkin rotten lyin
animal murderin punk thug coward active acute chronic
life-long incurable malignant maliciHOWES mental case
and professional dog trainin FRAUD an SCAM ARTIST,

"Janet Boss" <janet@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> wrote in message
news:janet-CBBE2E.14344831072008@news.individual.net...
> In article <Fri9AEC7D73632B3australianshepherdca@rocky-dog.com>,
> Rocky <3dogs@rocky-dog.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> but bark collars (set off by the bark) may lead to an
>> unintended increase in your fence fighting issue.
>
> I've found the opposite to be true. I use(d) a bark box device though,
> so both MY dog and the dog behind me got corrected at the same time.

You mean it punishes both dogs at the same time so's
the dog you DIDN'T HURT won't feel jealHOWES?

> Lucy solo was responsive to command, but once the other dogs

Yeah. It's always "the other dogs".

> snarked at her first or in retaliation,

"In retaliation" for WHAAAT??

> I admit that she was selectively deaf.

You mean she IGNORES YOU when you tell
her to "SHUT UP!" or "LEAVE IT!" even when
you JERK an CHOKE an SHOCK IT <{}: ~ ( >

LIKE THIS:

"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
On 6 Feb 2006 17:41:08 GMT, Mary Healey
<*.@iastate.edu>,
clicked their heels and said:

> Does that include tone of voice?
> Some tools are easier to ban than others.

yes - screaming banshees are told to shut up! And I
always have to remind spouses that they may NOT do the
"honey - you're supposed to be doing it like THIS"......
--
Janet B
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

AND LIKE THIS:

"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt

Or you could just SHOCK them.

LIKE THIS:

"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@mb-m18.aol.com...

He was next to me and I could see his neck
muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
Janet Boss

"sionnach" <rhyfe...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@ID-45033.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@mb-m17.aol.com...
> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher than a 5
> > > with it, even with an insensitive dog like a Lab.

An INSENSITIVE DOG???

> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
> > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.

Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?

janet CONtinues:
> > My dogs are not human children wearing fur- they are
> > DOGS. I don't have anything against electronic bark
> > collars, but they should be used in conjunction with
> > actually working at training your dog(s).

They're DUMB ANIMALS these MENTALLY ILL LYING
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.

-------------------


LIKE THIS:

Here's janet boss and her REAL LIFE IN PERSON
"students" paul and his RESCUE dog Muttley whom
she wanted to MURDER:

Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@smart.net> wrote

It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),

Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death

"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@smart.net> wrote

Hello everyone:

If you have followed some of my posts, you know
something about the ongoing story of Muttley, the
large GSD/Chow dog I have been trying to adopt
or place in a better home.

I will add a bit more history later in this post.

Last Tuesday, toward the end of Janet's obedience
class, Muttley and I had just finished fairly successfully
performing a sit/stay/come routine, and then he was
sitting by my side.

The final routine was to be a "down", which Muttley
has had some difficulty with, and frankly I have not
had the time to work with him much on that.

I was kneeling at his side, trying to hold his collar
while pushing his front legs down to the position,
while he resisted. Suddenly he lunged, knocking
me over onto the parking lot, and I lost grip of the
leash as I reflexively broke my fall.

Muttley took the opportunity to attack a young black
male Lab to my left, and it was a very brutal attack.
Janet and the instructors tried to gain control, and as
soon as I could get to my feet I grabbed the leash and
pulled him off.

That was the end of the class, and the other dog,
Bernie, was taken to an animal hospital for treatment.

When everyone had left, Janet counseled me about
what should be done about Muttley.

She said this was more than ordinary aggression,
and only intensive (and expensive) one on one
training would have any chance at working, and
in any case, he was not suited to group training.

She advised me that Muttley could be dangerous,
and she recommended that he be euthanized.

"They can't all be saved".

<snip>

--------------

Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@smart.net> wrote

<snip>

If I did not have to worry about my cat, I would
probably keep him, and I am certain I could avoid
any more dangerous episodes. I probably would
not have taken him to obedience classes at this time
if that was not such a difficult issue, and if people
here had not essentially shamed me into doing so.

Then he would only be a bratty dog with a mind of
his own, but he would not have been identified as
dangerous.

--------------------------

BWEEEAAAHAHAHAHAAAA~!~!~!

Here's janet's REAL LIFE IN PERSON "student" paul:

#2 - 6/05/07

>> When I was training him under Janet's supervision I
>> was instructed to give it a ? firm yank as a correction.

> I advised you to use a prong collar, not give firm yanks
> on a chain choke collar. I hate the things.

>> She was able to get his attention with just a quick tug, but I
>> had to yank on it hard enough to lift him off his feet to get him
>> to respond.
>
>> Looking back now, I think it was based on his fear, which he
>> had for her (as an unknown), but not for me (whom he had
>> learned to trust).

> He wasn't afraid of me. He knew I was a confident trainer.
> Fear has no place in dog training, as I told you THEN.
> Janet.

It seems to me that applying stern corrections, by
popping a choker chain, prong collar, or whatever,
is a way to ensure compliance by instilling a fear
of further punishment.

Sure, if it is administered very consistently
by a confident trainer, the dog soon learns
to obey. There was no positive reinforcement,
so what remains is negative.



Also, I recall the time you were going to show me
how I could get Muttley to take his rawhide treat
from me without lunging for it. When you offered
it to him, he refused to take it. This IMHO is likely
a fear behavior.

Things have changed a lot since then, and I have
learned a lot, and Muttley has settled down quite
a bit. I probably still give him too much freedom
to think on his own, but that's just my way of
doing things, and that's probably not going to
change much. He may never win an obedience
medal, but I don't think he is dangerously out
of control, either.

Paul and Muttley

"I thought I was told that the way to get the dog to go
down was to make him sit and then step on the leash.
That was awkward and didn't seem to work.

I will confess that I only tried the "down" position
once or twice at home, and I also often used it
instead of "Off" when I wanted him to stop
jumping on me or elsewhere I didn't want him to be.

I had to give him corrections every few seconds,
and also just about kick him, to keep him at my
left side.

Muttley is really a very sweet and loving dog, but
he needs more socialization with other dogs. However,
it is very likely that I will have him put down in a week."

Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@smart.net> wrote

It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),

-----------------------

THAT'S quite a SUCCESS STORY, ain't it <{}: ~ ( >

HERE'S HOWE COME:

Subject: Re: redirected aggression
Date: 4/11/07

"Janet Boss" <ja...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> wrote in message
news:janet-730AB8.17321511042007@news.individual.net...

It seems I have been dealing with this a bit lately.
Dog to dog and dog to person,, with dogs who are
obviously overstimulated by what's in front of them.

What's in front of them varies from people at the door
to dogs in their path or directly in their face. The dogs
in question all have very poor self control.

I have dog(s) with not-so-great-natural self control,
so it's something we constantly work on. We don't
have redirected stuff going on, because we have enough
obedience to avoid it.

While I know that's the big answer for the dogs in
question as well, I'm curious what things people have
found useful to redirect/focus/gain attention from
drivey dogs or just very distracted of over-the-top dogs.

We're having success with my recommendations, but I'm
always open to something novel that may be the hot ticket.
--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

BWEEEAAAHAHAHAHAAAA~!~!~!

SEE?

AND LIKE THIS:


Here's a other of janet's REAL LIFE IN PERSON
"students" FOR THREE YEARS:

Subject: First Class was tonite

1 From: Nessa
Date: Tues, Jun 11 2002 8:32 pm
Email: Nessa <use...@nessa.info>

Tonite I started Janet's obedience class. It's
like NIGHT and DAY from the class Bagel 'flunked'.
I was amazed at the difference and I am very glad
Janet gave me the chance to attend her class.

I can't wait till PK on Saturday.

Nessa

------------------

Subject: Training...

1 From: Nessa
Date: Wed, Jun 12 2002 9:45 pm
Email: Nessa <use...@nessa.info>

well both my kids are asleep one on my left and
one on my right. Bagel has taken to running away
every chance he gets now so I have to be ever vigilant.

I have tried every type of collar around. Flat Buckle,
nylon lobster claw slip collar, harness, gentle leader.

Yesterday I watched him on a prong collar.

I SWORE I would NEVER use a prong collar.
He willingly sits to have it put on (as opposed
to fighting me when I put on the gentle leader).

He is no longer pulling on the leash when we walk.

Currently he is doing his 30 minute quiet period
next to my chair with it on since he is leashed and
he is out like a light. So is Hannah.

I tried to find them a place to play off leash tonight
since Bagel has become a happy wanderer and I
couldn't find a safe place so they didn't get as much
play as any of us would like.

I am doing my training with Janet and I am so happy.
Bagel did his sit downs tonight without much fuss and
Hannah watched from the crate. Then we let Hannah
do about 5 minutes of sit and down.

She's getting good at them.

I have been rewarding with treats and tonite I didn't
and they still did what I told them to do. with Bagel
on my left with his head facing front and Hannah on
my right with her head facing back I feel like I have
the most beautiful bookends in the world.

Life with a dog..... PRICELESS

Nessa
--
I don't have issues
I have subscriptions
www.nessa.info

---------------

From: Nessa
Date: Thurs, Jul 4 2002 8:22 am
Email: Nessa <use...@nessa.info>

On Thu, 4 Jul 2002 0:08:02 -0400, Jenn wrote
(in message <CSPU8.117216$Lf2.8604...@news2.calgary.shaw.ca>):

> That aside, I crate trained both my dogs
> successfully, and used the crate to house
> train them.

Bagel is so well crate trained that in the mornings when
I make his Kong, he runs to the crate and since I am not
crating him anymore (just confining him) but I am crating
Hannah, I have to pull him out of the crate and he does not
want to get out.

BTW housebreaking with Janet is going quite well.

Nessa

----------------

Subject: I went away for the weekend... big mistake

1 From: Nessa -
Date: Sun, Jul 21 2002 9:58 pm
Email: Nessa <use...@nessa.info>

I went away for the weekend and I think my
dog walker will never speak to me again.

Bagel escaped from the kitchen and ate about 10
pounds of puppy food and proceeded to deposit it
all over my house.

He esp. liked my living room sofa which was my
mothers as he pulled some cushions off of it and
literally stood on it and peed.

Yes I know my dog has issues and I know I need help.

I think my poor dog walker needs therapy now.

It was a rough dog weekend for her and not
just with my kids.

I didn't know until the last minute I was going
away and NEXT time, the furbabies will go to
furbaby camp for the weekend.

It was too much for them.

Well live and learn.

Meanwhile, I'm still glad I went on retreat.

My house will survive as things are not important.

Hannah still loves me and Bagel will talk
to me in a few days.....

Nessa

------------

From: Nessa (use...@nessa.info)
Subject: Re: Where we stand/sit/down/leave it Now

Date: 2003-09-17 14:14:51 PST
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 15:16:04 -0400,
Charlie Wilkes wrote (in message
<*.@4ax.com>):

> Yes, it's a huge improvement over shoving them
> in crates at night. But why does Bagel have to
> be leashed?

because he will wander the area (room if i close
the door or house if i don't) and pee and bark all
night long. but i said that already you must not
be reading for comprehension.
--
Nessa

=========

Subject: Night time barking.. Help needed
1 From: Nessa
Date: Wed, Sep 18 2002 5:50 am
Email: Nessa <use...@nessa.info>

Morning all,

Bagel and Hannah are doing well except for
night time barking in the house for play time.

Problem is it that when I am trying to sleep esp.
between 1 and 5. I CAN'T just let them bark it
out (because if I could it's no biggie and I can
sleep through it).

My problem is that my next door neighbors (I live in
a townhouse) don't appreciate it (and I can't blame them).

If they are very tired after a day at the park they tend
to sleep better but I can't get them to the park now
everyday because it gets dark earlier. I try to let them
run around a bit in the neighborhood with other dogs
but it's not enough.

oh that is when the owners and I are standing there.
we try to let them all play under supervision.

I can live with the banging (as Bagel slams Hannah
into the wall or Hannah throws one of her bones down
the uncarpeted steps and they waterfall down the steps
(there is no other way to describe dogs running down
wooden steps)

I know a tired dog is a good dog. I just don't know
what to do to hold off the barking. I know they are
playing and all I can think of is the line from the kids
book Go Dog Go (one of my favorites) is:

Now it is night
Sleep dogs sleep

(btw the drawing is of all these dogs sleeping in a big bed
on the pillows like humans with their party hats on)

I'm at the point where I am considering a soft muzzle to
prevent parking. Someone has offered the use of the
shock collar to teach no bark but I don't want to do that.

I'm too sleep deprived to do anything much.

HELP!!

Nessa
--
I don't have issues
I have subscriptions
www.nessa.info

2 From: J1Boss
Date: Wed, Sep 18 2002 7:48 am
Email: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)

Nessa wrote:
> Problem is it that when I am trying to sleep esp.
> between 1 and 5. I CAN'T just let them bark it
> out (because if I could it's no biggie
> and I can sleep through it).

What the (*&(*)(* are they doing awake between 1 and 5?

> I can live with the banging (as Bagel slams Hannah
> into the wall or Hannah throws one of her bones down
> the uncarpeted steps and they waterfall down the steps
> (there is no other way to describe dogs running down
> wooden steps)

Baby gate. Door.

Do NOT let them wander the house getting
more charged up.

> I'm too sleep deprived to do anything much.
> HELP!!

Nessa - I would seriously consider why these dogs
are up at 1-5 and even thinking they CAN be! They
need to be confined to your room, told firmly to knock
it off, and have that backed up with some sort of
correction if they don't.

If all else fails, tether then away from each other, but
honestly, if they aren't responsive to you telling them
to cut it out, we're back to the "bigger issues" problem.

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

Maybe she can't scream at her dogs at night?

nessa CONtinues:
> A few weeks ago it started at 5:30 am and it has become
> increasingly earlier until this morning he started at 4:00.
> Ignoring him has proven to be futile, as has calming him
> down and rewarding him with a treat and, as a last resort,
> spraying him with water from a plant sprayer.

> This morning I even put him in his crate and took him into
> the bathroom with me as I prepared for work (normally he
> stays in a x-pen in the kitchen) but he only calmed down
> for a few minutes before the whining began again.

A 1 year old should be hanging out with you. Overnight,
around the house, and heck, even neat the bathroom while
you get ready for work..
--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

Subject: Puppy license expires
1 From: Nessa
Date: Fri, Jul 26 2002 5:57 am
Email: Nessa <use...@nessa.info>

Yep, she is pretty much housebroken so I let her
out of the crate at night to sleep with me. But last
night, while I was asleep she ATE MY GLASSES.

It's my fault, I left them on the night table (where I
always leave them) so I could see when I got up.

I needed a new pair but I wanted to be able to get
them without having to miss work. Now, poof here
I am glassesless. thank goodness we have 1 hour
glass makers pretty close by.

Well she's crated now until this chewing phase is over.

Hannah will be 5 months old next week. Any advice
on how to deal with this other than the standard, no bite,
here chew this, crating, etc.

Nessa
--
I don't have issues
I have subscriptions
www.nessa.info

nessa's dogs got her EVICTED to boot <{}: ~ ( >

From: Nessa (ladybug0...@comcast.net)
Subject: Re: Sad News.. I need someone to take my dogs
Date: 2003-08-26 09:55:03 PST

well I'm not BLAMING my job it's ONE of MANY
things that I'm considering.

As for returning them to their respective shelters,
I don't want to split them up and I'm not going to
give them to just anyone. Possibly because I am
doing everything I can to keep them and drag this
mess out as long as possible in hopes that it will
work out.

=============

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

nessa's dogs TURNED ON HER an janet
GOT MAD at her for not MURDERIN
them at her FULL SERVICE SHELTER.

"Warning: Sometimes The Corrections Will Seem
Quite Harsh And Cause You To Cringe. This Is
A Normal Reaction The First Few Times It Happens,
But You'll Get Over It." mike duforth,
author: "CourteHOWES Canine."

"I have heard advice stating that you should pre-load
your dog for Bitter Apple for it to work as efficiently
as possible. What does this mean?

When you bring home the Bitter Apple for the first
time, spray one squirt directly into the dog's mouth
and walk away. The dog won't be too thrilled with
this but just ignore him and continue your normal
behavior."
--Mike Dufort
author of the zero selling book
"CourteHOWES Canines"

Janet B wrote:
> On Fri, 02 Dec 2005 14:44:14 -0500, Janet B
> <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com>, clicked their
> heels and said:

> Since you quoted me repeatedly, where does it say
> I beat dogs, choke dogs, scream at dogs, etc? Thanks
> for your clarification.

responding to my own post, I had to go back and look
at the original post, to remind myself what "we" are all
accused of doing:

"screaming, choking,
shocking, pinching, beating
the living crap out of your dogs"

Scream? no
Choke? no
Shock? e-collars are a lot more sophisticated than that
Pinch? if you want to classify a momentary discomfort
by a prong collar, go ahead, but unless you have first
hand experience with one, your opinion means nothing

Beat the living crap out of? hardly - no hitting exists

Janet.


lying frosty dahl writes:
"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.
With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'

Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.

Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,

Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.

Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in importance.

but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch

You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;

even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that

Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.

if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.


Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.

Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"

--------------------

"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And
Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump
With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl,
discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.

"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It
A Sharp Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack
Wouldn't Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't
Take It. I Still Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear
He Might Eat My Cat," melanie.

captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK" Makes A
ResoundingSound Distraction: "When You Chuck The Dog
The Sound Will Travel Up The Mandible To The Ears And
Give A Popping Sound To The Dog."

"Many People Have Problems Getting The Pinch
Right, Either They Do Not Pinch Enough, Or They
Have A Very Stoic Dog. Some Dogs Will Collapse
Into A Heap. About The Ear Pinch: You Must Keep
The Pressure Up," sindy "don't let the dog SCREAM"
mooreon, author of HOWER FAQ's pages on k9 web.

"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds To Pain
And Punishment, High Tolerance For Correction, Escalation
Of Correction To A Level Where The Dog Yelps When You
Punish Him, Thus Making The Experience One Which The
Dog Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon, RAAF.

On 26 Jun 2005 10:52:42 -0700, lucyaa...@claque.net, wrote:

> What does the "choke" in the "choke chain" stand for, then?
> Lucy

one reason I call them slip collars. Their is a correction involved,
and while it causes momentary discomfort, does not choke the dog.
OTOH, it is CAPABLE fo being used to do that, should a situation
warrant it.
--
Janet B
--------------------

From: "Deltones" <vibrov...@hotmail.com>
Date: 2 Dec 2005 10:55:41 -0800
Subject: Re: In defense of Jerry Howe's methods

Mary Healey wrote:
> I'm still asking for 5 original posts from people here at least
> 5 years to support your initial contention (NOT HURTING
> DOGS TO TRAIN THEM).

You're 0 for 2, so far.
That's 2 in 2 as far as I'm concerned but hey, if you insist. I'm
really curious to see what will be the justification this time. So
far we have:

Limited choking? Hey, it's limited, As
Neo would say: Woah, there is no choke.

Dogs pumped full of prozac? Hey, they're trippin
man. Remember Woodstock. Euh.... Woodwhat?

E-Collar? I'm sure some of you will come up with: But my
dog look so pretty with an electrified perm. Swoooon.

So on with the fun. Taken from the "Collars" thread,
started by Perry Templeton June 20 2005

Denis
------------

And here's another one from the same author, taken from the same thread:

167. Janet B
Jun 21, 12:03 pm show options
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 21:40:11 +0100, "Alison"

<*.@XYZallofus2.fsnet.co.uk>, wrote:
> I'm just wondering why you had to use choke chains to
> "train"your dogs especially as they are so small.

Oh geez - let's see - how many JRTs act like alligators
at the end of a leash? I personally prefer prong collars.

----------------

Let's go for the hat trick with the same author, taken from the same thread:

141. Janet B
Jun 27, 10:01 pm

I don't use choke chains. Not quite true - I use a jeweler's hex link
on Franklin at times - it's puuuuuurty. I know the "sound" thing
and all, and when training a dog in a non-group setting, that sound
may be a factor, but I think it fails in the context of a group class.

So, I prefer the better fitting nylon slip collars, and very often,
pinch collars (small link unless it's a freaky dog, then they need
the milder medium link).

But I use e-collars too. With one of my dogs and with some clients.
For circumstances where a physical collar and leash is not the right
answer. I'm sure Lucy has no clue what THAT means!
--
Janet B
----------------

Here's your PARTNER who heelped nessa "train" her
fear aggressive hyperactive HOWETA CON-TROLL
PROBABLY DEAD dogs:

"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"

sinofabitch writes:
> > What I have said- repeatedly - is that he took
> > posts from two different people,

Of curse THAT'S a lie.

> > took pieces of them out of context,

Of curse. QUOTED. You wanna see it in context?

> > cobbled them together,

No. There was WON DIRECT QUOTE.

> > then added his own words:

"Neatly," and "Smartly."

> > and a fake signature.

"sinofabitch" instead of sionnach.

> > Which is exactly what he did.

INDEEDY. That's HOWE COME you deny it.

> > The actual quote is misleading

That so?

> > when taken out of context,

We'd been talkin abHOWET beatin the dog with a shoe...

> > and Jerry's faked "quote"

The WON sinofabitch totally DENIES.

> > is downright meaningless.

Only if you're a MENTAL CASE.

> Here's Jerry's version
> "I Dropped The Leash, Threw My
> Right Arm Over The Lab's Shoulder,
> Grabbed Her Opposite Foot With My
> Left Hand, Rolled Her On Her Side,
> Leaned On Her, Smartly Growled Into
> Her Throat And Said "GRRRR!" And
> Neatly Nipped Her Ear," sinofabitch.
>
> Here's yours;
>
> "I dropped the leash, threw my
> right arm over the Lab's shoulder,
> grabbed her opposite foot with my
> left hand, rolled her on her side,
> leaned on her, said "GRRRR!" and
> nipped her ear.
> --Sara Sionnach

"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"

See?

"BethF" <b...@NOT-SO-bad-dawgs-in-ak.com>
wrote in message
news:v4r8kkfr257e1a@corp.supernews.com...

Kyle, FWIW, i thought it was pretty funny,
and i often call my little dog the turd, because
he is one. Some folks think its HORRRIBLE i
would insult my dog like that so i guess its just a
matter of personality.

Kyle, the best way to teach him to stay away is to
step on him once. Seriously.

"Whatever Motivates The Dog, But I Daresay Most
Of The Dogs I Have In Classes Just Aren't That
Interested In Praise."

"BethF" <d...@alaska.com> wrote in message
news:uohnj3r4a4e85e@corp.supernews.com...
Maybe that's what we should do - hold back the dobie
girl so that Izzy can put Simon in his place.

From: sionnach (rhyfe...@email.msn.com)
Subject: Re: Correct use of prong collar
Date: 2001-05-05 13:03:14 PST

> And Sally responded:
> > Who said that? I would never do or recommend
> > that, and neither would most of the regulars
> > on here.
> > Sally Hennessey

> I've posted my entire quote, since Patch failed
> to do so. Take it out of context and you'd think
> I was flinging puppies across the room!
> here's what I said (keep in mind that we're
> talking about a 12 week old ~25# FCR puppy):
> A small scruff shake is appropriate if he's very persistant.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Um, may I suggest a re-wording that might make
it clearer- given that "scruff shake" is too easily
misinterpreted as "pick the puppy up by the scruff
of the neck and shake the puppy in the air"?

I think I'd phrase it something like "if the puppy
is very persistant, it can be appropriate to take
hold of the loose skin at the back of the neck and
give a slight shake to the *skin*".

Janet's not talking about actually shaking
the puppy, which I think we ALL agree is
abusive."

----------------------

"After Numerous Training Classes, Behavioral
Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet
Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago
Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.

"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me.
I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia
tech at our local shelter for a while, and
I know a bit about overpopulation and
unwanted animals.


This however has nothing at all to do with
responsible breeders, because responsible
breeders don't contribute to that problem,"
Mustang Sally.

-----------------

BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!

Re: Dog Training - Common House Training Problems
In article 8vebt39mfcscgo3d138t0vshtth75uo...@4ax.com,
Maximus <molos...@molosserdogs.com> wrote:

Jerry,
Your Wits' End Training Method Manual has been a huge hit
with me and my website visitors. I don't know Howe you do
it but your methods are solid and they work. The members of
www.molosserdogs.com love it.

All the best.

Re: Dog Training - Common House Training Problems

"Janet Boss" <ja...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> wrote in message
> news:janet-898263.18060110032008@news.individual.net... Jerry,

Congratulations! You are a *******WINNER*******
You and your spam, combined with your responding to
the loon, have earned you a permanent place in my killfile!

Isn't it great to win things on the internet?

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

--------------------------

OR DO YOU WANT A PIECE OF THIS?:

From: Janet B
Date: Fri, Mar 3 2006 6:27 pm

On Fri, 03 Mar 2006 22:13:32 GMT, Robin Nuttall
<*.@mchsi.com>, clicked their heels and said:

> Here's the theory. The only people who think Jerry makes sense
> are those with the same mental problems as Jerry. I.e., it takes a
> loon to understand a loon.

I do believe you've hit the nail on the head, Robin.

Getting back to the subject line, I started using the e-collar with
Rudy today. He's hit adolescence and is so engrossed in munching
sticks, flirting with the Dobe bitch behind us, etc, that his recall
has become a bit inadequate. Now then, I can go out to him, call
him, and he's fine with that.

He comes, sits front, I food reward, and all is right with the world.

Only he really needs to come from the back of the yard with me at
the back door, 100'+ away. I tapped him on ~12 (Dogtra 1200) and
he perked up and recalled beautifully.

Did it again at a point where he was in the bushes and totally focused
on something. He came happily, tail wagging, and got a food reward
as well. Since then, he has just recalled, no tap given.

We'll be using it daily, especially at his most challenging times
of day (the post-dinner Dobe shmoozing). I'll be teaching it to
DH now, since Rudy rarely recalls to him in a reasonable amount
of time, and he handles it poorly.

We need to keep endearing the Rude-man to him after all!
--
Janet B

BWEEEAAAHAHAHAHAAAA~!~!~!

"Tricia9999" <tricia9...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021117101433.10365.00000067@mb-cg.aol.com...

> how effective are these electronic fences in
> keeping a dog on a property????

Some run through it. Others get shocked and become
too scared to go out in the yard anymore.

Just heard of a guy that has to rehome his dog,
because the dog got caught right in the path of
the shock and will now not go near his person,
won't go outside.

Just hides under a desk in the house.

------------------------------------

"micha el" spam_yurs...@spamyourmamma.com
wrote in message
news:yIydnZpPsIzg6l_d4p2dnA@comcast.com...

Anyway, contrary to your PR, this is what
it felt like to me when I got shocked by
Hope's collar.

It felt like a bomb going off in my
hand and forearm.

--------------------------

From: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)
Date: 2000/10/06
Subject: Re: Shina Inu Experts : Please help!

Dogman, quoting howdy-doody:

>>This is a young puppy, hardly a threat to a kat.

> See? They just cannot conceive of a cat, for example, scratching
> out the eyes of a young puppy because it didn't want to be bothered
> by an over-exurburant puppy (are there any other kinds?).

********** Jerry's never met a puppy, He's never met a
RETRIEVER PUPPY, that's pretty clear. I have a wonderfully
exhuberant retriever puppy - love every minute of it.

My 17 year old cat, doesn't have quite the same appreciation.

Sometimes, Franklin licks his ears and Robie enjoys it. Other
times, Franklin thinks Robie's another puppy and Robie does
not enjoy that. Without my supervision, confinement is only
sensible (of course).

I've got Jer-Jer kill-filed, but the glimpes at his posts, through
re-posts, are good indications that nothing has changed.

> But if a crate is a "barrier" to training a puppy, then what
> must the walls of a SCHOOL ROOM be, eh?

*********** and don't forget cribs for crawling babies, safety
gates, doors, etc. Let's just open up the houses and let everyone
run amok!

> Ladies and gentlemen, he literally counts on many of you
> being too damn stupid or ignorant to see just how little he
> actually knows about dogs, puppies, cats, etc.
> Don't let him, eh?
> Dogman

************** It's so difficult for the newbies, since so many
of the people who DO have good advice, have killfiled him.

Tired of refuting slander and general inaccuracies in his "they're
all bad, I'm good" rants (without any actual training advice, as
usual) is a reality for most.

Are there actually people, besides Marilyn, who believe him?

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"

THAT was your pal DOGMAN, another pathetic
miserable stinkin rotten lyin anonymHOWES coward.
Not so handsome, not so gentle, not so manly, not so
happy jackass, not even morrison aka dogman a.k.a.
BIG DADDY, a.k.a. tommy sorenson, sez:

"I don't know how big you are, kiddo, so this may
not be as easy for you as it is for me, but use
a little "knee action," that is, as the dog goes
charging by you, just give the dog a little bop
with your knee and shin. Yep, really lean into it.

Even knock her over, if you can, but make sure to
make her think twice about rushing past you again -
- which is exactly what you want her to do.

Don't bother with scolding her, she'll get the message.

If it happens again, just REPEAT the knee action.

When she steps on your toes, just pick up your foot
abruptly and nudge her with your knee. Again, no
scolding is necessary here, so you don't have to
worry about her "over-reacting."

I don't think this is necessarily a lack of respect
for you, just a lack of training. That is, she just
needs *more* of it."

"My objective is always to find a way that WORKS.
And if it is DANGEROUS behavior that I'm trying
to modify, behavior than can get the dog KILLED,
I will resort to ANYTHING to save him.

A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G.

Okay. Call me a cruel, inhumane, abusive bastard
if you want to, but it doesn't affect me at all.
When you've saved the lives of as many dogs as I
have, you'll learn that that's the only thing that
really matters. Saving lives and making dogs become
good citizens

At no time do the Monks *ever* advocate beating a
dog. A swat on the rump or a check to the chin does
*not* constitute a "beating."

=====================

From: dog...@i1.net (Dogman)
Date: 1999/01/15
Subject: Re: Another mouthy lab

Get this book:

"The Art of Raising A Puppy," by the Monks of New Skete

If you can't find it locally, you can obtain it
through my Web site (see below).

You'll need it for more than just the usual puppy
"mouthing" problems, anyway.

And good luck with your Lab puppy!
--

Dogman

------------------------

From: osi...@deltaville.net (Michael Erskine)
Date: 12 Aug 2004 10:09:05 -0700

Subject: My GSD bit me.
The question:

I have a four year old male GSD. He growls
at me sometimes. When he growls at me he
stares me in the face and lays his ears back.

The New Skete books say that the dog should not be
allowed to do that. They suggest shaking down the
dog by grabing the dog on the sides of his neck and
picking him off his front feet, then giving the dog the
same sort of treatment the dog would give another if
it were challenging him.

Namely getting in the dogs face and letting
the dog know you are the alpha dog.

Well, my dog bit me clearly he felt that I was not
convincing enough or he bit me out of fear.

Anyone got ideas on what to do with this dog that might
help him to decide that he wants to follow and that he
has nothing to fear from me?

----------------------

From: Charlie Wilkes <charlie_wil...@users.easynews.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 17:21:14 GMT
Subject: Re: My GSD bit me.

You need to improve your acting skills. Get a werewolf
suit with blood-drenched fangs and claw gloves and THEN
go after your dog.

Knock the shit out of him and don't be afraid to crack
some ribs. Then yank the mask off and shout "SURPRISE!
IT'S ME!" I guarantee you and your dog will have a new
relationship based on mutual respect.

Keep in mind that the monks of New Skete
were pre-Lon-Chaney.

Charlie

-----------------------

HOWE COME would matty set his INFORMATIVE POSTS to
EXXXPIRE in six days like elegy, montana, diddler, professora
melanie chang, cindy title moore of k9web.com, and not so happy,
not so handsome, not so gentle jackass, not even jack morrison,
a.k.a. BIG DADDY a.k.a. DOGMAN a.k.a. tommy sorenson of
sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL and SHOCK COLLAR SALES??

Are they EMBARRASSED by their own words, the lyin animal
murderin punk thug coward mental cases frauds an SCAM ARTISTS?

matty aka Rocky EXXXPLAINS HOWE COME:

"Rocky" <2d...@rocky-dog.com> wrote
For reasons I'll only explain privately, I've gone no
archive, and it's a shame. Once in a while, while
looking for something else, I'll run into an old post
of mine. What an idiotic response! Whoops.

BWEEEAAAHAHAAAHAAHAAA!~!~!

You wanna see matty's 'obviHOWES LIES' and IDIOTIC RESPONSES??

Here's more from your PAL matty:

From: Rocky <2dogsREM...@rocky-dog.com.invalid>
Date: 24 Jul 2004 04:00:53 GMT
Local: Fri, Jul 23 2004 11:00 pm
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?

Cam said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> Everything he preaches is very positive, no
> correction, no punishment, all praise and love.

You are very wrong.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

From: Rocky <2d...@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 23 Nov 2003 02:40:42 GMT
Subject: Re: house training

steve braun said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> I dont like the insinuations that i am abusing
> my dog when i am NOT.

Then you may want to ignore the Puppy Wizard/Jerry Howe.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

From: Rocky <3da...@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 16 Aug 2002 18:40:54 GMT
Subject: Re: training a dog...
nancyj wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> The pressure meant a GOOD possibility if she could
> just push up hard enough, I'd understand. I did
> eventually <G>. I switched to a light tap!

Yup, once a dog learns to sit, a light tap
works as a reminder when they "forget".
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

But "NEVER HIT your dog", eh, matty?

From: "Nevyn" <greatd...@badmama.com.au>
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 20:05:45 +0800

Subject: Re: puppy wizzards training manual.

G'DAY STEVE.

I used to be like you.

Then I found a book...it was called... the
wits end dog training manual.... and then
there was light..and perfectly trained dogs.
--
Thankyou,
Nevyn
Nevyn E.D.
Veterinary Nurse & Animal Trainer
g*.@badmama.com.au

"Yu agonna get whats comin' to you...for
all the bad bad things you to do your...dog"
________________________

"steve braun" <twopointerp...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:2d60c10a.0311231915.68b1241d@posting.google.com...

> twopointerp...@aol.com (steve braun) wrote in message
<news:2d60c10a.0311231219.d2cf140@posting.google.com>...

> > Hello, Mr. puppy wizzard, how do i find a copy of
> > your manual. Do you have a link that takes me to it?
>
> > I think i would like to read it.
>
> > Now i have another question for you in regards to
> > walking your dog. How do you feel about the gentle
> > leader? I bought one for each of my pups and the
> > difference in walking them is unbelievable. If you are
> > not sure what the gentle leader is check out their web
> > site at www.premier.com. If you are as good as you say
> > you are i want to read your manual.
> > thanks,
> > Steve

> > P.s. by the way my pup doesnt pee as soon as i put
> > him in his crate its after he's been in for a while
> > and cant hold it anymore that he pee's

> Howdy, jerry,
> well i started reading your manual, Im going to
> perfectly honest with you I thought last night when
> i started reading your posts you were full of crap
> but the more i read the more i could tell that you
> really do care about dogs. That is why asked for
> a copy of your manual.
>
> I really like your analogy on barking that was very
> interesting and gave it a perspective i never even thought
> of. As far as your praising the dogs when they are
> misbehaving i still dont understand how that works (i
> didnt get all that far in the manual yet.
>
> But i must say my female was clawing at the couch so i
> praised her like you say to do, i praised her twice for
> it and she stopped and came over to me.
>
> So i think what you have to say has merit, And for one
> am anxious to finish the book and get started because
> i love my dogs and really am looking forward to interacting
> with them on a positive note all of the time.
>
> This may be a little premature jerry, but
> Thank you
> Steve

Rocky wrote:
> Robin said in rec.pets.dogs.health:
> > Jerry, you give the lying dog abusing punk thug coward
> > mental cases too much credit for the ability to influence

Naaah, The Amazing Puppy Wizard was just BAITING these lying
dog abusing punk thug coward mental cases again <{); ~ ) >

> You really are a piece of work.

INDEEDY, matty. Robin studied and followed the INSTRUCTIONS
in her FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual and REPORTED
her 100% NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS RIGHT HERE on The
Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums And SCHOOL Of HARD KNOCKS
And HUMAN And ANIMAL BEHAVIOR RESEARCH
LABORATORIES, matty <{); ~ ) >

You're settin in it <{); ~ ) >

> Keep this out of the health groups, 'kay?

Dogs DIE from separation anXXXIHOWESNESS, matty, JUST
LIKE HOWE your own DEATHLY ILL dog Rocky is DYIN from
STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE aka The Puppy
Wizard's SYNDROME, on accHOWENT of you're a lyin dog abusin
punk thug coward MENTAL CASE, matty, and you can't post here
abHOWETS nodoGgamenedMOORE <{); ~ ) >

> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92FEEC097E4AAaustralianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
>
> Linda wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> > When you compare using sound and
> > praise to solve a problem with using
> > shock collars, hanging, and punishment
> > how can you criticize the use of sound?

> There's nothing more to be said, then.
> You've made up your mind.

> But you've impressed me by mentioning

> that you're a professor with 30 years of
> experience.
\
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
>> I do know that hitting, hurting your dog
>> will often make the dog either aggressive
>> or a fear biter, neither of which we want
>> to do.
>
> And neither does anyone else, Jerome.
> No matter what Jerry Howe states.
>
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> BUT, giving you the benefit of the
> doubt, please provide a quote (an
> original quote, not from one of Jerry
> Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that
> shows a regular poster promoting or
> using an abusive form of training.
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of
> which you have read so many. While you're going
> through them, point out those which recommend
> shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you.
> --
> -Matt. Rocky's a Dog

> Rocky wrote:
> "Deltones" <vibrov...@hotmail.com> said in
> rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
>
> > After your defense of "Limited" choking, what
> > would be the point? Where I come from, choking
> > is choking. It's never limited.
>
> So, you can't point out abuse where none occurs.
> Thank you for your contribution.
>-
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

From: Rocky (2...@rocky-dog.com)
Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations
Date: 2004-10-19 19:42:54 PST

Melanie L Chang said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> I try really hard not to yell. The times that I have,
> Solo joined in and then lunged to the end of the
>leash.

Or, at the other end of the spectrum, Rocky cowers,
thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out"
others' dogs at agility trials or training.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

---------------

Sometimes my "voice of god" startles human
and dog, especially when the human didn't
see the inappropriate behaviour. --Matt.
Rocky's a Dog.

"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92C1EC10BFE7australianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
Rosa Palm\ufffdn wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

> Anybody else got bilingual dogs?

Long ago my Hebrew was pretty good - but now I
only use "Chutza"(throat clearing 'ch') - "Out" when
it's reallyreally important that my dogs get away from
something.

"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * mch...@lppi.ucsf.edu
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/

From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 10 Jun 2003 18:00:45 GMT
Subject: Re: Absolutely abysmal agility day

Robin Nuttall said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior

> One of the things that frustrates methe most about
> agility is that people seem to think that ALL dogs
> are fragile, shrinking flowers who cannot be
> corrected in any way.

Well, maybe one day -- when Friday doesn't take
correction so much to heart -- I'll try something
different. Right now, he's just getting the confidence
to work a few jumps ahead of me.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

"I crate Rocky, even though he's 8.5 years old, but
only when I'm gone during summertime days -
maybe an hour at the most. (Other than hot days,
my dogs are always with me.)

While Friday has been totally reliable unsupervised
from the day I got him from a rescue, Rocky has not.

Rocky will go looking for food even in areas where
there's no possibility of food.

The good thing is that he likes his crate, runs for
it when I ask, and gets food when he's in it.
--
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAAA!!!

From: Rocky (mbon...@sunada.com)
Subject: Re: Leg Humper
Date: 1999/09/14

B*.@aol.com (Jerry Howe) wrote in
<*.@bellsouth.net>:

> By "sticking your knee up," I can only presume
> that you are suggesting that the people knee the
> dog in the chest. If that's what you meant, just
> say it, instead of beating around the bush to avoid
> criticism from people like me. That kind of crap has
> got to stop, and that's why I'm here, to help wean
> you guys off of the abuse and into the proper methods
> of dealing with behavior problems.

Jerry, I was appreciating your explanation
up until this last paragraph.

Why did you blow it?

--Matt

"dallygirl" <kwickw...@hotmail.com> said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many
>cases causing more harm than good.

Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are an
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.

It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

=============

BWEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!!

Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal sgt grant teebon, RAAF:

"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds
To Pain And Punishment, High Tolerance For
Correction, Escalation Of Correction To A Level
Where The Dog Yelps When You Punish Him,
Thus Making The Experience One Which The Dog
Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon,
RAAF.

Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal captain
arthur haggerty, USArmy K-9 Corps:

captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK"
Makes A ResoundingSound Distraction: "When
You Chuck The Dog The Sound Will Travel Up
The Mandible To The Ears And Give A Popping
Sound To The Dog."

lying frosty dahl writes:

"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.

With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'

Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.

Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,

Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.

Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in importance.

but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch

You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;

even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that

Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.

if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.

Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.

Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"

==============

"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"

Koehler On Correcting The Housebreaking Backslider.

"If the punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house. An indelible impression
can sometimes be made by giving the dog a hard
spanking of long duration, then leaving him tied by
the mess he's made so you can come back at twenty
minute intervals and punish him again for the same
thing. (Dogs are REALLY stupid. J.H.)

In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment. It will be better for your dog,
as well as the house, if you really pour it on him."

"Housebreaking Problems:

"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"

Occasionally, there is a pup who seems determined to
relieve himself inside the house, regardless of how
often he has the opportunity to go outside. This dog
may require punishment. Make certain he is equipped
with a collar and piece of line so he can't avoid
correction.

When you discover a mess, move in fast, take him to
the place of his error, and hold his head close enough
so that he associates his error with the punishment.
Punish him by spanking him with a light strap or
switch. Either one is better than a folded newspaper.

It is important to your future relationship that you
do not rush at him and start swinging before you get
hold of him.

When he's been spanked, take him outside. Chances
are, if you are careful in your feeding and close
observation, you will not have to do much punishing.

Be consistent in your handling.

To have a pup almost house-broken and then force
him to commit an error by not providing an opportunity
to go outside is very unfair. Careful planning will
make your job easier.

The same general techniques of housebreaking apply
to grown dogs that are inexperienced in the house.

For the grown dog who was reliable in the house and
then backslides, the method of correction differs
somewhat. In this group of "backsliders" we have the
"revenge piddler." This dog protests being alone by
messing on the floor and often in the middle of a bed.

The first step of correction is to confine the dog
closely in a part of the house when you go away, so
that he is constantly reminded of his obligation. The
fact that he once was reliable in the house is proof
that the dog knows right from wrong, and it leaves
you no other course than to punish him sufficiently
to convince him that the satisfaction of his
wrongdoing is not worth the consequences. If the
punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house.

An indelible impression can sometimes be made
by giving the dog a hard spanking of long duration,
then leaving him tied by the mess he's made so you
can come back at twenty minute intervals and punish
him again for the same thing.

In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment.

It will be better for your dog, as well as the house,
if you really pour it on him.

---------------------

AIN'T GOT NO AGENDAS HERE, SEE??






Michael A. Ball
2008-08-01 14:44:26 EST
On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 17:37:33 GMT, "Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@mchsi.com>
wrote:

>I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog, but often goes to the fence
>and barks excessively...Will an anti-bark collar help? She is very trainable
>and remembers unpleasant consequences very well.

Considering her intellect, there is surely a better way, that a shock
collar.

I think folks who are considering a shock collar for their dog should
try out a lot of them to see which shock they believe their dog would
like.

I wonder how well a taser, or maybe a cattle prod, would work.

I'm fortunate: sometimes people ask me if my dog (Chow Chow) ever barks.
He does, of course, but its very rare.

Your doggy might be too bored, and need activities: not shock therapy.


___________________
A dog's life is too short; their only fault really.

Mason Barge
2008-10-30 15:15:32 EST
On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 17:37:33 GMT, "Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@mchsi.com>
wrote:

>I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog, but often goes to the fence
>and barks excessively. A little barking is good, but I don't want to
>alienate the neighbors with constant yapping. Will an anti-bark collar
>help? She is very trainable and remembers unpleasant consequences very
>well.
>
>Thanks for any help.
>
>Tom
>*l@mchsi.com
>

I use a citronella spray collar on my doxie. It's extremely effective
and humane. It helps a ton with safety issues, too, since he'll try
to bolt into the street after a passing dog or person unless he's
wearing the collar.

Rocky
2008-10-30 15:23:36 EST
Mason Barge <masonbarge@gmail.com> said in
rec.pets.dogs.breeds:

> I use a citronella spray collar on my doxie. It's
> extremely effective and humane.

How is it humane? The smell lingers - there's no defined end to
the pushment that the collar provides.

> It helps a ton with safety issues, too, since he'll try to
> bolt into the street after a passing dog or person unless
> he's wearing the collar.

Why do you think that happens?

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

Jerry Howe - The Incredibly Simply Amazing Puppy Wizard <{}'; ~ \ >
2009-04-27 11:39:27 EST
HOWEDY mason barge, you pathetic miserable stinkin rotten
lyin animal abusin punk thug coward active acute chronic life-
long INCURABLE Malignant MaliciHOWES MENTAL CASE,

"Mason Barge" <masonbarge@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:kk1kg491silakerunarqneh9datv3hen7d@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 17:37:33 GMT, "Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@mchsi.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I have a French bulldog that is a very good dog, but
>> often goes to the fence and barks excessively.

Dogs BARK when there's SUMPTHIN WRONG <{}: ~ ) >

>> A little barking is good, but I don't want to alienate
>> the neighbors with constant yapping.

It's KINDLY an CONsiderate of you DOG LOVERS to be
CONcerned abHOWET your NEIGHBORS bein disturbed
by your HYPERACTIVE FEAR AGGRESSIVE dogs <{}: ~ ) >

>> Will an anti-bark collar help?

Yeah. They HURT and INTIMIDATE dogs an sometimes KILLS them.

LIKE THIS:


"Warning: Sometimes The Corrections Will Seem
Quite Harsh And Cause You To Cringe. This Is
A Normal Reaction The First Few Times It Happens,
But You'll Get Over It." mike duforth,
author: "CourteHOWES Canine."


"I have heard advice stating that you should pre-load
your dog for Bitter Apple for it to work as efficiently
as possible. What does this mean?


When you bring home the Bitter Apple for the first
time, spray one squirt directly into the dog's mouth
and walk away. The dog won't be too thrilled with
this but just ignore him and continue your normal behavior."
--Mike Dufort
author of the zero selling book
"CourteHOWES Canines"


--------------------------------


Subject: Re: untrainable beagle! NEED HELP



"diddy" <di...@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9834C98CEC696danny@216.196.97.142... > in thread
news:BO2Lg.4755$xV.1684@twister.nyroc.rr.com: "graham fandango!"


> <gmey...@maine.rr.com> whittled the following words:
> i have a ten year old beagle who i got from the
> animal shelter 5 years ago. its pretty clear he
> was abused in some form before he ended up
> in the shelter; when ever i reach for something,
> like the tv remote, too quickly he flinches.
> he gets scared when i sweep the
> kitchen floor and hides under the bed.


I have one too. I don't know her past history, or her age.

I use an antibark collar on her for my sanity. She's very
quiet, until I take it off. It doesn't train her not to bark,
because she barks when the collar is off. (beagles "Do
that")


There may not even be batteries in it, but she doesn't
bark... just in case.I'd supervise the first time you try
it, because I've heard of some dogs barking, and going
so spazzy over them that they died.


I really don't think you are going to train a dog that
age, especially a beagle, NOT to bark. I see your
options as being:


1) anti-bark collar
a)citronella
b)electronic
c)bark buster (your neighbors will
probably complain asmuch about
that as the howlng)
2) surgical debarking
3) placing the dog and accepting the consequences
4) moving


-----------------------


SEE???

AND LIKE THIS:


"diddy" <none> wrote in message


news:Xns9A74B7CCF8817diddydiddynet@216.196.97.142...
c <barney...@gmail.com> spoke these words of wisdom
in news:
5a8c97ed-06aa-4211-b345-b49062eff...__END_MASK_i?63jfAD$__BEGIN_MASK_n#9g02mG7!__...@s37g2000prg.googlegroups.com:


> The shock is minimal and nothing to worry about. There
> are 2 different types that frequent this group: the high
> falutin city folk that believe dogs should be treated like
> children, and the answer for any problem is "enroll them
> in class and spend $300 to teach them not to do it, and
> put them in time-out, but be sure their paw socks are on
> before stepping outside if under 50 degrees, etc."


First, I know of a dog with an antibark collar,
who protested so violently, he spazzed out
and killed himself.

He was found dead in his kennel the next morning.


What dog training schools charge $300?


--------------------


SEE???

AND LIKE THIS:

"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt


AND LIKE THIS:



"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@mb-m18.aol.com...

> He was next to me and I could see his neck
> muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
> Janet Boss

"sionnach" <rhyfe...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@ID-45033.news.uni-berlin.de...

> "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@mb-m17.aol.com...
> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher
> > > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
> > > dog like a Lab.


An INSENSITIVE DOG???

> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
> > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.

Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?

janet CONtinues:
> > My dogs are not human children wearing fur- they are
> > DOGS. I don't have anything against electronic bark
> > collars, but they should be used in conjunction with
> > actually working at training your dog(s).

They're DUMB ANIMALS these MENTALLY ILL LYING
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.

-----------------

>> She is very trainable

INDEED?

>> and remembers unpleasant consequences very well.

But of curse~! Even a paramecium NEVER FORGETS.

>>Thanks for any help.

Oh, for SHORE~!

>>Tom
>>tginkel@mchsi.com
>
> I use a citronella spray collar on my doxie.

But of curse you do, mason <{}: ~ ( >

You're a pathetic miserable stinkin rotten dog abusin MENTAL CASE.

> It's extremely effective and humane.

That so? MOST of your fellHOWE dog lovers PREFER a nice SHOCK
COLLAR instead of those citronelly devices with their offensive spray
lingering so's the dog DON'T KNOW HOWE COME IT IS GETTIN HURT.

> It helps a ton with safety issues, too, since he'll try to bolt into
> the street after a passing dog or person unless he's wearing the collar.

Yeah? You COULD TRAIN your dog NOT TO BARK an run into the
street simply by PRAISING him, but THAT would make you LOOK like
a decent human being <{}: ~ ( >

NHOWE GET THE HEEL HOWETA MY FORUMS.

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