Dog Discussion: MENTAL ILLNESS In RPD* RPD* MeNTally Ill All_StaRz KUCKOO!! KUCKOOO! DING! DING! DING! List

MENTAL ILLNESS In RPD* RPD* MeNTally Ill All_StaRz KUCKOO!! KUCKOOO! DING! DING! DING! List
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A*@HushMail.Com
2005-12-20 03:56:29 EST
MENTAL ILLNESS In RPD*

RPD* MeNTally Ill All_StaRz as of 7/27/2004

KUCKOO!! KUCKOOO! DING! DING! DING! List

List Of Confirmed Mentally Ill (CRAZY)Regulars

RPD CRAZY PERSON ROLL CALL And BIOS

!CAVEAT!

This List Is NOT Up To Date:
If You Ain't On The List, PLEASE,:

<YOUR NAME GOES HERE>

(please proudly add your name and the drugs/disorders specific
to you, if you are also mentally ill). If we all come forward,
we can help each other with our problems. Remember, mental illness
is nothing to be ashamed of. It's not your fault if you have a
defective brain which may cause you to act like an extreme hypocrite
and/or idiot and/or robot without your being aware of it).

Also, please notify us if you are *not* mentally ill, and have
been added to this by mistake, so we can make our corrections
and remove you from the crazy person list.

===========================================

Subject: Re: A few issues...MenTal List

MENTAL ILLNESS IN RPD*

Mental illness is a public issue in the dog newsgroups.
People are always running around calling other people
mentally ill and diagnosing their illnesses. I think
it's only fair that we have an accurate list of who
is and who isn't mentally ill, so that we can avoid
any misunderstandings and promote group harmony.
This list is strictly for group harmony purposes.

=======================================

Here's the RHOWEndup:

BREAKING NEWS.

Sexual Abuse And Dog Training Go Together
Like A Child And Paddle

From: polara (lar...@muchomail.com)
Subject: Was: Girls' stirrings, now: Mother's doubts
Newsgroups: soc.sexuality.spanking
Date: 2004-04-13 06:51:18 PST

in a message responding to Polara's answer to Paul Mera's
question about spanko girls' fantasies etc:

"ayla" <aylaa...@hotpopidiotproof.com> wrote

| I had fantasies just like that on my walks home from school,
| as well as in my room at night. However, I did *not*
| baby-sit for anyone cool enough to have "O" on their
| bookshelf. Makes me determined to have my books in a public,
| inconspicuous place for my babysitters to find if they need
| it. And, my kids too.
|
| Thank you for sharing this, it's nice to know I'm not the
| only one. :-)
|
| ayla

You're welcome! You're not the only one!

I agree with you about making the books discreetly available
to the youngsters. But I feel it's a fine line to tread.
I gave my kid "Sex for Dummies" when he was 13, because his
school did not have any kind of Sex Ed, no matter what
euphemism you name it with. I didn't have any trouble telling
him what I felt he needed to know, or answering what he wanted
to know, at any age so far - he's 18 now, and as far as I can
tell, done asking.

But I haven't talked to him about my favourite kink. (Though
since I know he digs through my bedside bookshelf at will,
he's probably realised my collection is pretty skewed.)

Why not? I have to admit I haven't made a well-considered
decision. It just seemed like "more than he probably wants or
needs to know." It's no secret, and if he asked me, "Mom are
you really into getting spanked/spanking?" I'd tell him "Yes,
I think it's sexy and fun."

Would you tell your own kids or others about liking spanking?

I also keep my precious spanking videos under lock and key.
Why? Since I'm willing to let the books be "found"? Darned if
I know, but again it feels like its more than I want him to be
exposed to through ME. Maybe it's my personal interpretation
of the incest taboo. If he wants to rustle up his own spanking
video and watch it on my machine in my house, fine. But if he
gets it from me...not fine. Show me where it says I have to be
consistent.

Anybody else got an opinion on this?

Polara

CHRIS JUNG On
The PROZE And CONS of PROZAC

Chris Jung (Prozac and Welbutrin, cognitive therapy)

I have to comment here. Anti-depressants such
as Prozac do not have any "drugging" effect. It
doesn't tranquilize, make euphoric, or cause
any sort of change in behavior except for
bringing the brain imbalances back to normal
and thus reducing depression. I take Prozac and
the difference between being on Prozac and not
is very subtle. I still feel everything (happy,
sad, nervous, mad) but I'm just not as
unreasonably bummed about it.

=============================================

WORDS OF WISDOM
From Our Own Lynn Kosmakos
1200mg Of Lithium And 50 Mg Of Zoloft
Every Day
For Twenty Years.

I THINK I'M QUALIFIED TO TALK ABOUT LITHIUM

"I, too, have a bi-polar mood disorder (manic-depression)
requiring 1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every day.
I, also, care about dogs and use this forum to learn more,
while happily sharing pertinentinformation I have learned.

But if I were ever to post such sh*t, I would hope that
every other reader of this group would be rightfully outraged."

"Community is an evolutionary thing that we earn the right
to participate in by observing the easily understood rules
and contributing to in constructive ways."

Lynn K.

-----------------------------------------


MOTHER AND CHILD REUNION
"KUCKOO!! CUCKOO!!!"
MOTHER (LOIS E.) 22 YEARS on TRICYCLICS,
DAUGHTER BIPOLAR...
YOU DO THE MATH

"What's really terrific, is now days you can
say proudly, 'I take anti-depressives'"

^^^^DARLIN DEAR DAUGHTER DEIDRE MURDERED HER OWN
DEAD DOG *(Her *HEART DOG* Of TEN YEARS) for
DESTRUCTIVE SEPARATION ANXXXIHOWESNESS.

From: Gary & lois Edwards (g...@bmi.net)
Subject: Re: Where is Darlene?

Date: 1999/09/02

BEEN ON TRICYCLICS FOR ABOUT 22 YEARS

"I don't take lithium, but I've been on trycyclics
for about 22 years. Been there, done that, have
the t-shirt to prove it. What's really terrific, is now
days you can say proudly, "I take anti-depressives".

Back when I started taking them it was seen as
something shameful.If you cut your leg off, and
were lying there with a bleeding stump, you'd
never let the word depressed, pass your lips, or
the doc's would say, "You're depressed, on medication?

Well, can't have any pain meds.....you could become addicted."

The good old days. I actually had a Great Aunt who's
father locked her in her room back in the twenties
because she was simple. A shame that medication
probably would have helped her live a normal life.

No Denna, I was just saying with Darlene's
personality, she has a way of making grandiose
plans when at the top of her manic cycle....as
does my daughter. I wasn't saying that anyone
with problems could be counted on to be
irresponsible."

Lois E.

*****DARLIN DEAR MOMMY lois SEARCHED for DARLIN DEAR
DAUGHTER DEIDRE on the news groups for months after
hurricane Katrin destroyed her DARLIN DEAR DAUGHTER's
town. They've since been reunited.

Her DEEPLY LOVED HEART DOG is STILL DEAD, HOWEver.

-------------------------------------

REC PET DOGS NEWSGROUPS CRAZY KLUB NEWEST
INDUCTEE BETHGSD July 2004

From: Bethgsd (beth...@aol.comnojunk)
Subject: Re: failed attempt to rehabilitate
aggressive dog

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior
Date: 2002-04-11 16:42:08 PST

Gwen wrote:

>Absolutely! And I personally find it somewhat
>insulting that the comparisons of this were made.
>Since I do have epilepsy myself and it is a very
>life threatening disease when one is not on
>medication. Very.
>
>Gwen
>
>

[Bethgsd Responds]

[GWEN, GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS...
CHEMICAL IMBALANCES CAN BE LIFE THREATENING]

Well, Gwen I suffer from severe depression which
is controlled by a particular SSRI and I find it
insulting that you don't feel that chemical
imbalances can be lifethreatening. No, I don't
go into status but I've attempted to commit
suicide a few too many times. And no, those
weren't little "cries for help" they were honest
to G-D attemts to get out of the pain.

So get your head out of your ass and realize that
chemical imbalances can be as life threatening,
if in a different way, than electrical misfiring.

Beth [aka Bethgsd]

not to be confused with the non crazy
as far as we know, BethF who is ONLY
a LIAR and DOG ABUSER)

----------------------------
LYNN K. 20 plus years on Lithium
LOIS E. 25 plus years on tricyclics

Hello Fans,

here is our latest NEW AND IMPROVED crazy person update,
including our latest mentally unstable person, Lois E.
of Gary and Lois fame who has been on Tricyclics
pushing 25 years. She is no longer afraid to talk about it.

Neither is Lynn K. who embraces her mental illness and
opens up about her 20 plus years on Lithium, as well as
her love afair with Zoloft.

I TOO HAVE A BIPOLAR MOOD DISORDER (MANIC DEPRESSION)
I ALSO CARE ABOUT DOGS COMMUNITY IS AN EVOLUTIONARY THING

WORDS OF WISDOM from our own
Lynn Kosmakos

=======================================

From: Chris Kosmakos (chris...@netcom.com)
Subject: Re: complaints and goodbye

Lisa K. Baird (lba...@infinet.com) wrote:
:
: Sheesh, if everyone would start taking responsibility
: for their own actions, wouldn't life be grand?

LYNN K. and LOIS E, and a BiLateral, BiPolar

conversation on Mental problems.

LYNN AND LOIS

Almost 50 years on mental illness medications combined

> But I think what Lois was referring to
> was the fact that Darlene actually
> stated at some point that she was
> bipolar--and, IIRC, that meds did not work
> for her--so she was prone to major-league
> ups and downs and sudden
> enthusiasms..

"It wasn't that meds didn't work for her
- she wouldn't take them. I particularly remember
a comment she made about scarey side effects of
Lithium. Hardly. After 17 years on it, I think
I'm qualified to say that the very low risk of
any side effect is far less frightening than the
very real dangers of life without it."

Lynn K.
-----------------------------------------

LYNN K. and the UNQUIET MIND
----------------------------------------

From: Lynn Kosmakos (lkosma...@home.com)
Subject: Re: Where is Darlene?
Date: 1999/09/03

BoxHill wrote:

> I know I am totally off topic here, but have you read
> "The Unquiet Mind"?

Yeah. It's interesting, but kind of
watered down for the mass market, if
you know what I mean. There's really
quite a lot of good work out there and
decent research. Thank God.

Lynn K.


lynn kosmakos RPD* Enemy of Dogs #1

(Lithium, Zoloft, bipolar, manic,
depression) will "put down a biter
as fast as anyone" yet claims to
be a saintly dog rescuer. Murders
dogs because of insurance rates
Her brother was attacked by a Golden
Retriever when she was young. For
this reason, she murders easily
trainable dogs. Condemns dogs to
death who are easily trainable
with her "evaluations."

Is nice to people in person, but
her true dog hating nature comes
out on newsgroups with
extreme clarity.

Advocates shooting dogs on sight, when
they chase deer. Sees no other
option. Her own dog Java had to be shocked
with a shock collar to keep him from
chasing deer.

has been on lithium for approximately
20 years. Zoloft for an undetermined
number of years

Lynn K.

From: Chris Kosmakos (chris...@netcom.com)
Subject: Re: Prozac - Good medication or no?

I TAKE A SIMILAR DRUG MYSELF

"Yes, for very specific behaviorial problems.
I would have to trust my vet and behaviorist
a lot, and be very sure that I had exhausted
every other option before I used Prozac to
deal with a dog problem - and I take a
similar drug, Zoloft, myself."

Lynn K.

CAUGHT ON TAPE AT WOODSTOCK (I'M IN THE MOVIE)

From: Lynn K. (java...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Using Zoloft or Prozac as a one
shot treatment
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior
Date: 2001-09-27 23:13:46 PST

Gwen Watson <g...@ig.utexas.edu> wrote in message
<news:3BB2402B.15D9C619@ig.utexas.edu>...

> At Woodstock?????? Oh you lucky, lucky women!
> I will be forever jealous of you devulging this tid
> bit of info! GGGGggggggggggggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

More of us than you know. I'm even in the movie.
Let me tell you about trying to advise a teenager
about drugs after the ever-helpful uncle points out
your 15 seconds of fame - passing a joint to the
cameraman as Arlo Gutrie croons "coming into Los
Angeleeeze......." in the background :-( Kind of
undermines the parental authority thing.

Lynn K.

=============================================

HOWEDY Soup,

Thanks Soup.

You'd think your list got 'm covered, Soup to NUTS, eh???

But you ain't.

There's STILL a few loose SCREWBALLS missin.

For starters, you forgot the cutters and sexual sadists, Soup.

Look up susan frazier and looney toons aka laura arlov.

If You Ain't On The List, PLEASE,:

<YOUR NAME GOES HERE>

(please proudly add your name and the drugs/disorders specific
to you, if you are also mentally ill). If we all come forward,
we can help each other with our problems. Remember, mental illness
is nothing to be ashamed of. It's not your fault if you have a
defective brain which may cause you to act like an extreme hypocrite
and/or idiot and/or robot without your being aware of it).

Also, please notify us if you are *not* mentally ill, and have
been added to this by mistake, so we can make our corrections
and remove you from the crazy person list.

===========================================

Michael Further Explains The Mental Illness List

In the past, before Michael fixed things, this was a
way to shut people up and discredit people. Calling
them mentally ill. shelly told us not to even talk
to the mentally ill.

But it turned out most of the people doing the
accusing and finger pointing and "you better take
your meds" etc... were mentally ill themselves.

That's a huge story, and I SCOOPED IT.

MaryBeth for instance, was constantly telling
people to take their meds. Once I started to
do a little research, the floodgates opened
and an amazing story unfolded.

=====================================

(Oh, an pardon The Amazing Puppy Wizard for TOP
POSTIN, Soup. It's NOT a symptom of dominance
HOWEver, it's MOORE like laziness.)

Kelly/ severe OCD, ADD, major depression with culprit
psychotic features, panic and more. Coming forward so that
others like her will have the strength to do the same. Like
Charlie Wilkes, she is one of our most entertraining regulars

Here, kelly/culprit talks to Mustang Sally about her mental
illness/crazy problems. Sally is being rude and condescending
(as usual) and trying to make kelly/culprit feel bad for being
crazy, aka wacked in the head

culprit standing up for herself against rude and condescending
Mustang Sally -----------------------------------------------

well i wouldn't consider myself mentally healthy. though i'll
refrain from calling myself ill if it makes you feel better.
and no, ADD is not the major problem, i certainly know that, i
just mentioned it because of the impulsivity issues.

i wasn't trying to imply i'm disabled by it.

but i stand by the fact that OCD is an illness, major
depression with psychotic features certainly is, panic
disorder is too. and the other stuff just makes it all the
more fun.

i don't wallow in it. i'm just now learning to accept it,
because ignoring it wasn't working out too well. i need to do
that to make changes to my life so that i can become healthy.
and you say you're not trying to be condescending, but you're
doing it again. what i read was, (my paraphrasing) "people
who think they're mentally ill are wallowing in their
disabilities and letting them consume their life" you come
across as though you would be able to handle any of these
illnesses, and anyone who can't is just copping out.

well we're all different. and i don't accept your idea that i
would have a more productive life if i denied my problems.

i tried it for years, and believe me, it didn't work very
well.

-kelly --------------------------------------------

From: culprit (culp...@flashmail.com) Subject: Re: another
eevil pit bull story Date: 2003-10-08 08:47:43 PST

"Gwen Watson" <g...@ig.utexas.edu> wrote in message
news:3F842E58.965AAF30@ig.utexas.edu...

> Yep there it is NAMI. And yes ADHD or ADD or considered as a
> mental illness in which one can apply for many different
> things even in the work force in which they are suppose to
> accomodate you to help improve your condition.
> But I don't care to go there so I am one of those untreated
> ADHD people in the world. Whatever I am nearly 50 and have
> gotten along just fine. Or so I feel fulfilled.

yeah, i'm pretty sure i could qualify for all sorts of
disability stuff (the OCD and ADD are just the tip of my
iceberg). but i don't. i know i can function well enough to
do my job, i'll leave the benefits for those that really need
them.

mine is mostly a social impairment. go figure. :-)

-kelly

From: sighthounds etc. (greypigho...@ncweb.com) Subject: Re:
another eevil pit bull story Date: 2003-10-08 09:12:56 PST

On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 10:33:44 -0500, Gwen Watson
<*.@ig.utexas.edu>
wrote:

>culprit wrote:
>> "sighthounds etc." <greypigho...@ncweb.com> wrote in
>> message news:f8b8ov46ctu1ds18oliq439g10rod03mto@4ax.com...
>> > ADD and OCD are mental illnesses?
>> oh, BTW...

http://www.nami.org/Content/NavigationMenu/Inform_Yourself/Abou
t_M ental_Illness/About_Mental_Illness.htm

>> -kelly
> Yep there it is NAMI. And yes ADHD or ADD or considered as a
> mental illness in which one can apply for many different
> things even in the work force in which they are suppose to
> accomodate you to help improve your condition.
> But I don't care to go there so I am one of those untreated
> ADHD people in the world. Whatever I am nearly 50 and have
> gotten along just fine. Or so I feel fulfilled.

I guess this is just one of those instances in which I feel
that the US is turning into a nation of victims. And please,
don't anybody jump all over me, because I am not talking about
anyone personally. Everything seems to be a compensatable (not
sure if that's actually a word) disability. If 3/4 of the
people are physically disabled or mentally ill, what's
'normal'?

Terrible parents, painful childhoods, physical illnesses,
psychological problems, etc. are all part of who a person is,
and therefore how s/he sees the world and interacts in it. But
life isn't about who you are and what you've got, it's what
you do with it. For me anyway, the more I think of myself as
partially disabled, the more I am that way.

Sorry, I don't mean to sound like Dr. Phil.

Mustang Sally

---------------------

"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me. I volunteered as
assistant to the euthanasia tech at our local shelter for a
while, and I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted
animals.

This however has nothing at all to do with responsible
breeders, because responsible breeders don't contribute to
that problem," Mustang Sally.

From: Sunni12 (sunn...@aol.com)
Subject: I am
Newsgroups: alt.support.depression
Date: 1998/12/02

a major bitch today

-Sunny

---------------

From: Sunni12 (sunn...@aol.com)
Subject: Re: got a question - how long before I'm an EX-cutter?
Newsgroups: alt.support.depression
Date: 1998/11/30

> I mean, I haven't cut since June. But am I a cutter
> or an ex-cutter now?

> And how long before I am an ex-cutter? anyone
> got any answers?

> I still get sort-of cutting urges, but I haven't had
> 'em very strongly.Just sort of vague thoughts in
> my head. But I think that's going to happen forever.
> Kind of like alcoholics who recover.

> I know that the urge will come back at times of stress,
> but I don't have to do it.

>so, when am I an ex-cutter?

Its been about 9 months since I last cut.

I consider myself a recovering self injurer.

I still get the urge at times.

And like an alcoholic, i could easily slide.

So, Im proud of me for being in recovery from cutting....

And I'm proud of you Laz for being in recovery

and Im proud of everyone else resisting the temptation.

Love, hope and caring to yall all

-Sunny

---------------

From: Sunni12 (sunn...@aol.com)
Subject: Re: is it self injury if:
Newsgroups: alt.support.depression
Date: 1998/12/03

>you pick at scabs and watch them bleed...
>you pick at hangnails and make them bleed...
>you pick at calluses on your feet until they bleed....
>you poke blisters making them bleed....

I dont know.
I wonder myself.
I do the same thing.
Im a self injurer and an obsessive compulsive.
I always thought it was picking from my OCD.

-Sunny

----------------

From: Sunni12 (sunn...@aol.com)
Subject: Re: I wish I was........
Newsgroups: alt.support.depression
Date: 1998/12/05

> sunn...@aol.com (Sunni12) wrote:
>> important
>> needed
>> cared about
>> loved
>> wanted
>> -Sunny
>
> You are all those things, Sunny...& more.
> But I'll give you a few more cyberhugs, anyway...
> {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{SUNNY}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
> Mary

Thanks. That was a really bad day when I wrote it.
Much better now.

Thanks

Sunny
who should do something about her PMS
Here's laura MURDERIN her own DEAD DOG Chewie
and gettin her cookies off gettin pushed arHOWEND
by her S.O.:


HOWEDY laura,

"polara" <lar...@muchomail.com> wrote in message
news:Dblkc.10786$EV2.97520@amstwist00...

> "Marie" <m...@rogers.com> wrote
> <snip>
> | It turns out that her main concern isn't bowling
> | alleys or bus yard offices, it is lawns and parks grass.
> Over here we're getting more warnings that
> raising kids in an overly clean environment
> seems to lead to more asthma/allergy.

INDEED.

> My breeder's grandkids

Your "ETHICKAL breeder" sold you a
REPLACEMENT dog after you MURDERED
your own DEAD DOG Chewie CAUSE YOU
WOULDN'T STOP HURTIN and INTIMIDATING
HIM.

> Laura and Angel in Oslo.


THE COMPLETE DOG NEWSGROUP MENTAL ILLNESS
LIST (WHEW!) AS OF 8/6/2004

BREAKING MENTAL ILLNESS NEWS!

DATELINE: August 6, 2004
NEWSGROUPS: Dog Related + ARK

California Mormon Mom come Kibologist Paula
Makes Dog Newsgroup Mental Illness History

OUR FIRST CRAZY MORMON

Paula is a divorced Mormon Mom who dabbles freely
in Kibology, leaving herself at risk for being
Smite into a pile of rubble by either an angry,
vengeful God or worse yet, a Kibo unglued.

As a California based youth counselor, Paula
helps children deal with physical & emotional
problems while dealing with mental problems of
her own. Particularly chronic depression for
which she is drugged.

Paula has a long history of questioning her
faith, questioning her mother and worrying about
whether or not she'll be excommunicated for the
thoughts in her head. With good reason, after
spending so much time fraternizing with free
thinking, blaspheming Kibologists.

At one point, when Paula was suffering from a
heavy bout of depression, and in violation of
Mormonology and her mother's own advice, she
eschewed prayer and instead enlisted the heelp of
Harco Industries own twillis, who cruelly
flaunted her vaunted Paxil supply

"Sorry, go ride a horse, hands off my Paxil."
says HARCO's twillis

WON'T SHARE MY PAXIL WITH PAULA

From: HarCo Industries (tdwil...@earthlink.net)
Subject: Re: I need
Newsgroups: alt.religion.kibology
Date: 2003-05-13 09:48:41 PST

m*.@earthlink.ent (Paula) wrote

> I need something to get me out of this
> deepening depression.

I prescribe a horseback ride.

Really.

I'd share my Paxil with you, but I'm selfish.

twillis

To which Paula responded:

THE PAXIL IS NOT ENOUGH

"HAH! Paxil stopped working for me
and I had to switch to Celexa, for the
really and truly messed up!"

Paula

From: Paula (mmmtobler...@earthlink.ent)
Subject: Re: ATTENTION DOCTROID DOCTROID: Thad Van Cenks

paula's concise thesis on depression:

THE PRINGLES ARE NOT ENOUGH

Oh, honey! Pringles are never an adequate defense
against depression. It takes large amounts of premium
ice cream, at the very least.

THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH
BUT ZOLOFT IS TOO MUCH

BETTER FAT THAN DEAD

Also, zoloft is not a good anti-depressant because it
makes you fat. Or so an acquaintance of mine told me.
I refrained from pointing out to her that being fat
was not exactly a bad trade-off if you stopped being
suicidal in so many words.

SERIOUSLY, CHRONIC DEPRESSION IS LIKE THIS

Seriously, chronic depression is all about feeling
like shit and not knowing why. If there were a reason,
it would be "the blues" or something equally not quite
fuzzy but not really serious sounding.

YOU KNOW, LIKE FEMALE TROUBLE

THAT'S WHERE GOOD DRUGS COME IN

UNLESS YOU LISTEN TO MY MOM

You know, like "female trouble." This is where good
drugs come in. Unless you listen to my mom, who
thinks that you should be able to pray and read your
scriptures and serve others to happiness and full
enjoyment of living. The rest of us wish she would

It seems that Paula's mom tries to make her feel bad for
being mental, just like Sighthounds aka Mustang Sally
tried to make Kelly aka Culprit feel bad about her mental
problems

WISH YOU WOULD SHUT THE HELL UP AND
GET ON SOME MEDS YOURSELF, MOM!

not only shut up about how to treat our issues but
also stay on some good meds herself.

DRUGS MORE EXPENSIVE THAN PRAYERS OR PRINGLES
BUT FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, DRUGS WORK BETTER

Anyway, I have to say the good drugs route works much
better and takes less time, too. It's more expensive
than praying and pringles, but it's worth it. Get
thee to a good psychiatrist. If you can find a good
therapist, that helps, too.

DO NOT BEAT YOURSELF UP

Do not in any way, shape or form beat up on yourself
for your depression making no sense or not being made
worse by commercials, however. That is an order.

Paula

Paula's mother would prefer that her children pray to
the Mormon God or Jesus, or whomever the Mormons pray
to, but Paula and her brother prefer drugging themselves
instead.

MY BROTHER, MY PAXIL

r*.@mindspring.com wrote:
> >Youre talking to someone on meds for
> >Social Phobia.

Sarah Cherlin <scher...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> Ummm...what are those? I need to know for,
> like, a friend.

Paula (mmmtobler...@earthlink.net) responds

PAXIL MADE ALL THE DIFFERENCE

For my brother, paxil made all the difference.
He feels like a new person, and acts like one
too. And he has been living with a hawt chyk
for years now when before he had problems with
supervisors at work, with friendships and with
wimmin because he just never felt socially
comfortable. It really has made a huge
difference for him.

Paula

Paula discussing both her own, and more
specifically, the mental problems of her husband
before they got divorced, exhibiting a slight
masochistic bent:

From: Paula (mmmtobler...@earthlink.ent)
Subject: Re: Marriage and Kids
Newsgroups: soc.religion.mormon
Date: 2003-11-02 08:28:04 PST

ASKED HUBBY TO BEAT ME

Yes. I once told my husband that I wished he
would hit me. He didn't believe me. I asked him
what was more hurtful and had the longest lasting
and most devastating effect on him, the physical
abuse or the emotional abuse he suffered as a child.

HE COULD ONLY CRY

BUT AGREED TO GO TO COUNSELING

He could only cry. He agreed to go to counseling
immediately after processing that question. I don't
think you have to sit around while your spouse beats

WHO IS BEATING WHOM?

up your spirit any more than you are expected to sit
around waiting for the next physical beating. There
are other reasons cancellations of sealings have been
granted, even in the stricter days, so it appears
there are various "legitimate" reasons for divorce,
even when it is a temple marriage

Paula uses her own mental illness experience to help
her in her capacity as counselor to others who
are suffering with mental problems. Here, Paula
coaches Matt into taking some Paxil, so that
Skylab won't fall on him.

Matt McIrvin <mmcir...@world.std.com> wrote:

PAULA, I KNOW SKYLAB IS GOING TO FALL ON ME

> No, it's a sign that *I personally* have a
> tendency to become worried about catastrophic
> consquences of everything. I've known this
> for a long time-- when I was twelve, I was
> convinced that Skylab was going to fall ON
> ME PERSONALLY--

MATT, TAKE IT EASY AND TAKE SOME PAXIL

Matt, you are a sweetheart, but definitely a
worrying sweetheart. I hope you can find a way to
calm down your fears and turn off that cycle of
escalating worry. I have an aunt like that and
she has literally driven herself crazy....
I don't want you to end up like that. Take it
easy and take some paxil.

Paula

========================================

NEW!
LYNN K. Staunch Law and Order type
CAUGHT ON TAPE AT WOODSTOCK!
Passing Joint to Cameraman

From: Lynn K. (java...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Using Zoloft or Prozac as a one shot treatment
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior
Date: 2001-09-27 23:13:46 PST

Gwen Watson <g...@ig.utexas.edu> wrote in message
<news:3BB2402B.15D9C619@ig.utexas.edu>...

> At Woodstock?????? Oh you lucky, lucky women!
> I will be forever jealous of you devulging this tid
> bit of info! GGGGggggggggggggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

More of us than you know. I'm even in the movie.
Let me tell you about trying to advise a teenager
about drugs after the ever-helpful uncle points out
your 15 seconds of fame - passing a joint to the
cameraman as Arlo Gutrie croons "coming into Los
Angeleeeze......." in the background :-( Kind of
undermines the parental authority thing.

Lynn K.

==========================================

REC.PETS.DOGS CRAZY PERSON LIST
as of
8/1/2004
-----------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------

BREAKING MENTAL ILLNESS NEWS

DATELINE: AUGUST 1, 2004

Tara O. aka, Tee is an Anorexia Survivor

UNTIL YOU'VE LIVED WITH THIS DISORDER
YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW DEVASTATING

Tara O. aka Tee, is in many ways a typical suburban
South Carolinian soccer mom. Upon casual inspection,
nothing appears to be amiss. Tara, aka Tee spends her
free time surfing the internet and is a big fan of the
WB's "Gilmore Girls." Tara is also a passionate member
of the Carolina Boxer Rescue network. The only sign of
controversy or untowardness is that Tara's own Boxer
Summer was suddently put to sleep in October 2001,
despite several offers from an Orlando, FL dog expert
(Jerry Howe) to adopt her, claiming he could easily
cure Summer's behavioral problems.

Looking at Tara today, you'd never know that when she
was a teen, she suffered for five years with the
debilitating mental disorder, known as anorexia.
Tara is now a healthy weighted (some would say
plump) mom in her thirties, but during her teens
Tara O. (along with her Bulimic Friend), looked like
a skeleton.

like so many of the mentally ill before her, Tara O.
is coming forward because she wants to educate those
who come after her. The message Tara is sending is
clear. Mental illness is nothing to be ashamed of.
"We don't have to hide any longer!" she seems to be
saying.

Tara O. aka, Tee attributes her anorexia to
a lack of self esteem, which sprung from peer
pressure and an upbringing that could have been
more nurturing.

Determined that the same fate not befall her daughter
Amie, and out of a belief that no child should have to
follow the same path of self destruction and starvation,
Tara, in graphic and sometimes excruciating detail
relives the drama of how she was bowed and broken by,
but ultimately came back to beat anorexia.

YOU GO (gilmore) Girl!

Tara and Amie's harrowing saga (below) is a cautionary
tale and a must read for all of those, who care deeply
about the future of young girls in America. This is an
issue that affects both young and old, black and white,
male and female all across America.

Tara is doing everything in her power, including
medicating her daughter Amie with Ritalin, so that Amie
does not have to feel the sting of self esteem issues,
brought on by peer pressure courtesy of the cliques of
marauding "mean girls" who prey on young females
struggling to find their way and their indentity during
the precarious and perilous passage from adolescence
to young adulthood. We can only be thankful that Tara
prevailed and lived to tell her story.

We wish Tara O and her daughter Amie nothing but success
in overcoming mental illness and mental disorders. Tara
and Amie, you are an inspiration to us all!

I BATTLED ANOREXIA FOR MOST OF MY TEEN YEARS
WE BOTH LOOKED STICK THIN

Well if you had one and you did it to gain attention
then quite frankly you'd be the first person I have
ever heard of taking that approach. I battled anorexia
for most of my teen years and had a very good
acquaintance who was bulimic and almost died. We both
looked stick thin but could cover the circles around
our eyes with makeup and the colorless, chapped lips
with lipstick. How often did any of us see Diana out
in public during this time with no makeup on as well
as up-close & personal?

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue

UNTIL YOU'VE LIVED WITH THIS DISORDER
YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW DEVASTATING
IT'S NOT LIKE SLITTING YOUR WRISTS

Until you've lived with an eating disorder, you cannot
understand how devastating they can be or what goes on
in the person's head during the time. Book smarts are
all good and well but there is never just one
cut-and-dried reason for becoming bulimic or anorexic.
Your whole theory is shot simply by the fact that the
vast majority of bulimics and anorexics go out of their
way to HIDE their problems. They do not want attention
drawn to themselves. Its not like slitting your wrists
in the wrong direction so that people will know you want
or need help.

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue

------------

From: Tara O. (tara29...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Does Liza Weil have anorexia?
Newsgroups: alt.tv.gilmore-girls
Date: 2002-10-10 10:54:39 PST

SORRY TO BE GRAPHIC
HER NICE-SIZED CHEST WOULD SHRINK AND DROOP

She doesn't look anorexic to me. She'd be much
skinner, much bonier and her nice-sized chest would
shrink & droop. Sorry to be graphic but I know a
good bit about the disease and the effects it has
on appearance

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue
http://cbr.homestead.com

--------------------

"Tom" <tomlit...@hotmail.com> wrote

> So, from your view, why did Diana write a book by
> way of Andrew Morton that talked ALL about it? And
> then, why did she go on PANOROMA and talk about it
> some more?

FOR FIVE YEARS, I LOOKED LIKE A SKELETON, AND I
WANT TO HELP OTHERS. I'M STEPPING FORWARD, TOM

For the same reason that I've talked about my 5-year
problem with anorexia to others.....to educate others
and to help explain why when anyone sees pictures of
me during my teens, I look like a skeleton.

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue

----------

LEAVE PRINCESS DI ALONE, TOM

Newsgroups: alt.gossip.royalty
Date: 2002-08-06 05:35:07 PST

"Tom" <tomlit...@hotmail.com> wrote

> If she had been as sick as she said she was
> she would not have looked as good as she did.
> Her hair and teeth and
> skin would have been ragged and spotty.
> It's really that simple.

YOU'VE NEVER SUFFERED FROM THIS ILLNESS, TOM
YOU'VE NEVER STARVED YOURSELF, DAMMIT, I HAVE

No its not and you've obviously never suffered from
this illness or anorexia which is related. Firstly,
I've seen pictures of her where she did look deathly.
It was very likely only due to heavy makeup and help
with her hair that she even managed to look
presentable.

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue

---------

PEIR PRESSURE AND ANOREXIA

"Tom" <tomlit...@hotmail.com> wrote

> Bulimia is a sympton of a personality disorder.
> I'm not sure what doctor's you're talking to.
> Diana was absolutely a textbook example
> of a borderline personality:

LOOK, TOM, I SAW A DOCTOR FOR MY ANOREXIA
SO I KNOW A LITTLE MORE ABOUT THIS THAN YOU

"I've never heard of low self-esteem being
classified as a personality disorder. The doctors
I refer to are the ones who lectured at one of my
high school as well as a doctor I had to see for my
anorexia."

> Borderline personality disorder is characterized
> by mood instability
> and poor self-image.

PIER PRESSURE IS A BIG PROBLEM FOR TEENS, TOM

"Low self-esteem affects alot of people at some
point in their life, usually in their teens when
pier opinion is very important. Then there is
the lack of self-esteem created by a verbally
abusive friend or family member. You tell
someone something enough times and they might
just start believing you."

> Everything is related to personality.
> I don't see how you can say
> that any mental illness is NOT related to
> a personality disorder.
> Where are you getting your information?

MENTAL DISORDERS HAVE A WAY OF SHOWING
THEMSELVES THROUGH WORDS, TOM

"Related yes as in mental disorders have a way
of showing themselves through someone's words &
actions which can be interpreted as personality.
But mental issues and personality issues are not
one in the same."

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue
http://cbr.homestead.com

WHAT I HAVE LEARNED, TOM

From all I know of bulimia, it is not normally
a symptom of a personality disorder such as manic
depression, bi-polar, or anything else. It is,
most of the time from what I have come to know,
a byproduct of someone having too little
self-esteem. There are other reasons but none
that cause bulimia as often as lack of
self-esteem from what I have learned.

--
Tara

------------------

TARA'S DAUGHTER AMIE IS BEING DRUGGED FOR ADHD

From: Tee (crappolagozh...@netscape.net)
Subject: Re: OT - ADHD
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior
Date: 2004-02-07 21:09:37 PST

I'M NOT A RITALIN PUSHER

I should add that I'm not an ADHD or
Ritalin pusher. While there are diehard
disbelievers there are also diehard believers,
almost fanatical. My contributions to this
thread on children are based solely on my own
experience with Amie for the last 3.5 years
...

ONLY A WEEK

Amie has only been on the medication for a week.
We and the teacher have already noticed a
significant change in her ability to not only pay
attention
...

CLEARED ALL THE CHAOS AND NOISE

Its like someone cleared all the chaos & noise
out of her head and took the earplugs out of her
ears. That's not to say I swear by the drug because
its still in the trial phase with her but if this is
what we can expect from this medication then she'll
remain on it until she chooses not to.
...

MY DAUGHTER WILL NEVER BE AN HONOR STUDENT,
BUT I'M OKAY WITH THAT

My daughter will never be an honor roll student and
I don't care about that, I just don't want her to
fail school and watch her friends move on for something
she can't control.

--
Tara

------------------------------------


Dateline: rec.pets.dogs.* newsgroups
Breaking Mental Illness News, JUNE 2004!

H* @ 47 lbs!

Hattie, a boxer owned by shelly couvrette is
now down to 47 pounds. Couvrette, a librarian
at Indiana U. who suffers from obsessive/
compulsive disorder (OCD), was told by three
different Veterinarians that Hattie was "way
too skinny" when Hattie weighed 53 lbs.

Undeterred by that, and the reactions from
family and strangers on the street, shelly
continued shopping for vets and cutting
calories until Hattie,a chronic counter
surfer at age 5 now weighs just 47 lbs!

shelly finds all the symptoms of a starving
dog searching for nutrients to be
entertaining. Couvrette has developed a unique
technique to fool dogs who are having
pangs of starvation. She feeds them
green beans and canned pumpkin, so there
will be some "filler" in their stomachs
when they give her the "I'm Starving--no,
really" routine.

shelly is not nearly as obsessed with her
own weight, and has never been told by a
medical professional that she is "way too
skinny." If so, that medical professional
would be end up on this crazy person list
as well.

For a complete recap of the shelly and
hattie show, page down to the bottom of
this list.

=================================


In other news....
JUNE 2004

LEAH ditches Effexor for Zyban.

Leah Roberts, a professional dog
trainer and former Jew who has turned
her life over to Jesus, has graduated
from the ranks of PetSmart Trainers and
has signed on with a progressive agility
and family pet focused Dog Training outfit
Canine Action based in Orlando, Fl.
http://www.canineaction.com

As part of the move, Leah has switched
mental medications from from Effexor to
Zyban in an attempt to quit smoking. As a
result, she has much more energy, which
has allowed her to pass a colonoscopy exam
with flying colors.

Said Roberts:
"I'm wondering if it was the
med [effexor] and not the CFS that was
affecting me so badly."

Leah continues to improve her life and is
considering buying herself a motorcycle for
her 50th birthday later this year. Leah is
almost to the point where we can remove her
from the crazy person list. But not yet.
We wish her continued success in becoming
crazy-free.

============================================

RPD* MeNTally Ill All_StaRz
KUCKOO!! KUCKOOO! DING! DING! DING!

NESSA
NUTCASE
FORMER MVP (Most Valuable Psychotic) of
dog newsgroups

Successfully dethroned MaryBeth as MVP but
lost her title to shelly due to inactivity

Nessa blames all the problems in her life
on ADD, ADHD Or some other empowering acronym
which encapsulates her futility for her

Her dog bagel, a large newf mix
has used her house liberally
as a toilet since February of 2002. Drives
a 2003 Toyota Matrix, owns a house in
suburban MD, recently got a raise/promotion
to US goverment grade 11 (circa $50,000) and
promptly decided she couldn't afford her two
dogs. With help from non crazy regular
(Paulette) and witchcraft practicing regular
Sara Sionnach, Nessa has decided to keep her
dogs for the time being. She is undergoing
training from Janet "Nice Abdominal Surgery
and getting Run Over for the Family Pet" Boss.
Her results have not been dramatic.

CrAzy ReGulAr helping CraZy ReGular
Leah helping Nessa
=============================

On Fri, 7 Jun 2002 8:40:08 -0400, Leah wrote

Nessa use...@nessa.info wrote:

"As far as the depression goes,
it's not related to Bagel at all.
I have chronic major depression and
I'm just having a flare."

Leah asks
"Are you on any medication?"

Nessa responds

yes for depression, mood swings and ADHD.
I have been for over 10 years.

--nessa

Nessa is Fat as well as crazy

=============================
"For what it's worth...

I picked up 30 pounds when I started
Dilantin. I picked up (just recently) another
20 on risperidol.

I hate that I was a size 8-10 before meds and
now I am solidly (pun intended) a 22-24.

Sad part is, the side effects are worth it.
The positive effects
are too much to part with."

--nessa
============================

NESSA'S HAS A GREAT NEUROPSYCH

==============================

Hi, I have a great neuropsych in Arlington Va.
He is at the Rosyln Metro Station. His name is
Martin Stein
1911 N Fort Myer Dr.
Suite 907
Arlington Va 22209
703-807-2471
email 75120.2...@compuserve.com

Marty is wonderful. He is really the best.
He has also given me permission to post his
infomation on this Newsgroup. If you call
him and see him by all means tell him Nessa
sent you.

--nessa
================================

ROTATE YOUR STIMULANTS

=============================

from: Nessa (n...@ix.netcom.com)

Hi,

I often have to rotate my stimulants.
You can become used to them and sometimes
need a different one for a while. Until I
got on my Desoxyn I rotated Ritilan and
Dexedrine every 3 months or so.

It is true that anti-depressants or
anti-anxiety pills will help with the
stimulants so your DR is not wrong. However,
perhaps she needs to check into the idea that
a switch from cylert to something else might
be in order.

warm thoughts,
Nessa
=============================

=============================================
=============================================

Lois E.
(of Gary and Lois fame)

Lois' has been on tricyclic antidepressants for
approximately 25 years. This may be a record.
Husband is a cop but there is no evidence
that he beats the crap out of her, or that he
has for 25 years.

Had a traumatic experience as a child with a
horse running wild in the Pantry and living room.
In recent years, shot neighbor's dog from point
blank range while it was chewing on her pigmy goat,
teaching son to solve problems with the neighbor's
using shock and awe levels of violence."

BEEN ON TRICYCLICS FOR ABOUT 22 YEARS

"I don't take lithium, but I've been on trycyclics
for about 22 years. Been there, done that, have
the t-shirt to prove it. What's really terrific,
is now days you can say proudly,
"I take anti-depressives". Back when I started
taking them it was seen as something shameful.
If you cut your leg off, and were lying there with
a bleeding stump, you'd never let the word
depressed, pass your lips, or the doc's would say,
"You're depressed, on medication? Well, can't have
any pain meds.....you could become addicted." The
good old days. I actually had a Great Aunt who's
father locked her in her room back in the twenties
because she was simple. A shame that medication
probably would have helped her live a normal life.
No Denna, I was just saying with Darlene's
personality, she has a way of making grandiose
plans when at the top of her manic cycle....as
does my daughter. I wasn't saying that anyone
with problems could be counted on to be
irresponsible."

Lois E.

=============================================
=============================================

Kelly/
culprit

Systems engineer at Microsoft, owner of two
pitbulls, proving that Bill Gates does not
discriminate against crazy people or pit bull
owners.

psychotic features, panic and more. Coming
forward so that others like her will have the
strength to do the same. Like Charlie Wilkes,
she is one of our most entertraining regulars

Here, kelly/culprit talks to Mustang Sally
about her mental illness/crazy problems.
Sally is being rude and condescending (as usual)
and trying to make kelly/culprit feel bad for
being crazy, aka wacked in the head

culprit standing up for herself against rude and condescending Mustang
Sally
-----------------------------------------------

I WON'T DENY MY PROBLEMS, MUSTANG SALLY!

"but i stand by the fact that OCD is an
illness, major depression with psychotic features
certainly is, panic disorder is too. and the
other stuff just makes it all the more fun.

i don't wallow in it. i'm just now learning to
accept it, because ignoring it wasn't working out
too well. i need to do that to make changes to my
life so that i can become healthy. and you say
you're not trying to be condescending, but you're
doing it again. what i read was, (my paraphrasing)
"people who think they're mentally ill are
wallowing in their disabilities and letting them
consume their life"

you come across as though you would be able to
handle any of these illnesses, and anyone who
can't is just copping out. well we're all
different. and i don't accept your idea that i
would have a more productive life if i denied my
problems. i tried it for years, and believe me,
it didn't work very well."

-kelly aka culprit
systems engineer @ Microsoft
----------------------------------------------

=============================================
=============================================

MaryBeth
FMVP (former most valuable psycho)

(super psycho bitch
lunatic queen of the
mentally fucked in
the head)

Has contributed greatly to the annual profit
results at several large pharmaceutical corps
has taken virtually every mentally ill (crazy)
drug treatment in the book, and then some:
prozac, zoloft, amitryptiline, Buspar, Xanax,
effexor, paxil, HRT, wellbutrin, tranquilizers,
clomid,

MaryBeth has suffered from or been:

TIDAL WAVES OF PMS

suicidal, agoraphobic, tidal waves of PMS,
mood swings, turned into a hermit, bloated,
just real angry, hubby afraid of her, high
blood pressure, divorced, "raving bitch"
"zoloft zombie" for four years, "living
through layers and layers of gauze," chain
smoker, buzzing, weight gain, fatigue,
terrible dry mouth, dull headaches, fuzzy
brain, lack of concentration..etc.
severe depression, severe insomnia, Panic
ALL the time, crying, not sleeping, you name
it...etc...

MaryBeth (on being seriously f'd in the head
aka mentally ill) aka cuckoo! kuckoo! ding! ding! ding!
aka a superpsychotic bitch from hell

I RAN OVER EVERYONE IN MY PATH

"I know for a fact I went thru years of
being overly sensitive, being a b*tch,
being self centered, being self pitying,
you name it, I was a wreck and I ran over
everyone in my path."

"<G> I do know the power of meds, especially
on a long term basis, and it's not pretty.
You become another person, if it's not the
correct med for you.

--All the best,
MaryBeth

DON'T TAKE ULTRAM AND ZOLOFT TOGETHER

"Yup Diane, I am taking Zoloft, and my
Rheumatologist told me that taking
Ultram with it can cause seizures."

"I have all the symptoms.I am suicidal at
times (cyclical) have severe insomnia,
'crawly' skin etc. I have an appt to see
my doc next Friday to test for menopause."

--MaryBeth

ME NOT SO HORNY

"I noticed that antidepressants cut libido
into the dead zone and I had no real emotions,
like not laughing at funny stuff, couldn't cry
either.....except about my suicidal thoughts
(but at the time I thought there was no other
way out)."

--MaryBeth

NEW TO GROUP

"Hi, new to group, just starting Clomid today.
I talked with RE and pharmacist re: zoloft (50
mg daily) and ineraction with Clomid. They
reported none. Not sure about the prozac tho.
Gonna poat a new message to intorduce
myself :)"

--MaryBeth <still feeling
like herself> <G>

WASTED 10 YEARS

"I wasted about 10 years of my life, and lost
many many treasured ppl and things. Please
don't do the same. (((((((SCOUT))))))))))

--MaryBeth

WAS HORRIBLE

"Slowly but surely my depression got worse and
worse. They put me on meds for it, and all
along kept telling me to wait on the TKR, as
'it really wasn't that bad.....yet". HA!"
The depression got so bad, and lots of other
things happened and my ex and I would up
divorced four years after our move. It was
horrible. The hardest thing I have eve gone
thru"

--MaryBeth

=============================================
=============================================

Theresa Willis

(paxil, depression, robot displacement)
Theresa is a gang banger who comes out
of cutesy robot mode when it's time to
gang attack people with her pal shelly
Victim is usually Leah, but may be a
random person.

=============================================
=============================================

shelly
couvrette

OUR NEWEST MVP (MOST VALUABLE PSYCHOTIC)

All in the Mental Family

shelly: severe OCD
shelly's mom: chronic depression
shelly's brother: severe BiPolar

Severe OCD, depression, prescribed Paxil
for mental illness, but claims she does
not take it, resulting in an obsessive
basket case online persona. Posts more than
any other female in all dog newsgroups

(familial mental illness, possibly related
to family bed) obsessively starves her
dogs according to friends, family,
strangers and 3 different vets, but
not herself (see below). Still thinks
of herself as a five year old ballerina
despite the fact that she is a fat
adult in her mid thirties.

PAGE ALL THE WAY UP FOR BONUS COVERAGE
NEW, HATTIE DOWN TO 47 POUNDS!!

NEWER, SHELLY GOES KUCKOOO!!! Over
shih tzu's being fed almost as much
as hattie (page to top)

=============================================

Leah

Effexor for chronic depression, in denial
about being mentally ill. Has taken
several other mentally ill medications
before settling on effexor for her
chronic mental problems. Leah is
improving as a dog trainer and wants
to open her own training/boarding
kennel soon and write a book.

This drives her fellow
mentally ill regulars nuts (read shelly
Lynn K.), especially if Leah succeeds
while other loonies continue to sit on
their fat behinds

Leah is a relatively stable crazy person
but she just might be the agent that drives
others to jump off of a cliff

NEW, Leah gets a new job. Switches mental
medication from Effexor to Zyban

=============================================
=============================================

Bethgsd

German Shepherd enthusiast Bethgsd is
taking an unamed SSRI for severe
depression.

Here, Bethgsd, points out to Gwen the
importance of being understanding about
the mental problems of crazy people.

GWEN, GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS
I SUFFER FROM SEVERE DEPRESSION

"Well, Gwen I suffer from severe depression
which is controlled by a particular SSRI and
I find it insulting that you don't feel that
chemical imbalances can be lifethreatening.
No, I don't go into status but I've attempted
to commit suicide a few too many times. And
no, those weren't little "cries for help"
they were honest to G-D attemts to get out of
the pain.

So get your head out of your ass and realize
that chemical imbalances can be as life
threatening, if in a different way, than
electrical misfiring."

Beth [aka Bethgsd]

=============================================
=============================================

Tara O. aka Tee

UNTIL YOU'VE LIVED WITH THIS DISORDER
YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW DEVASTATING

Tara O. aka Tee, is in many ways a typical suburban
South Carolinian soccer mom. Upon casual inspection,
nothing appears to be amiss. Tara, aka Tee spends her
free time surfing the internet and is a big fan of the
WB's "Gilmore Girls." Tara is also a passionate member
of the Carolina Boxer Rescue network. The only sign of
controversy or untowardness is that Tara's own Boxer
Summer was suddently put to sleep in October 2001,
despite several offers from an Orlando, FL dog expert
(Jerry Howe) to adopt her, claiming he could easily
cure Summer's behavioral problems.

Looking at Tara today, you'd never know that when she
was a teen, she suffered for five years with the
debilitating mental disorder, known as anorexia.
Tara is now a healthy weighted (some would say
plump) mom in her thirties, but during her teens
Tara O. (along with her Bulimic Friend), looked like
a skeleton.

like so many of the mentally ill before her, Tara O.
is coming forward because she wants to educate those
who come after her. The message Tara is sending is
clear. Mental illness is nothing to be ashamed of.
"We don't have to hide any longer!" she seems to be
saying.

Tara O. aka, Tee attributes her anorexia to
a lack of self esteem, which sprung from peer
pressure and an upbringing that could have been
more nurturing.

Determined that the same fate not befall her daughter
Amie, and out of a belief that no child should have to
follow the same path of self destruction and starvation,
Tara, in graphic and sometimes excruciating detail
relives the drama of how she was bowed and broken by,
but ultimately came back to beat anorexia.

YOU GO (gilmore) Girl!

Tara and Amie's harrowing saga (below) is a cautionary
tale and a must read for all of those, who care deeply
about the future of young girls in America. This is an
issue that affects both young and old, black and white,
male and female all across America.

Tara is doing everything in her power, including
medicating her daughter Amie with Ritalin, so that Amie
does not have to feel the sting of self esteem issues,
brought on by peer pressure courtesy of the cliques of
marauding "mean girls" who prey on young females
struggling to find their way and their indentity during
the precarious and perilous passage from adolescence
to young adulthood. We can only be thankful that Tara
prevailed and lived to tell her story.

We wish Tara O and her daughter Amie nothing but success
in overcoming mental illness and mental disorders. Tara
and Amie, you are an inspiration to us all!

I BATTLED ANOREXIA FOR MOST OF MY TEEN YEARS
WE BOTH LOOKED STICK THIN

Well if you had one and you did it to gain attention
then quite frankly you'd be the first person I have
ever heard of taking that approach. I battled anorexia
for most of my teen years and had a very good
acquaintance who was bulimic and almost died. We both
looked stick thin but could cover the circles around
our eyes with makeup and the colorless, chapped lips
with lipstick. How often did any of us see Diana out
in public during this time with no makeup on as well
as up-close & personal?

--
Tara
Carolina Boxer Rescue

Page to the top for more...

=============================================
=============================================

Paula

OUR FIRST CRAZY MORMON

Paula is a divorced Mormon Mom who dabbles freely
in Kibology, leaving herself at risk for being
Smite into a pile of rubble by either an angry,
vengeful God or worse yet, a Kibo unglued.

As a California based youth counselor, Paula
helps children deal with physical & emotional
problems while dealing with mental problems of
her own. Particularly chronic depression for
which she is drugged.

Paula has a long history of questioning her
faith, questioning her mother and worrying about
whether or not she'll be excommunicated for the
thoughts in her head. With good reason, after
spending so much time fraternizing with free
thinking, blaspheming Kibologists.

At one point, when Paula was suffering from a
heavy bout of depression, and in violation of
Mormonology and her mother's own advice, she
eschewed prayer and instead enlisted the heelp of
Harco Industries own twillis, who cruelly
flaunted her vaunted Paxil supply

"Sorry, go ride a horse, hands off my
Paxil."
says HARCO's twillis

WON'T SHARE MY PAXIL WITH PAULA

From: HarCo Industries (tdwil...@earthlink.net)
Subject: Re: I need
Newsgroups: alt.religion.kibology
Date: 2003-05-13 09:48:41 PST

m*.@earthlink.ent (Paula) wrote

> I need something to get me out of this
> deepening depression.

I prescribe a horseback ride.

Really.

I'd share my Paxil with you, but I'm selfish.

twillis

To which Paula responded:

THE PAXIL IS NOT ENOUGH

"HAH! Paxil stopped working for me
and I had to switch to Celexa, for the
really and truly messed up!"

Paula

Page to the top for much more on
this mental case

=============================================
=============================================
Tara Green

Tara Green is a dog trainer of sorts in New York
City left rpd* claiming that she could
not afford internet access and/or a computer,
but her story is of value nonetheless

was on antidepressants for a few years
prior to her marriage. During her
marriage, she learned a lot:
"With the therapist I saw during my
marriage I learned that some
situational depressions are masked as
chemical simply because of our too human
ability to prolong the impact of the
causal situations indefinitely"

Sounds like more denial, see leah

Tara is also a drunk who has also had
problems with other substances

TARA on being a drunk/substance abuser:

"Tara (who had some problems with quite a
few substances as well, but who thinks they
are separate issues.....so which camp does
that put me in???)"

"Believe it or not, some people don't have
a problem with drugs even though they are
alcoholics. I'm not one of those people,
but they do exist."

aka, tara has problems with both

=============================================
=============================================

Kevin
Michael
Vail

various mental illness drugs, started with
zoloft, didn't like that, then went to
antidepressant, stopped after sufficent
side effects, now on SSRI and in therapy
Kevin is a homosexual but there is no
evidence that this is the cause of him
being crazy

=============================================
=============================================

Furpaw

(SSRI, cognitive therapy)
otherwise, a fairly boring
and nondescript crazy person

=============================================
=============================================
=============================================

Charlie
Wilkes

drugged out, crazy, fucked up all his
life, Christ the shit he's been through
including psych wards and electroshock
treatments but now pulling down major cash
as a business consultant. Triumphing over
adversity, with a damn good life and a
well trained dog. One of our most lucid
regulars, despite (or maybe because of?)
a penchant for phat philly blunts.

=============================================
=============================================

Karen
DuChateaux
aka Karibear

suffered from clinical depression for years
until some drug or something brought her out
of it. Some of her best friends "are
certifiable" and have various degrees of
psychoses. Familial mental disability.
Refuses to say whether or not she is
currently using drug or cognitive therapy
for mental illness.

=============================================
=============================================

Mike
"DumbOxDumb"
Dufort

threatened non violent dog expert Jerry Howe
with Mike's fully armed US Army Platoon.
Threatened to bring his platoon to Jerry's
HOWSE. also OCD (obsessed with Jerry's posts)

=============================================
=============================================

Jim "Brain
Shivers"
Sabatke

Jim is currently on Effexor which he takes
because of his depression/mental problems.
Like many of our mental cases, Jim has had
trouble finding the right med(s) to keep him
from going kuckoo!! kuckoooo!!! or getting
the "brain shivers"

From: Jim Sabatke (jsaba...@execpc.com)
Subject: Re: anyone using Effexor?
alt.support.depression.medication
Date: 2002-11-29 20:25:16 PST

EFFEXOR
"I'm on 375 mg/day and it has worked
wonders for me. The only down side is
that my blood pressure has elevated
somewhat; oh and if I miss a dose by a
couple of hours the "brain shivers" can
be really bad.

Good luck!

Jim

"I switched from Paxil to Effexor about
5 months ago. I tapered off of the Paxil
and tapered onto the Effexor at the same
time."

Jim

"After several years on Effexor IR, my
pdoc tried switching me to XR. I
experienced fairly severe Effexor
withdrawel until I went back to the IR."

Jim

=============================================



SHELLY DETHRONES NESSA AS OUR NEW MVP (most
valuable psychotic) Nessa loses MVP title due to inactivity
so shelly takes over by default)

ALL NEW as of 9/19/2004
A SPECIAL BONUS ON shelly couvrette,

All in the Mental Family

shelly: severe OCD
shelly's mom: chronic depression
shelly's brother: severe BiPolar

shelly's dogs are victims of Munchausens
Anorexia by proxy Syndrome. Here, she goes
off the deep end because she OCD'd on a
conversation she overheard about the quantity
of food being fed to her coworker's son's
shih tzus.

hattie, shelly's starving boxer (who,
theoretically, if she was not being
systematically starved by a psychotic
owner) should weigh at least five times
more than a shih tzu, yet she doesn't
get five times as much food. She
doesn't even get twice as much.

Can you say "KUCKOOOO!!!"

IT DRIVES ME CRAZY THAT MY COWORKER'S SON
DOESN'T STARVE HIS DOG

SHIH TZUS EAT MORE THAN HALF AS MUCH AS
HATTIE

one of my cow-orkers was just on the phone
with her son.....

and, get this! the were discussing feeding
amounts. her Shih Tzus eat more than half
as much as my dogs! i don't know if that's
because Iams is less calorically dense than
the foods my dogs eat or what, but i'm
boggled. *boggled*, i tell ya'.

so, anyway, i've bitten my tongue nearly
in half.

-- shelly (perfectly foul wench) and
elliott and harriet

EMACIATED, VET WAS SURPRISED

"when i got harriet she was emaciated, so
i asked my vet for advice on slowly adding
weight to her. six months later i took
harriet in for her spring check-up and my
vet was surprised that at how thin she still
was."
--shelly couvrette

STILL VET SHOPPING

"<raises hand> i've been told by three
different vets that harriet (53lbs) is
*way* too skinny. we're still vet-shopping,
BTW."

--shelly couvrette

THE OL' "I'M STARVING" ROUTINE

"if you really can't resist it when your dog pulls
the "i'm starving!" routine <G>, you can give
him some frozen green beans or a small amount
of plain pureed pumpkin. i would also suggest
putting the food out of his sight. i keep my
food--still inside the bags, which are tightly
rolled down--inside trash cans in the closed
laundry room. that keeps it fresh and keeps
it out of my dogs' sight."

--shelly couvrette

POSITIVELY STARVED

"heh. i get the opposite response. people think
that poor little harriet is positively starved
to death. i've actually had people stop me in
the pet supply shop and tell me that i need to
fatten her up!"

--shelly couvrette

WHO WANTS TO BE TOLD YOU ARE HURTING YOUR
WIDDLE PRECIOUS?

"i think that may be part of the problem. who
wants to go to a vet who tells you you're
hurting your .widdle precious? i think the
other part is that some vets really don't
*realize* that what they consider proper weight
is fat. after having been told by a couple of
vets that my dogs are too thin, i've got a dim
view of vets on that topic."

--shelly couvrette

JUST A BITE WON'T HURT
--shelly's mom

FEED HER AND I'LL RIP YOUR
ARM OFF, BITCH
-shelly

"my mom is kinda that way, but not *as* bad.
she thinks that harriet is awfully skinny,
so feeding her table snax is okay. she
tells me that just a bite won't hurt."

--shelly couvrette

March 2004, HATTIE DOWN TO 47 POUNDS

"while i was sick,
elliott was *pretty* good (he got really
needy and pathetic toward the end), but
harriet turned into 47lbs of pure
orneriness."

--shelly couvrette

NOBODY IS STARVING SHELLY

NOBODY WILL STOP SHELLY ON THE STREET
AND TELL HER SHE IS STARVING HERSELF
shelly's fat face
http://home.bluemarble.net/~sc ouvrette/Wshelly2.jpg

=======================================================

There are a lot of big fat women on these groups who
starve their dogs out of vanity, but shelly is a
special case.

shelly is more than a little bit beyond the pale

Shelly has OCD, and maybe she's just a little
obsessive about measuring out extra tiny and
discrete portions with a tiny measuring
cup, or counting out pieces of green bean or
pumpkin that she gives her dogs when they give
her the "I'm Starving" routine. When grandma
tried to give Hattie a snack, shelly probably
went apeshit, because it was in violation of
her Obsessive need to oversee every tiny
calorie that goes into her widdle precious'
mouth.

shelly's a special case, a special kind of
dog abuser.

NEWSFLASH

in late september, 2004 shelly left the group
because diddy was a meanie pants to her.
shelly's illness prevented her from seeing
the reality that she was the # 1
meanie pants in the history of the dog
newsgroups. We hope she gets the treatment
she needs.

================
----------------------------

HOWEDY laura,

"Laura" <l...@wordfixers.no> wrote in message
news:QLiZb.936$EV2.7231@amstwist00...

> Diana wrote:

diana is a dog abuser a liar and a mental case.

Like yourself.

> | > if other areas of his obedience are going well,
> | > use that to help you break this habit - if he's
> | > busy performing a command for you, he won't
> | > be busy barking for you.

Yeah. That'll provoke the dog to do it MOORE
cause it'll REWARD his attention gettin devices.

> Lee John Moore wrote:
> | I've tried this too, but have no success.

That's cause lee is a MOOREON.

> | He performs the command but continues to bark.

SEE??? Told ya so!

> Since he's a smart and obedient dog,

Yeah. Smart, obedient, Feisty, Humorous, Brave,
Curious And Playful. Full Of "Joie de Vivre,"

> perhaps you could give him a command

Like the DIE command, laura?

> that precludes barking?

Oh? You must mean the "NO BARK!" command.
Won't work on this Feisty, Humorous, Brave,
Curious And Playful. Full Of "Joie de Vivre, dog.

> Perhaps teach him to sit and hold an object for
> you - dumbbell, glove, rolled newspaper, ball -

Yeah. That'll make him very happy. He WANTS
attention, and that'd be payin him off.

> you could simply carry an item like this in your
> pocket when you go out.

RIGHT. That COULD work... till WON fine
day when IT don't have sumpthin to put in
ITS MHOWETH and then he'll GO NUTS.

> And then Sit! Hold! would produce the
> desired behaviour?

Yeah. Like it did for your DEAD DOG Chewie.

> Just a thought...

Yeah. That's HOWE COME you MUREDERED
your own DEAD DOG Chewie.

> Laura and Angel in Oslo

laura MURDERED her heart dog Chewie just like
HOWE your pal tara o. did her DEAD DOG Summer
as have many of HOWER DOG LOVERS here abHOWETS.

Here's HOWE COME laura KILLED her dog Chewie:

From: Laura Arlov (l...@wordfixers.no)
Subject: Re: Chewie bit my husband !

Date: 1999/01/20

Well, we're doing as you say Dogman,
and I'll keep you all posted.

------------------------------

> Laura in Oslo

You're quite the dog enthusiast, eh laura?

> The listener,

You didn't WANT to listen to The Puppy Wizard when
HE told you you couldn't PUNISH and INTIMIDATE
your dog or you'd make IT aggressive.

> the observer.

NHOWE you got a DEAD DOG HOWETA it.

> We do work were you sometimes have to observe people

Like laura, MURDERING her dog...

> and take notes.

INDEEDY!

> B. has amazing powers of observation and concentration.

RIGHT...

> Laura and Angel in Oslo

"Feisty, Humorous, Brave, Curious And
Playful. Full Of "Joie de Vivre," And DEAD.

Date: 2003-10-29 23:49:52 PST

HOWEDY People,

Here's HOWE COME laura arlov KILLED her "Feisty,
Humorous, Brave, Curious And Playful. Full Of "Joie
de Vivre," And DEAD DOG Chewie:

From: Dogman (dog...@i1.net)
Subject: Re: Dogman advocates dogs biting people
Date: 1999/04/25

While I was listening to the Miles Davis CD, "Kind Of
Blue," and drinking a little Booker's, on 24 Apr 1999
22:47:09 GMT, brokens...@aol.com (Brokenseat) wrote:

> Was that a SERIOUS ENOUGH bite for you dogman,
> or was it insignificant? Why would you suggest getting
> a book or obediance, is there no bite SERIOUS enough
> for you?

Yes, there are, but this one was *caused* by the actions
of a very, very STUPID human being, someone much like
yourself.

And it only hapopened ONCE.

And there are many, many dogs out there today
living perfectly normal and honorable lives who,
upon having done to them what was done to
this dog ("Chewie"), would also bite.

I mean, how stupid can one person get?

Don't answer that yet, Broke, you're setting a new
record almost everyday.

Here's what the owner's husband did (and precisely
what caused the bite), just in case you forgot:

> (My husband was holding Chewie's head and looking
> him in the eye and yelling at him, and Chewie growled
> louder and louder and louder and then bit my husband.)

I wonder just how many dogs out there wouldn't at
least be tempted to bite some stupid idiot for doing
that to him?

I include below the entire post for viewers reading
pleasure, and so they can take everything I said in
its proper *context.*

PS: I'd be willing to wager a large amount of money
that this particular dog will never bite this guy again,
provided:

1.) The family gives this dog some OBEDIENCE training.

2.) The guy refrains from doing really STUPID things to the dog.

3.) The guy PARTICIPATES in the training.

4.) They have a professional ASSESS the dog.

Putting this dog down simply for doing the above is
UNCONSCIONABLE.

This dog needs to be assessed, in person, by a knowledgeable
trainer/behaviorist before any action is even considered.

>>>> Now yesterday morning, Chewie lost his temper with my
>>>> husband and bit him, hard. (Deep puncture, lots of blood,
>>>> docot visit, tetanus shot, antibiotics, the whole shooting
>>>> match)

>>> Dogman's words of wisdom:
>>> You need to get a book on recognizing animal
>>> behavior ***(I have some listed on my web site)***,
>>> and you need to get your husband (and children, if
>>> they're old enough) involved in the OBEDIENCE
>>> training of this dog.
>>> WRONG. You need to cull. Do not give that dog a
>>> second chance to bite someone and draw blood
>>> another time, like your childs face...
>>> Broke Egoman and his dangerous advice should be ignored.

Doofuses are always welcome to ignore my advice,
after all, that's why they remain doofuses, eh?

********************

Beginning of the actual post, before Broke selectively snipped:

Upon my return to the Cuckoo's Nest,
Tue, 19 Jan 1999 22:22:09 ?,

"Laura Arlov" <l...@wordfixers.no> says:

[...]

>We have an 18 month old male Airedale Terrier,
>Chewbacca (Chewie). He's entire -- and I might as well
>tell you right now it's not legal to neuter male dogs in
>Norway for anything other than medical reasons, so he'll
> probably be staying that way.

That's too bad, because neutering might help (of course,
it might not help, either).

FYI, 95% of stallions (horses) in America are neutered.

That's right, only 5% of horses are responsible for breeding.

Why?

Have you ever been on a ranch or farm where there
were a lot of stallions living together?

If you had, you'd understand why 95% of them get
their *tools* taken away at an early age!

The same thing goes for dogs to a great extent.

>Now yesterday morning, Chewie lost his temper with my
>husband and bit him, hard. (Deep puncture, lots of blood,
>docot visit, tetanus shot, antibiotics, the whole shooting match)
>I have no trouble seeing how this incident is a result
>of Chewie's age and hormones, and mistakes that we
>have made.

> He's our first dog. before we got him I read that Airedale
> males could be a pretty tough proposition, so I've been
> working actively with Chewie and settring limits for him
> all his life, and he respects me.

But he doesn't respect your hubbie, does he?
Otherwise this would never have happened.

You're right, Airedales are TOUGH dogs, just like
virtually any *terrier.*

>My son and husband mostly pet him and play with him.

That's part of your problem I think. Your husband has
fallen in the pecking order to an EQUAL. That is, your
dog sees your husband as an equal, perhaps even an
inferior, and that's what the growling, etc., were all about.

> Now that Chewie is trying to improve his position
> in our family flock by defying my husband, my husband
> is all of the sudden trying to put his foot down and discipline
> Chewie...

This putting-down-of-the-foot cannot take place quickly.
It will have to develop over time.

But the best way to accelerate it is to have your husband
start to take over the OBEDIENCE training of your dog,
and he needs a lot more of it, Laura.

No dog of mine would ever even think about growling
at me, much less ever bite me. Or any member of my
family, the dog's pack.

Because I've made them all realize, early on, that all
humans are higher in status to them.

And their OBEDIENCE training is *ongoing,* therefore
it's constantly reinforced.

Dogs ABHOR leadership vacuums!

> (My husband was holding Chewie's head and looking
> him in the eye and yelling at him, and Chewie growled
> louder and louder and louder and then bit my husband.)

You need to get a book on recognizing animal behavior
(I have some listed on my web site), and you need to get
your husband (and children, if they're old enough) involved
in the OBEDIENCE training of this dog.

Otherwise you're likely to have *much* more serious
problems down the road.

> So, we did exactly what the experts on this ng usually
> advise: we called a really good dog training organization
> (where Chewie and I did basic training) and they will be
> sending one or maybe two instructors to observe as all
> at home, help us to understand our dog, and help us with
> home routines and training to straighten this out.

This will really help, I'm sure. They'll want to observe
and understand your pack's "dynamics."

Then they can show you some things that will allow
your husband to assume a more dominant role in the
dog's pack.

> While we're waiting for our first appointment, we're
> supposed to write down our own impressions of Chewie's
> behavior both around the bite and otherwise. And it is clear
> that he feels he came out of the encounter "a bigger man."

You bet. That's why an ounce of PREVENTION is
always worth a pound of CURE.

Especially when it comes to reinforcement of canine behavior.

> Yesterday and today he has gone nuts in the backseat
> of the car when somebody walked by with a male dog...
> and when he pees, he lifts his leg so high he fell over
> twice today.

Yup. This dog needs some intensive OBEDIENCE
training, in my opinion.

But it usually takes an on-site OBSERVATION to
make an accurate assessment of your situation.

> I feel pretty badly about this...sad, I guess. He's a
> great little dog.

He's not so "little," eh?

> Feisty, humorous, brave, curious and playful. Full of
> "joie de vivre" Not outstandlingly intelligent, but shrewd.
> Charming, when he wants to be. I feel like he's really
> blotted his copy books seriously, and I sure see how a
> lot of the responsibility for this is ours.

You're got the right attitude, Laura. Almost all canine behavior
"problems" are created (and reinforced) by us humans.

>Stay tuned, and see how it goes as we try to straighten out this
>dog -- and, maybe more importantly, his owners!

I will, and I hope you will, indeed, let us know how this works
out!

Good luck!

--

Dogman
d*.@i1.net

Dogman's Den
http://www.i1.net/~dogman

"One four minute session of obedience work,
done properly, will prevent behavior problems
for 48-72 hours. It's in the manual."
Jerry "Moonbeam" Howe

From: m i cha el <"m ich ael_at dogtv dot com">
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 00:24:00 -0400
Subject: Re: For Handsome Jack Morrison: Collars - (MENTAL NEWS)

Paula wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 16:29:48 -0500, shelly <scouvre...@bluemarble.net>
> wrote:

>>on 2005-07-18 at 21:09 <mmmtobler...@earthlink.ent> wrote:
>>> Interesting that it comes from "Your Conscience" and starts
>>> with HOWE speak and yet ends with "Lucy" talking about Jerry
>>> and signed by "Lucy."

>> that, and Lucifer who just happened to show up today, xposting
>> Howespew to kingdom come and back again.

> I can understand that. When his meds are working better, he wants to
> say some of the same things without looking like a complete lunatic
> and an ass and maybe clean up the image of that other Jerry. So up
> pops someone to say well, he's kind of odd, but his ideas are great!
> Apparently, he has been skipping a few doses here and there again and
> is on his way back to psycho only.

Well... We don't really know whether or not Jerry uses
meds, but we know you do!

How are your meds treating you?

=============================


This has been a production of
dogtv.com networks
your world leader in dog entertraining

this marks the end of the rec.pets.dogs.* crazy person list

----------------------------------------------------

copyright 2004
dogtv.com networks

you are free to reproduce this list for
group harmony purposes

--
this is michael
the voice of reason
reporting live...
http://dogtv.com

(Oh, an pardon The Amazing Puppy Wizard for TOP
POSTIN, Soup. It's NOT a symptom of dominance
HOWEver, it's MOORE like laziness.)


BigHairyBeanBag
2005-12-20 11:36:03 EST
In article <1135068988.931016.32160@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
A*y@HushMail.Com says...
> MENTAL ILLNESS In RPD*
>
> RPD* MeNTally Ill All_StaRz as of 7/27/2004
>
> KUCKOO!! KUCKOOO! DING! DING! DING! List
>
> List Of Confirmed Mentally Ill (CRAZY)Regulars
>
> RPD CRAZY PERSON ROLL CALL And BIOS
>
> !CAVEAT!

Why don't you shut up, st00pid. You are not wanted here and get the hell
out before we make your life hell for you! We can make it difficult for
you to post in here and will continue to do so.

FOAD.

JohnWesley
2005-12-20 23:11:04 EST
!CAVEAT!
>
> Why don't you shut up, st00pid. You are not wanted here and get the hell
> out before we make your life hell for you! We can make it difficult for
> you to post in here and will continue to do so.
>
> FOAD.
>
Just Filter Him! He'll be gone forever! Thats what I've done.

S*@yahoo.com
2005-12-21 01:50:39 EST
john wesley harding was a friend to the poor!


U*@yahoo.com
2005-12-21 05:15:56 EST
BigHairyBeanBag chooses to stand up to Jerry Howe instead of running
away, as you ran away.


S*@yahoo.com
2005-12-21 18:49:38 EST
Eigh be,Non tre
Ruin way!
ISIS!
!!!


JohnWesley
2005-12-21 22:25:23 EST
In article <1135160156.400028.132540@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
unsurreality_2005@yahoo.com says...
> BigHairyBeanBag chooses to stand up to Jerry Howe instead of running
> away, as you ran away.
>
>
Standing up to him just makes him more vocal. If you ignored him he'd
go away!

PLONK!!

U*@yahoo.com
2005-12-22 05:07:11 EST
That's where you are wrong - most everyone has ignored him for 5 or 6
years and he hasn't gone away. So, what...should we wait 10 more years
of ignoring him in order to rid him?

PLONK!!!


A*@HushMail.Com
2005-12-22 10:06:42 EST
HOWEDY pat,

unsurreality_2005@yahoo.com wrote:
> That's where you are wrong - most everyone has ignored him for 5 or 6 years

Well then HOWE COME The Amazing Puppy Wizard is the #1 topic here
abHOWETS on The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY
NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums?

> and he hasn't gone away.

After all, these ARE The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY
NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums. AIN'T THEY, dog abusers...

> So, what...should we wait 10 more years of ignoring him in order to rid him?

Naaaah. The Amazing Puppy Wizard is abHOWET to drop the doGdameneD
hammer on the entire industry and you'll be IDENTIFIED EXXXPOSED and
DISCREDITED and you'll NEVER post your idiotic malice on ANY forum
again.

> PLONK!!!

Here's a DOG LOVER who DIDN'T WANT to believe The Amazing
Puppy Wizard when HE TOLD him he was HURTIN his dog:

From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 00:46:33 GMT
Subject: Back in town...

Hey guys/gals,

Just wanted to say hello and that I'm back up and posting.
A few things have changed since I was here last...I thought
we banished Jerry Howe, what's goin' on??

Chrisman

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 22:06:15 GMT
Subject: Re: Back in town...

Last time he was here somebody posted his home
address and pictures of his house, that seemed
to shut him up for a while...

Chrisman

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2001 00:12:26 GMT

Subject: Re: Back in town...

Nice to hear from you!!

We should have a secret NG, the title for which
would be completely indiscriminate, nothing to
do with dogs. Only certain individuals would
know where to go.

Jerry is a plague on all dog related NG's.
I fear that this might be our only escape....

Please don't hesitate to ask if there is anything
about this breed that you don't understand. Jeff
and I, as well as millions of others have to do a
better job of telling the best kept secret in the
animal Kingdome...."Pitbulls are sweet and loving
pets, lovers and protectors of children, kissers
of faces, waggers of tails. Chrisman

Chrisman Dinnan wrote:

By "Toughness" I mean that which makes pitbulls
different from a border collie for example. An
owner who has not researched properly must be
informed about various aspects of the breed and
toughness is definatly one of them.

Sure, my dog is pretty much a sissy, raised him
from five weeks old, he took naps in the palm of
my hand while I rubbed his belly and talked to
him, got him that young because I wanted him and
my Bull Terrier (also a sissy) to get along, and
they do, but make no mistake about it, where the
normal dog may bark at a squirel my pitbull "Usul"
(means: the strenght at the base of the pillar)
damm near shimmy up that tree and will bloody his
mouth trying to bite branches to better his position.

It is this determination, their tender and thoughtful
expressions, thier wide, beautiful heads, the purpose
for which the breed originated, thier athleticism, the
gentle manner in which they can take you entire forearm
in their massive jaws and never bruse you when you play,
thier bad gass, TUG-OF-WAR, and "toughness" that sets
them appart from other breeds.

Toughness is a virtue, we should not be
afraid to mention it in this newsgroup.


A Dog Lover's Eulogy To His BEAST Friend:

For Usul... + Congratulations, Graduate Of
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method
School Of HARD KNOCKS -
Think, IMPROVISE, And WELCOME GRADUATE STUDENTS!!!:

Hello chrisman,

"Chrisman Dinnan" <broco...@earthlink.net>
news:B87BB320.8DA%brocolli@earthlink.net...

> Something is wrong with the world and I just can¹t
> stand it anymore, no longer will I be greeted by
> your waging tail when I come in the door.

Oh, well that's EZ to figger HOWET, chrisman!

That's on account of you freakin MURDERED your own dog
cause you mishandled him like the rest of your dog lover
pals do with their incessant penchant for crates bribes
pronged spiked pinch choke collars and shock devices.

What the heel do you EXPECT?

That's HOWE COME The Amazing Puppy Wizard DON'T
USE use those "TOOLS" which make your dog THINK
you are freakin G-D, chrisman.

> Your presence is missed, I just thought you should know,

You MURDERED your own dog on accHOWENT of you
COULDN'T STOP JERKING and CHOKING IT on your
pronged spiked pinch choke collar JUST LIKE
HOWE The Amazing Puppy Wizard SEZ YOU WOULD.

DIDN'T YOU, you sorry pathetic dog abusing coward.

> I would have given anything just so you didn¹t have to go.

Yeah. Everything but STOP JERKING and CHOKING your
dog to make you FEEL like freakin G-D you miserable
doubletalkin dog abusin LUNATIC. You REFUSED to learn
HOWE to handle him puperly.

You TRAINED your dog to growl at kids cause you HURT
and INTIMIDATED him just like steve walker done to
his DEAD DOG Sampson and tara o. aka tee done to her
DEAD DOGS Summer and Tyson and Robert Crim did to
his DEAD DOG Fritz The Wonder Dog.

DIDN'T YOU, chrisman.

And NHOWE you're gonna PISS an MOAN abHOWET it
and pass the CRYIN towel and get SYMPATHY from
the rest of these miserable lying dog abusing
punk thug coward MENTAL CASES who JERK CHOKE
SHOCK BRIBE CRATE INTIMIDATE and MURDER their
own DEAD DOGS JUST LIKE HOWE YOU DONE???

NOT HERE on The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY
NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Forums, you AIN'T, chrisman... NOT withHOWET bein
IDENTIFIED EXXXPOSED and DISCREDITED as the miserable rotten
lying dog abusing punk thug coward you are.

HOWEver, you're in EXXXCELLENT company, chrisman.

Doesn't take much to teach the wrong lesson. I'll
even show you HOWE you mishandled Usul and HOWE
COME your dog turned on to ATTACK that innocent
CHILD who only wanted to say "HOWEDY DOGGY!".

You done EXACTLY what ATTACK DOG TRAINERS DO
when they're training a ATTACK dog to ATTACK.

> It makes me sad

INDEED? The Amazing Puppy Wizard had been TELLIN
YOU that you was HURTIN your dog with that pronged
spiked pinch choke collar but YOU DIDN'T LIKE THAT.

Tell your SAD story to ed w of PET LOSS dot COIN.
He's GLAD you MURDERED your own DEAD DOG on accHOWENT
of THAT'S HOWE HE MAKES HIS LIVIN you freakin imbecile.

Chrisman Dinnan (broco...@earthlink.net)
Subject: Re: HOW DO YOU GET P.B.'S TO STOP PULLING?
Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
Date: 2000/02/23

I use a pinch collar on both my dogs. A choke chain
is NOT the way to go with these dogs and I've even
heard that using a chock chain on a dog that pulls
incessantly can cause damage.

Chrisman

> because I¹m not sure you knew,

HE KNEW, you freakin imbecile! It was HIS NECK
you was jerkin and choking you freakin dog abusing
simpleton!

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 23:39:43 GMT

Subject: Usul groweled at a kid...

It's been a little while, so perhaps a refresher is in order...

Usul is male. fixed, three years old, a Rossman/McCoy dog
who, despite previous claims to the contrary, is a dog of
questionable breeding. I've had him since he was five weeks
old, he has been loved, pampered, and socialized with people
and other animals.

When Usul was around 2years old, my Bull Terrier "Happy" died.

Usul went through a profound change and seemed to loose all
of his confidence. He began to act overly wary of strangers,
and anything that made loud noise, like skateboards, rollerblades,
kids screaming and running around and the like.

Since this time I have worked to help rebuild his confidence
with various activities and continued socialization. He's
gotten better, he's a great dog in almost every conceivable
way, but he simply is too skittish.

This evening it was dark, not black, but dark. A father
had his two kids with him. His little girl wanted to pet
the doggy and was not about to listen to her dad tell her no.

I could tell Usul was not comfortable with being approached
by this so I told the little girl no! She approached anyway,
I put Usul in a sit, the little girl raised her hand, and Usul
growled.

Not a viscous "I'm gonna attack" type growl, a low
"Leave Me Alone" type growl. Nonetheless, my dog,
my pitbull dog who I wanted to make an ambassador
for the breed, growled at a kid.

I must say, I did not anticipate having to deal
with this level of skittishness.

My Bull Terrier was unflappable.

Nothing ever got him upset and meeting people
seemed to be the purpose for which he existed.

Anyone else had, or having problems like this??

I would appreciate the advise of some of the more
knowledgeable people in this group.

Thanks

Chrisman

> just how much you were loved,

Well, you SHORE got a FUNNY way of SHOWEIN your LOVE, chrisman!

From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 00:46:33 GMT
Subject: Back in town...

Hey guys/gals,

Just wanted to say hello and that I'm back up and posting.
A few things have changed since I was here last...I thought
we banished Jerry Howe, what's goin' on??

Chrisman

> and how much we adored you.

Yeah, you jerked and choked him on your pronged
spiked pinch choke collar and made him hyperactive
and paranoid. See The Amazing Puppy Wizard's post
"Fear Of Thunder And Pronged Collars" and you'll
understand HOWE that works... good buddy.

The Amazing Puppy Wizard won the coveted "Full
Canvass Jacket" Award for that post... just a
little brag on myself a bit.

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 22:06:15 GMT
Subject: Re: Back in town...

Last time he was here somebody posted his home
address and pictures of his house, that seemed
to shut him up for a while...

Chrisman

BWEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHAHAHHAAAA!!!

> In life there are decisions that have to be made,

Without any INFORMATION, just your WEAK FEARFUL MIND
working for your colossal defective ego to compensate
for your massive inferiority complexes.

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2001 00:12:26 GMT

Subject: Re: Back in town...

Nice to hear from you!!

We should have a secret NG, the title for which
would be completely indiscriminate, nothing to
do with dogs. Only certain individuals would
know where to go.

Jerry is a plague on all dog related NG's.
I fear that this might be our only escape....

Chrisman

> I hope you understand and will forgive me,

You mishandled abused and MURDERED your own DEAD DOG
because you lacked INFORMATION and the INTELLIGENCE
to use The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY
NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual The Amazing Puppy Wizard REPEATEDLY
offered you.

"Please don't hesitate to ask if there is anything
about this breed that you don't understand. Jeff
and I, as well as millions of others have to do a
better job of telling the best kept secret in the
animal Kingdome...."Pitbulls are sweet and loving
pets, lovers and protectors of children, kissers
of faces, waggers of tails." Chrisman

> I hope this pain will fade.

Not if The Amazing Puppy Wizard got
anything to do with it, it won't.

> Could I have done more,

You got CHEDDAR like tara o. aka tee likes
to give her DEAD DOGS when she MURDERS the
FOR THE SAME REASON?

You did enough don't you think?

You MURDERED your own DEAD DOG JUST LIKE HOWE so
many other DOG LOVERS here have done cause you
WANTED TO HURT and INTIMIDATE him like the rest
of these mentally ill lying dog abusing punk thug
cowards PREFER.

You're a DOG ABUSER chrisman, you're not a dog lover.

> was it me,

Look around and who do you see MURDERED your
POSTER PIT BULL besides YOU, chrisman? Not
nobody else there holdin your dog down to
KILL IT but YOU.

> was this fault?

You mean "was this *MY* fault?"

Take a real good look, ain't nobody standin
there holdin your dog down to KILL HIM but
YOU, ya miserable coward.

> Into this open wound these thoughts are as salt.

You're really breakin my heart. In forty years
of specializing in temperament problems The
Amazing Puppy Wizard ain't NEVER had to KILL a
dog, and HE get the worst cases HE can find.

> Pitbulls are special

A DOG IS A DOG you freakin moron.

What makes your Pit Bulls SO SPECIAL is
their NEED to be HURT and INTIMIDATED
by DOG LOVERS like you and the rest of
these miserable lying dog abusing punk
thug coward MENTAL CASES.

> and I will fight in the street with
> anyone who would disagree,

And you'll MURDER YOUR OWN BEAST FRIEND
faster than any dog hater would cause
you're a Pit Bull LOVER and you want to
PROTECT the reputation of these fine
little big hearted fighting dogs who
ONLY attack other innocent defenseless
dumb critters but YOU EXXXPECT THAT and
PROTECT them from mixin it up with other
dogs so long as they don't scare YOU.

Then they're DEAD MEAT.

> but never again will we spend time on
> the couch watching football,

Well, yeah! That'll freakin HAPPEN when you
fuckin MURDER your own DEAD DOG, ya nit wit!

> just you and me.

Save it chrisman. The Amazing Puppy Wizard don't
think Usul is interested in your bullshit. It was
YOU who fukin MURDERED him on accHOWENT of YOU
COULDN'T STOP JERKIN and CHOKING HIM.

> When editing my film you¹d come and lick my arm,

Stupid dog. That'll learn him, eh?

He picked the wrong PAL to TRUST.

> Oit¹s time to play¹ you¹d say, it was you
> and me against the world, no one dared
> stand in our way.

You MURDERED YOUR OWN DEAD DOG, good buddy.

You got a lot of nerve cryin in your beer.

The Amazing Puppy Wizard gave you the information
and the opportunity to use it, and you turned it
down.

You WANTED to handle and train your dog with
FEAR FORCE and INTIMIDATION so you'd LOOK like
a BIG SHOT and you got what The Amazing Puppy
Wizard been tellin you you'd get, you fukin idiot.

Your DEAD DOG Usul deserved better than you
and your empathy and your pronged spiked pinch
choke collar.

Did you shock him too?

Maybe that would have HEELPED???

> My words are horribly inadequate,

Oh, they're adequate... for a DOG LOVER.

Not for you.

You're makin a mockery outta it.

You're the miserable s.o.b. that did everything
you could to ignore and DENY the fact you was
abusing your dog by the way you was handling him.

You didn't like me for tellin you that, so you
chose to ignore me and hurt and kill your dog
as I've been warnin you about.

And now you got what I been tellin ya was comin.

Surprise, surprise, surprise!

> everything is wrong;

Yeah, I been tellin ya that all along, but you
PREFERED to call me a liar and a fraud. So you
got your just desserts. I only wish he'd have
bit your goddamned throat out for ya first.

> nothing is the same since you have gone.

You'll get over it someHOWE. I'll look in my
koehler book for some tips for ya... You any
good with knots?

> The way you loved us was beyond compare

Yeah, and you done good by him allrighty.

> the tender kisses and the hugs are things I will miss,

Sorry to disappoint you, but those 'hugs' was
a SYMPTOM of ANXIETY... not affection. I've
written about that before when someone else
was asking about "hugs."

> I long for your face to see just one more time,

Go visit where he's at, if they'll let you in.
They mite not. I wouldn't allow you to bother
him in doggy heaven. But check it out, you'll
find out when you get there, eh?

Meanwhile go to ed w's PET LOSS dot COIN and
give him fifty bucks and you'll get a nice
Rainbow Bridge Tee Shirt and his PROMISE to
PURSUE The Amazing Puppy Wizard for teachin
folks HOWE to pupperly handle and train their
dogs so they don't gotta MURDER THEM LIKE YOU
DONE to your own DEAD DOG Usul, chrisman <{); ~ ) >

> one more hug, just one more kiss.

Your DEAD DOG would be sittin there havin a beer
and watchin football with you right now if you'd
have used my manual... The Amazing Puppy Wizard
specializes in temperament and behavior problems,
and my students dogs ALL LIVE.

> Goodbye sweet Usul,

Shove it. You're the bum who held him down
and murdered him BECAUSE YOU COULDN'T STOP
JERKIN AND CHOKING HIM.

> who would never let us come to harm,

Yeah, you done real good by him. Congratulations,
Graduate Of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's WWW Wits'
End Dog Training Method School Of HARD KNOCKS <{); ~ ) >

> goodbye good buddy

Yeah... you're the bum who MURDERED him.

The Amazing Puppy Wizard got no empathy for
you or your pals who'd do the EXACT same thing.

> who was always at my side,

You fixed that but freakin good, didnya?

> goodbye good dog,

You bumped him off cause he was a good dog now, didya?
I don't think you're very intelligent. You kill good
dogs for growling at people and you love bad dogs
that fight with dogs.

Oh, no, I got that wrong AGAIN, didn I?

Let's see, you love good dogs that will kill other dogs,
and you kill good dogs because they growl at people...

Hmm, I train my dogs to growl at people, and they only
growl at the RIGHT people to growl at. I train my dogs
never to growl at dogs and they LIKE that as much as
they like growling at people.

O.K. Now let's look at HOWE COME your DEAD DOG Usul
growled at the kid.. it was because of your HANDLING.

I'll pull up your post detailing the incident and
I'll point out each of the obvious handling errors
that YOU TRAINED your dog Usul to growl, without
realizing it cause you didn't want to use my manual
cause you wanted to enjoy your pronged spiked pinch
choke collar cause it made walking him EZ, didnya...

> the best I ever knew, if I could make you
> understand anything, it would be that I love you.

Yeah, that's HOWE COME you jerked and choked him:
Psst! Lookey here! Here's some quotes and some
methods right outta your koehler book. Think,
IMPROVISE, and WELCOME GRADUATE STUDENTS!!!:

The Koehler Method of Dog Training (1962).
New York: Howell Book Book House(p. 52-53)."

Hanging
"First, the trainer makes certain that the collar
and leash are more than adequate for any jerk or
strain that the dog's most frantic actions could
cause. Then he starts to work the dog deliberately
and fairly to the point where the dog makes his grab.

Before the teeth have reached their target, the dog,
weight permitting, is jerked from the ground. As in
coping with some of the afore-mentioned problems the
dog is suspended in mid-air.

However, to let the biting dog recover his footing
while he still had the strength to renew the attack
would be cruelty. The only justifiable course is
to hold him suspended until he has neither the strength
nor inclination to renew the fight.

When finally it is obvious that he is physically
incapable of expressing his resentment and is
lowered to the ground, he will probably stagger
loop-legged for a few steps, vomit once or twice,
and roll over on his side.

The sight of a dog lying, thick-tongued, on his side,
is not pleasant, but do not let it alarm you

THE REAL "HOOD"

"If your dog is a real "hood" who would regard the
foregoing types of protest as "kid stuff" and would
express his resentment of your efforts by biting,
your problem is difficult -- and pressing.

"Professional trainers often get these extreme problems.
Nearly always the "protest biter" is the handiwork of
a person who, by avoiding situations that the dog might
resent, has nurtured the seeds of rebellion and then
cultivated the resultant growth with under correction.

When these people reap their inevitable and oftentimes
painful harvest, they are ready to avail themselves of
"the cruel trainer" whose advice they may have once
rejected because it was incompatible with the sugary
droolings of mealy-mouthed columnists, breed-ring
biddies, and dog psychologists who, by the broken skins
and broken hearts their misinformation causes, can be
proven guilty of the greatest act of cruelty to animals
since the dawn of time.

"With more genuine compassion for the biting dog than
would ever be demonstrated by those who are "too kind"
to make a correction and certainly with more disregard
for his safety, the professional trainer morally feels
obligated to perform a "major operation."

"Since we are presently concerned with the dog that bites
in resentment of the demands of training, we will set our
example in that situation. (In a later chapter we will
deal with the with the much easier problem of the dog
that bites someone other than his master."

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: "Sandra" <sal...@sprint.ca>
Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 08:01:11 -0500
Subject: Re: For Usul...

So true Jeff! And well said Jen!

Having been on both sides of the rescue
fence, I see both sides as well!

Just this year we took in a 2 yr old male. He was
a beautiful dog, excellent with our family but a
touch leery of strangers (nothing serious) until
he was introduced.

One day hubby and I were out feeding and he decided
that hubby was the biggest enemy in the world! Lunged,
teeth bared, growling, hackles up, barking...the whole
9 yards!

Good thing hubby was outside the kennel!!

That display right there was enough to make us make
the fatal decision. I went in the kennel with him
not 5 minutes later and he was fine. Hubby came in
and he was also fine.

He was not having a bad day, he was not protecting
his food (he was waiting for it as hubby had the
feed bucket).

"Despite Skinner's clear denunciation of "negative
reinforcement" (1958) NEARLY EVERY LEARNING THEORY
model involves the USE OF PUNISHMENT. Of curse,
Skinner has never to my knowledge, demonstrated
HOWE we escape the phenomenon that an expected
reward not received is experienced as a punishment
and can produce extensive and persistent aggression
(Azrin et al, 1966)."

He made a one way trip to the vet. The prior
owner called shortly after and not really wanting
to share the news with her, I flubbed (bad me!)
But I did ask about the behaviour he showed that
day and she informed me THEN(instead of when she
brought him here!) that he is listed as a dangerous
dog in the next city because of a bad bite to
someone!!!!

Imagine that!!

Someone passing off their problem dog without the
real story to someone unsuspecting! Were it not
for our experience with the breed, someone may
very well have gotten seriously hurt AGAIN from
this dog!!

And 2 yrs ago I put down my first CH bitch. Saved
her from being poisoned, and just a few short months
later, her wiring went bad and she started lunging
at people. People she knew and people she didn't.

I took her to the vet in tears with my youngest son
hugging her to have her put down. Vet tried talking
me out of it, gave me options.

I gave him one!

Afterwards he said that he sees all too often the
family with a dog who bit after the bite has already
happened.

If only people would open their eyes to some of their
dogs' behaviour and take responsibility there would
be fewer bites. Sandra

"Jeff ©(*§*)©" <pitsaregreatREMOVE-.-T...@yahoo.com>
wrote in message news:ra288.106$Qf2.133927@news.uswest.net...

> Maybe there's a miscommunication problem here (which I
> notice happens often with newbies on this ng. We've
> had waaaaay to many trolls here for our own good).
> Let us agree on some basics. Some dogs are genuinely nuts,
> in the Jeffrey Dahmer sort of way. These dogs are a danger
> to their own families, these dogs can attack anyone, anytime.

> Then there are other dogs that are just not too caring of
> strangers, different things set them off and can make them
> less than safe in public but are still perfectly safe for
> the family.

> The former is rather rare, and I highly doubt that Sancho
> would keep such a dog alive, in reality it really would be
> infeasible and to no one's benefit (this dog really wouldn't
> have any contact with anyone else).

> OTOH, there are many dogs that just plain aren't too
> friendly to unfamiliar faces. Happens with APBTs just
> like with all other breeds (though to a far lesser extent).

> I'll agree with Sancho that if one can care for such a dog
> (its not dangerous to the family) then they certainly should
> take care of such a dog but maintain caution (maintain proper
> facilities, etc).

> If they cannot, preferably finding a home that will care
> for them is preferable, perhaps a family that is seeking
> these traits. It's a question of how much one values each
> individual dog.

> I value each dog very highly, I suspect Sancho does as
> well. When you look at it from the perspective of a
> rescue though, you come to the conclusion that there
> are too many better dogs that are being put to sleep
> so why save this one.
> This is probably why the two will have problems seeing
> eye to eye. I view it from a very familial perspective.

> I have a responsibility to my dog, I don't have a
> responsibility to those dogs (yes, I have been involved
> in rescue for years).

> Anyway, flame away. At least we'll get some good traffic
> on this ng (other than from you know who), which will be
> a pleasant change.

> Just to elaborate: I do agree that if one can't guarantee
> an APBT a decent amount of human contact then that dog
> simply will not be happy. Period.
> Finally, I'm not going to refer to Chrisman's specifically
> until he feels comfortable talking about it (or unless
> completely pressed).

> Jeff

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: "Igloo" <spamcatc...@att.net>
Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 18:27:20 -0000
Subject: Re: For Usul...

> her wiring went bad

What is this supposed to mean?? Are dogs an
electrical circuit that corrodes?

You have no business owning dogs.

> Vet tried talking me out of it, gave me options.

And why didn't you take them? The vet knows a lot
more about "wiring" than you do.

You killed the dog for no other reason than
your mumbo-jumbo psychology.

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: "Sandra" <sal...@sprint.ca>
Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 16:06:44 -0500
Subject: Re: For Usul...

FYI...when a dog gets poisoned and they survive, they
don't always keep the same temperment as they previously
had.

Sometimes they suffer mild brain damage not to mention
other damage done internally to various organs.

And if my vet thanked me for making the right decision,
then I think he not only condoned my decision, but agreed
with it!

If you think putting my bitch down wasn't one of the
hardest things I've ever done in my life with dogs,
then you are seriously an ASSHOLE!!!

Until you've walked a mile in someone else's
RESPONSIBLE shoes...don't chastize anyone!!!!

As for me having "no business owning dogs"...I think it's
you who has no business. 13 years with this breed has
taught me alot...not just about the breed, but about all
dogs, their behaviour and the idiots who think they know
it all! Like you!

Sandra

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: <bluen...@tcsn.net>
Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 10:29:11 -0800
Subject: Re: For Usul...

in article y6E78.192317$vH6.13263...@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com,
#003 at elsan...@juno.com wrote on 2/4/02 2:41 PM:

Yappety Yappety YAP YAP from a complete idiot who
has obviously failed to learn Rule #2............

Thou shalt not suffer a maneater to live............

> why didn't you call me a fuckhead?
> --
> sancho

Because you're several notches below the intellectual
level of the average fuckhead , that's why.

The average fuckhead is able to figure out that a dog
that goes after kids completely without rhyme or reason
is a liability both to the individual owner and to the
breed as a whole.

Chrisman exercised the ultimate responsibility, to
himself, the dog and to the breed as a whole.

Now crawl off his back you indescribable piece of
nattering detritus.

And fuck off , don't wait to do so. fuck off now
while the time is ripe, almost as ripe as your bullshit.

Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: "Igloo" <spamcatc...@att.net>
Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2002 22:49:42 -0000
Subject: Re: For Usul...

You are so crude and ignorant I am surprised sancho
continues to waste his time debating with you.

He made some very valid points, and all you can do is
type shit, assholes, ass and other profanities.

You probably fancy yourself as a macho tough guy, but
you come across as an illiterate.

Newsgroups: alt.animals.dog
From: Chrisman Dinnan <broco...@earthlink.net>
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 00:23:58 GMT

Subject: Re: Help with leash training AmStaff

> "Wendy Kubas" <wcku...@webtv.net> wrote in message
> news:13092-3BEB0FFE-153@storefull-241.iap.bryant.webtv.net...
> > Hi,My name is Wendy, I'm new to this
> > disscussion board and webtv so please
> > bear with me. My problem is this...
> I would take him to puppy obedience. It's
> a great help and gives you a good foundation.

Wendy,

I have a two and a half year old American Pitbull
Terrier and, to a degree, I can sympathize with
the issues that you are having.

The good news is, as I'm sure you already know,
this is a great, loving and affectionate breed;
handsome loyal, trustworthy. Watch them around
other dogs though...

Anyway, pulling is part of this breeds personality.
To a certain extent, it would kinda be like taking
the white out of rice...see my point??

Puppy classes is a great idea. This breed is
very intelligent and very trainable.

With a kind but firm hand you can mold this dog
into THE ideal pet.

If you don't mind me asking, what research did you
do on this breed before your purchase??

I only seek to ascertain your level of knowledge
about this breed so I don't give advice that you
already know.

Good Luck!!

Chrisman

DOG TRAININ AIN'T LUCK, DOG ABUSERS.

Punishment Deranges Behavior.
"NO!" Does NOT Have Any Behavioral Function
EXCEPT
To DERANGE Behaviors.

Here's professor dermer pryor:

From: Marshall Dermer (der...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu)
Subject: Re: Jerry's Dog Training Manual
Date: 2001-07-12 06:49:13 PST

And how do we know this aspect of his
advice is right?

Jerry is not God and his manual is not the Bible.
His advice could be subject to an empirical analysis.

(Also, it is best to killfile posts from the
few regulars here who are either ill-tempered,
ill-mannered, or just plain ill.­),

--Marshall

"At this point, "No" does not have any behavioral function.
But, if you say "No,"pick up the puppy by its neck and
shake it a bit, and the frequency of the biting decreases
then you will have achieved too things.

First, the frequency of unwanted chewing has decreased;
and two, you have established "No" as a conditioned punisher.

How much neck pulling and shaking? Just the
minimum necessary to decrease the unwanted
biting.

**********IS THAT A CONSISTENT 5 SECONDS?************

When our dog was a puppy, "No" came before mild
forms of punishment (I would hold my dog's mouth
closed for a few seconds.) whereas "Bad Dog" came
before stronger punishement (the kind discussed above).

"No" is usually sufficient but sometimes I use "Bad Dog"
to stop a behavior. "Bad Dog" ALWAYS works," marshall
dermer, research professor of ANAL-ytic behaviorISM at
UofWI. For MOORE animal abuse, please visit dr p.

BWAHAHAHHAHAAAA!!!!!

That's INSANE. Ain't it.

Here's professor dermer AFTER gettin JERRYIZED:

"We Are Lucky To Have You, And More People Should
Come To Their Senses And Support Your Valuable Work.
God Bless The Puppy Wizard," Professor Marshall Dermer,
Dept Of ANAL-ytic Behavior, UofWI.

From: "Marshall Dermer" <der...@csd.uwm.edu>
To: "The Puppy Wizard"
<*.@earthlink.net>
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2004 2:53 PM

Subject: God Bless The Puppy Wizard
Dear Mr. Puppy Wizard,

I have, of late, come to recognize your genius
and now must applaud your attempts to save
animals from painful training procedures.

You are indeed a hero, a man of exceptional talent­,
who tirelessly devotes his days to crafting posts ­to
alert the world to animal abuse.

We are lucky to have you, and more people should
come to their senses and support your valuable
work.

Have you thought of establishing a nonprofit
charity to fund your important work?
Have you thought about holding a press conference
so others can learn of your highly worthwhile
and significant work?

In closing, my only suggestion is that you
try to keep your messages short for most
readers may refuse to read a long message
even if it is from the wise, heroic Puppy Wizard.
I wish you well in your endeavors.

--Marshall Dermer

Subject: < BEFORE -> "Jerry, You filthy, Unctuous,
No Good Charlatan,"

< AFTER -> "Thank You Jerry For Putting Up With
A Constant Barrage Of Really Infantile
Crap At The Hands Of Supposedly Adult
Dog Lovers.

'Naive' Is Believing You Can Terrorize
A Dog Into Good Behavior," Robert Crim.

>Subject: Re: Fritz---a retrospective
>Date: 02/05/1999
>Author: Robert Crim <fritzg...@earthlink.net>
> You filthy, unctuous, no good charlatan. If you had
> any idea of what dogs and dog people were about
> you would realize the depths of the absolute loathing
> and contempt I hold for you right now. Were it not
> for the blessed distance and anonymity that the internet
> gives us from the scummy likes of you, I would probably
> be in a jail cell right now for turning you into the pile
> of shit you really are

Hey, Howe, you really are a wacko, eh?

Crim wrote this about *YOU,* you insipid piece of cow dung!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
--
Dogman
mailto:dog...@i1.net
http://www.i1.net/~dogman

=====================

> On Thu, 17 Jun 1999 20:24:15 -0700, dogsnus

<"Terri"@cyberhighway> Wrote:>

> Hey, do like me, and killfile Jerry.
> He has millions of people aleady reading his posts and
> watching him extract his soggy foot out of his mouth!
> Out of these MILLIONS, I've only seen 2 naive childs
> come forward and actually believe in his training manual.
Robert Crim writes:

I assume that I and my wife are those two naive childs
since I freely admit to having read and, I hope,
understood enough of the manual and it's counterparts by
John Fisher and the posts of Marilyn Rammell to believe
and use it.

This naive child would like to say thank you to both
Jerry and Marilyn for putting up with a constant barrage
of really infantile crap at the hands of supposedly
adult dog lovers.

The other naive child (LSW) has to put up with the
nagging idea that if people like them had been posting
earlier, maybe we would not have had to hold the head
of a really magnificent animal in our arms while he was
given the needle and having to hug him and wait until he
gasped his last gasp.

To my mind, "naive" is believing you can terrorize a dog.

Naive is believing that people that hide behind fake
names are more honest than people that use their real
names. Naive is thinking that dilettante dog breeders
and amateur "trainers" like Joey (lyingdogDUMMY, j.h.)
are the equal or better than those that have studied and
lived by their craft for decades.

"Stupid" is believing that people do not see kindergarten
level insults for what they are. Really stupid is believing
that people like Jerry Howe and Marilyn Rammell are
going to just go away because you people act like fools.

Why do you act like fools? I really have no idea, and I
don't really care.

> And, to date: I've not seen ONE come forward and
> actually admit to buying and having success with his
> little black box.

I think I'm going to get one myself for Father's day and
take it down to the Animal Shelter for their use and
testing. You would never believe the results, so you'll
never know.

> Anyone by now that doesn't see a scam man coming by
> Jerry's posts deserves to get what is sure to be coming
> to him! LOL!

I don't see a "scam man", so I guess I and Longsuffering
Wife and Rollei will just have to get what we deserve,
eh? As Joey (Dogman) says, "poor Rollei.".......right.

>Terri

Yes it was, and that is sad.

Robert, Longsuffering Wife and Rollei (do I get to
listen to the box first?)

===========

Crim wrote THAT about *YOU,* tommy, "you insipid piece of cow dung!"

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com>
To: "Jerry Howe" <theamazingpuppywiz...@mail.com>
Subject: Alleged Professors of Animal Behavior
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:50:51 -0400

Dear Jerry, I paged through some of the "dog business"
and was astonished at the low quality of opinions arising
from professors of behavior analysis.

I had the very great privilege of meeting Sam Corson
(Pavlov's last Ph.D. student) and his dogs at Ohio
University. I even got to spend a night at Sam's house.

There is no question but that you are a spiritual brother
to Corson and to Pavlov, both of whom knew that the dog's
great capacity for love was the key to shaping doggie behavior.

Paradoxical reward and paradoxical fixing of attention are
both well documented Pavlovian techniques. Even so humorless
a chap as B.F. Skinner taught students like the Breland's whose
"The Misbehavior of Organisms" demonstrate the utility of your
methods and their deep roots in scientific (as opposed to
commercial) psychology.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.
you may find my resume in Who's Who in
Science and Technology

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