Dog Discussion: German Shepherd Jumping On Me

German Shepherd Jumping On Me
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Charlie
2005-08-16 18:47:22 EST
Is there a effective but gentle way to teach my German Shepherd not to
jump on people he likes?

Lil' Dave
2005-08-17 06:20:57 EST
"Charlie" <Charlie@myhouse.net> wrote in message
news:fsq4g1l680qhmuhj9lo19q4e5jnrve5ben@4ax.com...
> Is there a effective but gentle way to teach my German Shepherd not to
> jump on people he likes?

Way I did it with my German Shepherd is with an open hand. Catch him on the
way while he's raising up with an open hand face down at his nose. Allow
the dog to run into your hand with a little force on his nose, but don't
slap him. Say "no" in the process. A few repetitions are usually
sufficient for most dogs. A simple open, face down hand may be needed
afterwards, when seen, he should not jump at all.

Jumping on another dog in a pack is a sign of domination if the other dog
allows it.



Kyler Laird
2005-08-17 08:17:02 EST
Charlie <Charlie@myhouse.net> writes:

>Is there a effective but gentle way to teach my German Shepherd not to
>jump on people he likes?

I appreciate your desire to do something other than give the dog a knee
to the chest. I don't have any methods that are guaranteed to work but
here are a couple of things to consider...

If the dog is looking for attention, simply turning your back on him
and ignoring him when he jumps might dissuade him from trying this
approach. Make sure to give him some good attention if he stops.

I like to redirect such energy. If you've got a treat (food/ball/...)
that will capture his attention you might be able to get him to do
something else when he starts to jump. I tend to go for downstays but
one of our rescue Huskies just picked up a "sit up" from one of our
dogs and it seems like that might be easier (and more fun) to go into
from a jump - just entice the dog to keep his head far enough away
from you that his paws don't hit you.

And, of course...my answer to most behavior problems like this is
exercise. (I usually take our current Husky biking twice a day. We
went three times yesterday.) If he has a lot of pent up energy it's
likely to come out in a behavior you don't appreciate. Try to find a
mutually agreeable way to drain it.

Good luck!

--kyler

It's Only Alimentary, Dear Watson
2005-08-17 09:42:20 EST
HOWEDY Charlie,

Charlie wrote:
>
> Is there a effective but gentle way to teach
> my German Shepherd not to jump on people he likes?

Yeah, but you're askin liars dog abusers cowards
and active acute chronic long term INCURABLE MENTAL
CASES who HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER innocent DEAD
DUMB CRITTERS and BLAME THE DOG and LIE abHOWET IT.

ALL Temperament and Behavior Problems
And 90% Of DIS-EASE
Are CAUSED BY MISHANDLING.
THAT'S GOOD!
THAT MEANS We can CURE ALL
Temperament And Behavior Problems
And 90% Of DIS-EASE
NEARLY INSTANTLY
Simply By DOING EXXXACTLY, PRECISELY, OPPOSITE
Of HOWE We've Been TAUGHT
By UNIVERSITY TRAINED Behaviorists

HOWEDY People!

ALL Temperament and Behavior Problems Are CAUSED BY MISHANDLING.

"...all the highest nervous activity, as it manifests
itself in the conditional reflex, consists of a continual
change of these three fundamental processes -- excitation,
inhibition and disinhibition." Ivan P. Pavlov

THAT'S GOOD!

"It is NO WONDER that the marked changes in
deviant behavior of children can be achieved
through brief, simple educative routines with
their mothers which modify the mother's social
behaviors shaping the child (Whaler, 1966). Some
clinics have reported ELIMINATION ofthe need for
child THERAPY through changing the clinical emphasis
from clinical to parental HANDLING of the child
(Szrynski 1965).

A large number of cases improved sufficiently after
preliminary contact with parents that NO treatment
of children was required, and almost ALL cases
SHOWE a remarkably shortened period for therapy.
Quite severe cases of anorexia nervosa have been
treated in own to five months by simply REPLACING
the parents temporarily with EFFUSIVELY LOVING
SUBSTITUTES (Groen, 1966)."

"Despite Skinner's clear denunciation of "negative
reinforcement" (1958) NEARLY EVERY LEARNING
THEORY model involves the USE OF PUNISHMENT.
Of curse, Skinner has never to my knowledge,
demonstrated HOWE we escape the phenomenon
that an expected reward not received is experienced
as a punishment and can produce extensive and
persistent aggression (Azrin et al, 1966)."

THAT MEANS we can CURE ALL Temperament And Behavior
Problems NEARLY INSTANTLY simply by DOING EXXXACTLY,
PRECISELY, OPPOSITE of HOWE we've been TAUGHT TO
MISHANDLE and ABUSE HOWER dogs by the UNIVERSITY
TRAINED behaviorists and PROFESSIONAL PET CARE
SPECIALISTS who MAKE THEIR LIVING off of PERPETUATING
their SHEER IDIOCY and IGNOING the works of Drs. Sam
Corson, Dra. Mary Cover Jones, Breland & Breland, and
other notable psychologists IGNORED and OVERLOOKED by
the ABUSERS who TEACH US to lock HOWER dogs in boxes,
bribe, choke, intimidate, and IGNORE HOWER dog's,
children's and SP-HOWESES cries of FEAR and NEED and
WITHHOLD attention, affection, so called "rewards"
and UNCONDITIONAL LOVE TRUST and RESPECT.

Pavlov Told Us So 100 Years Ago. Sam Corson, Pavlov's Last
Student Demonstrated At UofOH Oxford, That Rehabilitation
Of Hyperactive Dogs Can Easily And Readily Be Done Using TLC.
Tender Loving Care Is At The Root Of The Scientific Management
Of Doggys. <{) ; ~ ) >

WE CANNOT CONTINUE TO BLAME THE DOG OR ITS BREED:

ALL Critters Only Respond In
PREDICTABLE INNATE NORMAL NATURAL
INSTINCTIVE REFLEXIVE Ways;
To Situations And Circumstances Of Their Environment
Which We Create For Them.

You GET The Critter You TRAINED

A DOG Is A Dog;
As A KAT Is A KAT;
As A BIRDY Is A BIRDY;
As A CHILD IS A CHILD;
As A SP-HOWES Is a SP-HOWES.

The Amazing Puppy Wizard has MUCH CASE HISTORY and PEER
REVIEWED SCIENTIFIC DATA to PROVE these "FAR FETCHED"
claims. HOWEver, for today's puporses, this will be all
that's necessary:

Here's your FREE copy of The Amazing Puppy
Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?G34D2527A

Just ASK The Amazing Puppy Wizard if you
need any additional FREE heelp. There's NO
arbritrary INFORMATION in your FREE copy
of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual so
study it well and do and follow ALL the
EXXXERCISES AS INSTRUCTED... it's a
PRECISE SCIENCE or it COULDN'T GET 100%
CONSISTENT NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS for all
handlers and all dogs in all fields or
utilities and behaviors all over the Whole
Wild World <{) ; ~ ) >

ALL Critters Only Respond In
PREDICTABLE INNATE NORMAL NATURAL
INSTINCTIVE REFLEXIVE Ways;
To Situations And Circumstances Of Their Environment
Which We Create For Them.

You GET The Critter You TRAINED

A DOG Is A Dog;
As A KAT Is A KAT;
As A BIRDY Is A BIRDY;
As A CHILD IS A CHILD;
As A SP-HOWES Is a SP-HOWES.

In The Problem Animal Behavior BUSINESS
FAILURE MEANS DEATH.
SAME SAME SAME SAME,
For The Problem Child Behavior BUSINESS.

Damn The Descartean War of "Nature Vs Nurture."
We Teach By HOWER Words And Actions
And GET BACK What We TAUGHT.

ALL Behavior Problems Are CAUSED BY MISHANDLING

Jer 21 And unto this people thou shalt say,
Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I set before
you The Way Of Life, And The Way Of Death.

2Ki 19:6 And Isaiah said unto them, Thus
shall ye say to your master, Thus saith
the LORD, Be not afraid of the words which
thou hast heard, with which the servants of
the king of Assyria have blasphemed me.

The Puppy Prophet <{); ~ ) >

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 09:41:01 -0500
From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D."
<*.@mindspring.com>
Subject: "time-out"

Dan, my own firm hatred of punishment has
recently been intensified by meeting The
Puppy Wizard, Jerry Howe, whose work with
dogs is marvelous.

There is a literature on harms caused by time
out, and perhaps you'd like to look at
http://www.dogydoright.com
George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

"As Sam Corson (Pavlov's last student) demonstrated for
nearly 50 years at Ohio University (Oxford, O.) there
is no treatment more useful for dogs than tender loving
care."

George von Hilsheimer, Ph. D., F. R. S. H., Diplomate,
Academy of Behavioral Medicine

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com
To: <d...@arcane-computing.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 5:38 PM
Subject: Doggy advice

Scott, Jerry Howe forwarded me the letter below.
I'm glad that you referred negatively to Jerry's
habit of CAPITALIZING and HOWEING everything.

I personally hate this habit of his. I think it is his
way of diluting his authority - IME he is a very modest
fellow. However, contrary to your sneer, he is very
competent at living with dogs.

I thought I'd list a series of actions which I found
on the list, folk asking advice on what to do about
dogs doing this and that, for example:

whining,
humping, hunching,
pacing,
self mutilation - paw licking, side sucking,
spinning,
prolonged barking, barking at shadows,
overstimulated barking,
fighting, bullying other dogs,
compulsive digging,
compulsive scratching,
compulsive chewing,
frantic behavior,
chasing light, chasing shadow,
stealing food,
digging in garbage can,
loosing house (toilet) training.
inappropriate fearfulness
aggression.

The thing that is fascinating to me, as an ethologist who
graduated from college 50 years ago and has spent all of
the intervening time working with animals (including the
human animal), is that you never see any of these behaviors
in wild dingoes, jackals, coyotes or wolves, you don't even
see these behaviors in hyenas (who aren't dog related).

You see these behaviors in human managed animals, especially
animals who live with neurotic hysterical humans.

As Sam Corson (Pavlov's last student) demonstrated for
nearly 50 years at Ohio University (Oxford, O.) there
is no treatment more useful for dogs than tender loving
care.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph. D., F. R. S. H., Diplomate,
Academy of Behavioral Medicine

> So why is that a problem?

"The IMBECILITY of some of the claims for operant
technique simply take the breath away. Lovas et al
(1966) report a standard contingent reward/punishment
procedure developing imitative speech in two severly
disturbed non verbal schizophrenic boys. After twenty-
six days the boys are reported to have been learning
new words with alacrity. HOWEver, when REWARDS
were moved to a delayed contingency the behavior and
learning immediately deteriorated."

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D."
<*.@mindspring.com>

To: <pdd-aspy...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 9:31 AM
Subject: How does diagnosis shape treatment?

How does diagnosis shape treatment?

Nearly every week I have a visit from Jerry Howe, who
publicizes himself as The Puppy Wizard. Jerry is a
master at behavioral modification of dogs.

His fundamental bedrock is the work Pavlov's last student,
the late Sam Corson, Ph.D., did at the U of Ohio (at Oxford,O).

Sam always pointed out if the dog stopped working for
you in the lab, Pavlov and he always took the dog away
from the lab, and put him in a loving home and gave him
TLC for a couple of months, and then started, very carefully,
over again.

Jerry believes that reward and constraint focused training
is immoral. I've watched him in one short session calm
impossible dogs, just about to be murdered (oops "put to
sleep") because of their "incorrigibly" violent behavior.

Sam was one of the first people to apply amphetamine to
hyperactivity (he searched the Middle West for hyperactive
dogs); but he never lost sight of the fundamental reality that
a dog is not a human, but does respond, doggily, to dog love.

You might be surprised to go to B. F. Skinner's "Cumulative
Record" and read the essay by Breland and Breland, "The
Misbehavior of Organisms".

Animals cannot be successfully trained unless the trainer
attends to the evolutionary history, the individual's
developmental history, and the environmental niche of
the animal being trained.

Yep, right there in Skinner's last and summary book.
Even with behavior mod, you must know the animal.

<snip>

Dogs or little boys, you have to know the individual
history, and the nature of he disorder.

Dr. Von

PS if you are interested in dogs, then take
a look at Jerry's work.

Dr. George VonHilsheimer writes in

"Is there a SCIENCE of BEHAVIOR?":

"Valette 1966 is a complete trivialization of
scientific findings. It overstates the case for
reinforcement theory. No careful researcher
would contend that operant techniques CAN ANY
THING MORE than modify SHORT TERM BEHAVIOR in
a highly controlled and limited environment
with a large number of skillful experimenters.

Certainly the most elaborate studies have shown
that the withdrawal or temprary inefficiency of
the reward system is immediately followed by
CESSATION of the programmed behavior.

In fortunate contrast to this depressing paper
is the research reported by Whelan (1966) who
makes the simple but profHOWEND caveat that
"It is only through CORRECT, EFFICIENT APPLICATION
(of operant principles) that children's behavor can
be changed to the extent that they can subsequently
contribute to the REAL WORLD in which they live." "

"The Methods, Principles, And Philosophy Of Behavior
Never Change,
Or They'd Not Be Scientific And Could Not Obtain
Consistent, Reliable, Fast, Effective Results
For All Handler's And All Dogs,
ALL OVER THE WHOLE WILD WORLD,
NEARLY INSTANTLY,
As Taught In Your FREE Copy Of The Puppy Wizard's
FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual,"
The Puppy Wizard. <{} ; ~ ) >

Dr. Von continues:

"Whelan illustrates the simple nature or the
learning process by referring to Ferster's
engaging study of two three year old
chimpanzees taught mathematics through
simple procedures. Whelan carries this
EVIDENCE a step futher by pointing HOWET
it's applicability to disturbed children."

You Get The Critter You Trained

A Dog Is A Dog
As A Kat Is A Kat
As A Birdie Is A Birdie
As A Child Is A Child
As A SP-HOWES Is a SP-HOWES.

ALL Critters Only Respond In
PREDICTABLE INNATE NORMAL NATURAL INSTINCTIVE
REFLEXIVE Ways
To Situations And Circumstances Of Their Environment
Which We Create For Them.

Damn The Descartean War of
"Nature Vs Nurture."
We Teach By HOWER Words And Actions
And GET BACK What We TAUGHT.

In The Problem Animal Behavior BUSINESS
FAILURE MEANS DEATH.
SAME SAME,
For The Problem Child Behavior BUSINESS.

Dr. Von continues:

"If chimpanzees CAN LEARN mathematics through step
by step learning AT THEIR OWN PACE, reinforced
primarily by CORRECT ANSWERS rather than with
"fruit loops and rasins", we can assume that even
developmentally RETARDED or CONfHOWENDED children
CAN LEARN as well.

Moreover, Whelan makes the EXXXTREMELY important
point that while most teachers assume that learning
takes place verbally, primarily it is a non verbal
process..

Unfortunately Whelan limits himself to the problem
that "teachers must not only modify or remove specific
deviant behaviors, but must also develop socially
acceptable behavior patterns in the classroom and
classroom conditioned goals, NOT LEARNING.

Other researchers have emphasized the importance
of adult behaviors in conditioning classroom behavior.
An EXXXCELLENT review of this research showd that
tantrum behavior, excessive crawling and dependency,
isolated play, passivity, spelling failure, and other
problem behaviors can be managed by altering habitual
adult responses to children (Harris, Wolf and Baer, 1964) .

Such RESEARCH holds GREATER PROMISE in that alteration
of the conditioning social environment seems to provide
more STABLE and LASTING CHANGES than "M and M's". Moreover,
a great deal of work has been done developing EFFECTIVE
techniques of behavior modificaton through the conditioning
social environment of peers (Hartup, 1964). These directions
would seem more PRODUCTIVE than a simple minded trainslation
of the Skinner cage to the classroom.

Skinner (1963) pointed HOWET that operant techniques
can "be utilized fully ONLY IF we REDEFINE the GOALS
of education and the CONDITIONS in the educational
environment under which those goals may be reached...
(through) a DIFFERENT KIND of educational research
which is much more closely concerned with the immediate
dimensions of the student's behavior than with gross
changes such as IMPROVED PERFORMANCES."

UNFORTUNATELY, neither Skinner nor ANY OTHER
learning theorist has provided us with a working
model of a school or research enterprise based
on systemic and thorough-going APPLICATION of
LEARNING PRINCIPLES.

Skinner (1948, 1953) approaches a definition of the
philosophical issues involved, and provides an utopian
model of a school, but generally psychologists seem
STUCK at a level of MANAGEMENT of an aggressively
disturbing child in the classroom, through peer approval,
or the aplication of accelerating CONsequences in the
classroom, or scientifically S-HOWENDING tactics like
"TIME HOWET" (which we used to know more simply
as "sendin the kid to the cloakroom").

Hobbs (op. cit.) claims that the classroom is a
natural environement for the child. Thelen (1965)
contends that "classroom practices are UNnatural,
UNreasonable, and 'against NATURE.' "This would
seem the central issue for the philosophy of education.
Mere trivial application of research findings to an
institution essentially unchanged from Sumerian academies
(Kramer, 1962) will NOT create useful teaching for
human beings.

It seems relevant to ask EXXXACTLY WHAT do we
know abHOWT the learning situation in which HOWER
children find themselves, and why, in the light of HOWER
knowledge, do we do any of the things that schools do?"

We know that there is little agreement among adults
as to what it is they are SUPPOSED to be DOING,
what something to do could be that MIGHT be
EFFECTVE, and what it IS that other people who
have authority over children ought to be doing (Mc-
Eachern and Taylor, 1967). Wherefor the child's
CONfusiHOWEN?

It is NO WONDER that the marked changes in
deviant behavior of children can be achieved
through brief, simple educative routines with
their mothers which modify the mother's social
behaviors shaping the child (Whaler, 1966). Some
clinics have reported ELIMINATION ofthe need for
child THERAPY through changing the clinical emphasis
from clinical to parental HANDLING of the child
(Szrynski 1965).

A large number of cases improved sufficiently after
preliminary contact with parents that NO treatment
of children was required, and almost ALL cases
SHOWE a remarkably shortened period for therapy.
Quite severe cases of anorexia nervosa have been
treated in own to five months by simply REPLACING
the parents temporarily with EFFUSIVELY LOVING
SUBSTITUTES (Groen, 1966).

Probably the most absurd figure in Amaerican mass
media is the TEACHER (Gerbner, 1966). HOWE can
we EXXXPECT children to LEARN responsible P-HOWER
from models of IMPOTENCE? We KNOW that LEARNING
a complex ritualized social role, is facilitated
by observation of an INTELLIGIBLE MODEL much more
effectively than by trial and error with REINFORCEMENT.

Roles which are relatively arbitrary and senseless are
the most difficult to learn (Luchins, 1966). Do we make
ANY EFFORT as teachers to CORRECT the massive impact of
media?

HOWE can the ARBITRARINESS and SENSELESSNESS
of IMPOTENT ADULT MODELS be redeemed by anything
short of RELEVANCE and COMMITMENT?

As an engaging final comment on the PROFESSION
let me mention the little study by Dittman et al (1965)
tha when 15 psychotherapists and 9 professional dancers
evaluated facial and bodily expressons for effect the
dancers were much MOORE accurate. Need we say MOORE
abHOWET the training of therapists?

THE OPERANT FALLACY

Programs utilizing the "contingencies of reinforcement
model" proposed by Skinner (1963) ar no more well
established in research than the various dynamic
therapists. Research in four areas : 1) direct evaluation
of programmed systems for elarning; 2) reinforcement;
3) cognitive dissonance; and 4) motivation, MOST SURELY
DEMOLISH the claims of operant programers.

The 190 studies annotated by Schramm (1964) when
inspected display NO SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCES
in SUCCESS among approaches and modifications.
Programmed instruction is no worse than conventional
instruction, and takes less time, but time reductions in
conventional instruction has frequently been shown
possible without detrimental effects. If you draw your
controls cagily you can always show the superiority of
your PET technique.

Moore and Smit (1964) compared variations on
programmed materials, machines, texts, written
responses, merely reading, free response, multiple
choice, and iving or not giving the students results.
There were NO SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCES despite
Skinner's insistence on the importance of the
CONTINGENCY of REINFORCEMENT. Carpenter
and Greenhill (1963) could find NO DIFFERENCE
in RESULTS even after eliminating the self-pacing
feature by presenting the materials by TV or Video.

Krumboltz and Kiesler (1965) reported that a two month
follow up test showed NO DIFFERENCE between students
given a variety of reinforcement schedules. Mayo and
Longo (1966) report that naval and marine trainees
saved 30% of time in learning electronics fundamentals
through a programed course witrh superior scores on one
measure but not on another, and with no follow-up reported.

The same authors reported a reductionj from 26 HOWERS
to 19 HOWERS in instruction time through the use of
program with NO DIFFERENCE in test scores, except
that as longer blocks of materiallearned through
programmed means were tesed the scores DECREASED.

When the control instruction is manipulated an entirely
DIFFERENT picture emerges Jacobs and Kulkarni (1966)
assignedstudents in three different schools to classes
with standard programmed material giving immediate
knowledge of results to classes without results and to
classes with the order of sections of the program inverted.

In two schools the groups without knowledge of results
and the groups with inverted material SCORED HIGHER.
In one school there was NO DIFFERENCE. So much for
THEORY. Reid and Taylor (1965) presented a linear
program on paper-making to 60 paid undergrads with
a 12 week follow up test. The group which merely
read learned the same material in 154 minutes to
243 minutes for the group given responses- a
REVERSAL of the usual BIASED RESULTS based
on POOR CON-TROLLS. There were no differences
on post tests.

Spagnoli (1965) reports on a study exposing the control
and programed group to the same material in a concentrated
effort over a limited period of time. There were NO
SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCES.

Sassenrath and Garverick (1965) gave 4 matched
groups of 120 students four procedures: 1) looking
up the wrong answers, 2) having questions discussed
by the instructors, 3) checking answers from correct
ones on the board, and 4) no feedback. The discussion
method proved best.

Finally, in studying means of training men to perform
a 72 action prcedure on Nike-Hercules equipment,
Cox and Boren (1965) demonstrated that the time
required to learn the procedure to critterion was NO
DIFFERENT when the actions were organized into
seven operant spans and taught in reverse order, in
natural order, or without grouping into operant spans
at all.

IT IS CLEAR that as comparisons became more
sophisticated programed instruction and other
operant teaching techniquesreveal tehemselves
as simply another prestigiHOWES FAD--somewhat
better than conventional instruction in saving time,
but certainly not providing a better or better organized
or more independently useful GRASP of KNOWLEDGE.

The IMBECILITY of some of the claims for operant
technique simply take the breath away. Lovas et al
(1966) report a standard contingent reward/punishment
procedure developing imitative speech in two severly
disturbed non verbal schizophrenic boys. After twenty-
six days the boys are reported to have been learning
new words with alacrity. HOWEver, when REWARDS were
moved to a delayed contingency the behavoir and learning
immediately deteriorated.

Despite this, and despite the fact that there was no
evidence of cognitive association with the words, the
authors leap to the conclusion that the fact that the
boys improved in the acquisition of Norwegian words
WITHOUT REWARDS while still being given English
words WITH REWARDS suggest hat the children may
be able to acquire new behaviors on their own.

The need for this study escapes one, particularly in
view of the very well established fact that schizophrenics
condition quite readily (Mednick, 1958)

One can see the "SCIENTIFIC" PRECISION by which the
authors drop contingent reinforcements thus PROVING
that the parrot behavior was indeed caused by the
schedule and NOT by some other mystical force.

The use of Norwegian to demonstrate learning that
could not even remotely be related to previous history
is a grotesquery too bizarre to be credited. Who could
possibly doubt that this useless and probably damaging
trained seal routine depended on the psychologist's antics?

What on earth led them to believe that a schizophrenic
needs even more other-focused responsiveness?

Lovaas et al (1965) reported three programs carried
out on five year old autistic twins conditioining them
to "social behavior" and to eliminate pathologial
behaviors such as self-stimulation and tantrums.

Affectionate and other social behaviors toward
adults increaseed after adults had been associated
with shock reduction. The routine for this treatment
brings immediate relief to mind Sawrey and Wesz
(1956) routine for producing ulcers in monkeys.

I suppose it is USELESS to speculate on the source
of SO CALLED THERAPISTS willingness to experiment
on human beings with procedures for which there is
sound experimentally established WARNINGS. If the
"double blind" theory of the origin of schizophrenia
(Bateson, 1956) is at all valid, HOWE DEVASTATING
the experience must ULTIMATELY BE.

Do Lovaas et al REALLY BELIEVE the schizophrenic
has no cognitive processes and DOES NOT KNOW
WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE SHOCK? Greger
(1965) criticized this study on the basis that
trainsfer CANNOT be generalized.

That issue can be answered by experience, and,
of curse, the "social" behavior of these children
deteriorates as soon as the psychologists LOOSE INTEREST.

The IMPORTANT ISSUE for a SCIENCE OF BEHAVIOR
is why not attempt those things which are KNOWN to
WORK at least in some cases if only for control puporses.

Kanner (1954) reports that 13 classically autistic
children improved enough to go to school without
"anything that is regarded as good psychotherapy or
as psychotherapy at all..."

Autistic children have been known to become
permenantely social by deinstitutionalization,
BY REMOVAL from the parents, BY RADICAL CHANGES
in other environments, and by MASSIVE DOSAGE of
TOUCHING, HOLDING, FONDLING LOVE DESPITE THE
REJECTION OF THE CHILD.

My case, Larry, (vonHilsheimer, 1965b), demonstrates
a recovery by using the mother as an autistic boy's
teacher in an open millieu. It is curiHOWES that the
operant technicians provide as few, and as UNIMAGINITAVE
controls for thier "research" as the Freudians.

REWARD / PUNISHMENT

Despite Skinner's clear denunciation of "negative
reinforcement" (1958) NEARLY EVERY LEARNING
THEORY model involves the USE OF PUNISHMENT.
Of curse, Skinner has never to my knowledge,
demonstrated HOWE we escape the phenomenon
that an expected reward not received is experienced
as a punishment and can produce extensive and
persistent aggression (Azrin et al, 1966).

MIMICRY, PLAY, EXPLORATION AND
THE NEED FOR DATA

Complex activities are LEARNED MORE QUICKLY
through OBSERVATION (copying, if you will) than
by trial and error with reinforcemet (Luchins,).
Observers of subjects making a first trial of a multiple
choice bolt head maze made fewer errors than the
practiced subjects in the second run, while subjects
who have been shocked for error on a first trial made
more errors than either (Rosenbaum & Hewitt, 1966).
Students will modify their beliefs more when rewarded
for the way in which they carried out arguing for a
disagreeable position (role reward), than when rewarded
for the content of the argument (Wallace, 1966).

===================

INTRO TO WITS' END DOG TRAINING MANUAL
George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D. F.R.S.H.

Several years ago one of my old students telephoned
to me and asked me what I knew about Doggie Do
Right, a device to cause your neighbor's dog to stop
barking.

I had not heard of the device, nor its inventor, Jerry
Howe, but I telephoned, read his website, and told
my graduate that I thought the device was worth a
trial - indeed I shut up the dogs in my neighborhood
by turning on Jerry's supersonic device.

After all we all know that dogs respond to whistles
humans cannot hear, so why not respond to "attaboy"
sounds which humans cannot hear.

My student lived far from my Florida homestead, so
he tried it on the three incredibly savage, hyperactive
and noisy dogs who lived behind a tall fence just 3 feet
back of his bedroom.

Hot rats! The device worked,

Andy got his sleep and I didn't think much of the
matter again.

A few months ago I had new neighbors on each
side of my house, four of them, all with noisy
unshuttupable dogs. Argh!

So I foned Andrew in Virgina, received the intelligence
that his neighbors dogs were still quiet, and then I foned
Jerry Howe, the inventor of Doggie Do Right, who came
to visit me.

Merlin walked into my office.

Jerry is a slender fellow with a belly button lenghth grey
beard tapering down his chest. I liked him immediately,
and I applied his instrument to the neighborhood again
which again became silent.

It occured to me that if this ultrasonic field worked with
dogs that we ought at least to ask the question, what
happens to humans in range of the device???

I asked Jerry to give me a list of customers and began
inquiring among them. One thing became immediately
evident. The Doggie Do Right not only shuts up your
neighbors' dogs, it calms and modifies your husband's behavior.

Holey Moley, Captain Marvel, this device has major potential.

In the meantime Jerry gave me a copy of his Wits End
Dog Training Manual. I was delighted. He also introduced
me to the world of professional dog trainers some of whom
even have Ph.D.s in psychology.

This was not such a delight as it appeared that none
of these luminaries had actually read Skinner, Lazarus
or other fountains of wisdom in psychology. Indeed, it
seemed as though they knew very little about the laws
of behavior at all!

Punishment and confrontation seemed to be their
major stock in trade.

Well, if you go to my website, www.drbiofeedback.com
you can read of the career of Sam Corson, I.P. Pavlov's
last student.

Sam demonstrated that rehabilitation of hyperactive
dogs can easily and readily be done using TLC, tender
loving care is at the root of the scientific management
of doggies.

Pavlov told us so 100 years ago.

So what are these degreed morons doing punishing
dogs, and shouting "NO" into their doggie faces? If
you pick up B.F.Skinner's last book, CUMULATIVE
RECORD, included in it is an essay by Keller Breland
and Maryann Breland entitled THE MISBEHAVIOR OF ORGANISMS.

Skinner deliberately included his students' chapter
to emphasize that you cannot manage the behavior
of animals unless you take into consideration 1. the
animal's evolutionary niche (who is the animal?);
2. the animal's personal history (who is the animal?)
and 3, the instinctive repetoire of the animal (who is
the animal?) and 4. the personality of the animal (who
is the animal?).

The Brelands moved far from the white rat. "Thirty-eight
species, totaling over 6,000 individual animals, have been
conditioned, and we have dared to tackle such unlikely
subjects as reindeer, cockatoos, raccoons, porpoises,
and whales."

Jerry Howe spends most of his times with dogs, but
he has learned Pavlov's lesson well. Dogs are individuals,
they are individual DOGS, and they respond most directly
and immediately to love and tender loving care.

Read with pleasure, and then go love your dog.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.
Who's Who Honoree since 1983

From: TooCool (larrym...@hotmail.com)

The Puppy Wizard's Wits End Training Method

I have studied canine behavior and dog training for
years. I have a huge library that covers every system
of training.

The Puppy Wizard's (Jerry Howe's) Wits' End Training
Method is by far the most scientific, the most advanced,
the kindest, the quickest and the most effective training
method yet discovered.

It is not an assortment of training tips and tricks; it is
a logically consistent system. Every behavior problem
and every obedience skill is treated in the same logically
consistent manner.

Please study his manual carefully. Please endeavor to
understand the basis of his system and please follow
his directions exactly. His manual is a masterpiece.
It is dense with theory, with explanation, with detailed
descriptions about why behavior problems occur and
how their solution should be approached.

One should not pick and choose from among his methods
based upon what you personally like or dislike. His is
not a bag of tricks but a complete and integrated system
for not only training a dog but for raising a loving
companion.

When I once said to Jerry that his system creates for
you the dog of your dreams, his response was that it
produces for your dog the owner of his dreams.

You see, Jerry has discovered that if you are gentle
with your dog then he will be gentle with you, if you
praise your dog every time he looks at you, then you
will become the center of your dogs world, if you use
Jerry's sound distraction with praise, then it takes
just minutes-sometimes merely seconds-to train your
dog to not misbehave (even in your absence) (Just 15
seconds this morning to train my 10 week old puppy to
lie quietly and let me clip his nails).

Using Jerry's scientific method (sound distraction /
praise / alteration / variation) it takes just minutes to
train you dog to respond to your commands.

What a pleasure it was for me to see my 6 week old
puppy running as fast has his wobbly little legs would
carry him in response to my recall command-and he
comes running every time I call no matter where we are
or what he is doing.

At ten weeks old now, my puppy never strains upon
his leash thanks to Jerry's hot & cold exercises and
his Family Pack Leadership exercises.

Jerry has discovered that if you scold your dog, if you
scream at him, if you intimidate him, if you hurt him,
if you force him then his natural response is to oppose
you.

Is Jerry a nut?

It doesn't make any difference to me whether he is or not.
It is a logical fallacy to judge a person's ideas based upon
their personality. As far as dogs are concerned, Jerry
wears his heart upon his sleeve. It touches him deeply
when he hears of trainers forcing, intimidating, scolding
or hurting dogs.

More than that, he knows that force is not effective
and that it will certainly lead to behavior problems;
sometime problems so severe that people put their
dogs down because of those problems.

I believe that it is natural for humans to want to control
their dog by force. Jerry knows this too. We have all been
at our wits' end, haven't we?

Dogs have a natural tendency to mimic. In scientific
literature it is referred to allelomimetic behavior. Dogs
respond in like kind to force; they respond in like kind
to praise.

Don't bribe your dog with treats; give him what he
wants most-your kind attention. Give him your praise.
You will be astonished at how your dog 's anxiety will
dissipate and how their behavior problems will dissipate
along with their anxiety.

Treat Jerry Howe's (The Puppy Wizard) Wits' End
Training Method as a scientific principle just as you
would the law of gravity and you will have astounding
success.

Dog behavior is just as scientific as is gravity.

If you follow Jerry's puppy rules you will get a sweet little
Magwai; if you don't you will surely get a little gremlin
(anyone see The Gremlins?). --Larry

Instrumental / Classical / Operant / Conditioning
CC / OC / IC / -P +P / +R -R / S R / R S
It's ALL The SAME SAME SAME SAME
<{); ~ ) >

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com>
Subject: The Amazing Jerry's take on psychobabble
Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 12:13:44 -0400

You might improve the learning of folk who actually
live with and train dogs to do useful things if you
excluded everyone who uses psychobabble from your lists.

I recommend to all of you who wish to taste the flavor
of sensible animal behaviorists to read THE MISBEHAVIOR
OF ORGANISMS, Breland and Breland.

This married pair of psychologists began the long trail
of highly trained animals who are symbolized by Shamu
eating a mackrel from a girl's hand instead of eating
the much more tasty pretty girl who is exactly the size
of the natural food of killer whales, seals. Yum!

The essay, by the way, is a chapter in B.F. Skinner's
summing up book, CUMULATIVE RECORD. They include a
sentence which more or less says, "unless you understand
the personal history of the particular animal, and the
history of this animal's species and group, the developmental
history of the animal, you cannot effectively train the animal.

Pigs root and hen's scratch, if you try to train hens without
scratching or pigs without scratching or pigeons without pecking,
you aren't going to have much success.

A conditional reflex is one which is learned, the original
primitive reflex occurs no matter what the history of the
animal, and is hard wired. If you train the animal to respond,
say by ringing a bell immediately before turning on a bright
light, then you've taught the animal and made his native reflex
of pupil constriction conditional upon the ringing of a bell.

Thorndyke added some terminology to this kind of training
and insisted that when you train the animal to make gross
motor responses that this learning is "instrumental", the
animal takes action and uses an instrument.

The Russian word translated as "conditional" in all other
contexts was mistranslated by Pavlov's American translator,
Horsley Gannt, as "conditioned" and so American psychology
went haring after phantasmagora.

The major theorists for the development of the language of
operant conditioning are Edward Thorndike, John Watson, and
B. F. Skinner. Their approach to behaviorism played a major
role in the development of American psychology.

They proposed that learning is the result of the application
of consequences; that is, learners begin to connect certain
responses with certain stimuli. This connection causes the
probability of the response to change (i.e., learning occurs.)

Thorndike labeled this type of learning instrumental. Using
consequences, he taught kittens to manipulate a latch (e.g.,
an instrument). Skinner renamed instrumental as "operant"
because in this learning, one is "operating" on, and is
influenced by, the environment. Where classical conditioning
illustrates S-->R learning, operant conditioning is often
viewed as R-->S learning since it is the consequence that
follows the response that influences whether the response
is likely or unlikely to occur again.

It is through operant conditioning that
voluntary responses are learned.

One should note that Russian Psychology did very well
without the operant language, and only pettifogging
university professors ought to worry about what kind
of label we attach to the learning. Pfui!

Even Skinner understood this!

And please note if you saw the original movie, THE
MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE, you saw a Chinese psychologist
who was based on Andrew Salter, CONDITIONED REFLEX
THERAPY.

Alas, Salter didn't have a Ph.D., but he basically rescued
us from the long Freudian nightmare and returned psychotherapy
to a scientific basis. Alas, the 2nd movie didn't even cite
Salter as a source. "...all the highest nervous activity, as
it manifests itself in the conditional reflex, consists of a
continual change of these three fundamental processes --
excitation, inhibition and disinhibition." Ivan P. Pavlov

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

What's important is, "does Shamu reliably eat
the fish and not the pretty girl?"

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

All truth passes through three stages.
First, it is ridiculed.
Second, it is violently opposed.
Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
-Arthur Schopenhauer

"Thank you for fighting the fine fight--
even tho it's a hopeless task,
in this system of things.
As long as man is ruling man,
there will be animals (and humans!)
abused and neglected. :-(
Your student," Juanita.

"If you've got them by the balls their hearts
and minds will follow,"
John Wayne.

The Amazing Puppy Wizard. <{} ; ~ ) >


J*@imabadlittlegirl.com
2005-08-17 17:11:15 EST
Sorry, I dozed off. What did you say? Did you say she should kill her
German Shepard? What kind of sick, deranged psycho monster are you
Puppy Wizard?

Johnny G da Man 2B!


John 732-264-6253
Joseph 973-616-7575
FFP 800-823-1030


T*@AniMail.Net
2005-08-18 04:01:50 EST
HOWEDY johnny,

j*g@imabadlittlegirl.com wrote:
>
> Sorry, I dozed off.

PARDON The Amazing Puppy Wizard, johnny. HE
didn't mean to upset your apple cart...

> What did you say?

Wasn't much... only the CAUSES and SOLUTIONS
for ALL temperament and behavior problems...
too bad you MISSED IT.

> Did you say she should kill her German Shepard?

No, The Amazing Puppy Wizard SEZ SHE'S KILLING
HER dog, johnny.

> What kind of sick, deranged psycho monster are you
> Puppy Wizard?

Oh, That's EZ, johnny!

The Amazing Puppy Wizard is The Deranged Psycho Monster
who's PUTTIN THIS ENTIRE INDUSTRY HOWETA BUSINESS AS
THEY KNOW IT, johnny.

Stick arHOWEND. The next couple months are gonna
be VERY INTERESTING. Hey johnny? You wouldn't be
WON of them PET PROFESSIONALS The Amazing Puppy
Wizard has IDENTIFIED EXXXPOSED and DISCREDITED,
might you be?

> Johnny G da Man 2B!

INDEEDY, johnny. You're QUITE the MAN, ain't you.
>
> John 732-264-6253
> Joseph 973-616-7575
> FFP 800-823-1030

Try THIS, you freakin halfwit:

HOWEDY jennifer,

Jennifer wrote:
> crystal h via CatKB.com wrote:
>
> > Generally it seems that everyone on this board is
> > against using the "spray bottle"...

Of curse!

> > But if the spray bottle is as abusive as listed
> > on these boards, what other options are there?

Don't pay no never mind to them FREAKS who ARE AFRAID
of just tellin their critters "NO!" on accHOWENT of
they THINK it'll SCARE and MAKE THEIR PETS NEUROTIC.

> Eh? I've seen the opposite.

Naaaah?

> Lots of people on rec.pets.cats.health+behav
> recommend the use of a spray bottle,

That so? Mostly it's SHOCK DEVICES and vinegar
and lemon juice in the water. And settin MHOWES
traps (under newspaper so it won't HURT them)
and shock pads for their kats to step on when
they climb on their furniture to PISS and SHIT
on it, like HOWE janet boss does for her DECLAWED
FEAR AGGRESSIVE DEATHLY ILL KATS.

> though I personally use a can of compressed
> air because my cats hate the noise

SHAAAZZZAAAMMM?

> and it doesn't get water everywhere.

That's kindly of you, know HOWE kats HATE
being squirted and intimidated with WATER.

> Why would anyone think a spritz of water is abusive?

Of curse!

> --
> Jennifer

Well, COMPARED TO THIS, water is a TREAT. Here's The
Puppy Wizard's SYNDROME AT IT's BEAST:

"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@mb-m18.aol.com...

> He was next to me and I could see his neck
> muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.

> Janet Boss

"sionnach" <rhyfe...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@ID-45033.news.uni-berlin.de...

> "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@mb-m17.aol.com...

> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher
> > > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
> > > dog like a Lab.

An INSENSITIVE DOG???

> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
> > I had apointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.

Jerking choking and shockin and lockin dogs
in boxes and ignoring their cries makes their
dogs go "EWWWW" but they don't NOTICE
EXXXCEPT to spray BINACA in their eyes
and jerk and choke them on pronged spiked
pinch choke collars and shock and spray MOORE
aversives in their faces.

Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL cause
the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's been sprayed
in the face and the dog won't know HOWE COME
IT was MACED?

> > My dogs are not human children wearing
> > fur- they are DOGS.

They're DUMB ANIMALS they HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.

"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040512151017.22325.00000859@mb-m19.aol.com...

> Leah wrote:

> >Ian
> >Dunbar has me convinced that (1) a dog
> > who lunges and bites and doesn't even
> >HURT is not a dangerous dog,

> Interesting. I just read someone else's take
> on the same seminar, and let's say they had
> a very different opinion than yours.

> I also disagree with his opinion. dangerous
> comes in many forms.

> PLEASE Leah - read, listen and don't jump
> on any "I am goD" bandwagons. Take
> all information for what it is - opinion.

> Janet Boss
> http://bestfriendsdogobedience .com/
> http://photos.yahoo.com/bestfr iendsobedience


From: "Jennifer" <msjh...@gmail.com>
Date: 13 May 2005 07:25:15 -0700
Subject: Re: diagnosis frustration

Janet B wrote:
>
> Even when the answers are bad, I like ANSWERS. Where
> my little Carey-kitty is involved, we never seem to have
> any. She's been "sick" for the last 3 years and we've
> never been able to figure out just what's going on with her.

> I'm trying to not add up the costs, as they just keep mounting.

I completely agree. Undiagnosable, untreatable problems are
incredibly frustrating. Thanks for hanging in there.

Your comrade in not-knowing-what-the-hell-is-wrong-with-her-cat,
Jennifer

BWEEEEAAAAAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!

janet's kats are DYING from STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE
DIS-EASE aka The Puppy Wizard's SYNDROME:

From: Janet B <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com>
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 08:30:03 -0400
Subject: diagnosis frustration

Even when the answers are bad, I like ANSWERS. Where my little
Carey-kitty is involved, we never seem to have any. She's been
"sick" for the last 3 years and we've never been able to figure
out just what's going on with her. I'm trying to not add up the
costs, as they just keep mounting.

Carey is an almost 12 year old tortie with numerous problems over
the 3 years, related to behavior, urinary issues, weight loss, and
early on, paralysis as well. We've had tests out the wazoo, have
seen standard general practice vets as well as a neurologist, tried
various medications, and we still have no real answers.

I'm hoping those come soon, but the preliminary aren't great choices.

After raising her Elavil level to combat inappropriate urination, she
tore her ACL. That appears to be healing slowly. She's been at the
vet numerous times in the last few weeks and we started seeing a
different vet, closer to home this week.

That was after she projectile vomited 2 meals, and was passing bloody
urine, on Monday. After a few small puddles of that, her urine was
not bloody and she was back to eating without problem. All day
Tuesday was fine. Saw vet on Wednesday, and x-rayed her bladder, and
embarked on more tests (last full bloodwork was last August). She has
a HUGE palpable thyroid gland, yet her thyroid tests (free T-4 still
waiting) have all been normal. She weighs 7# and is skin and bones,
and has been for quite a long time. She eats well (1 full can of
Trader Joe's cat food and 1/2 can Fancy Feast daily) and plays with
the other cat, loves on the dogs, etc.

5 minutes after coming home from the vet on Wednesday, she squatted
on the floor and let loose a large puddle of bloody urine. No blood
in urine since. Her urinalysis shows no issues.

Her kidneys look fine on x-rays, but her test results show renal
insufficiency, but not failure.

We're still waiting for more test results, but so far,
we have no answers. Does anyone have any thoughts?

--

From: Janet B <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com>
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 10:16:20 -0400
Subject: Re: diagnosis frustration

On Fri, 13 May 2005 08:57:31 -0500, kaeli

<tiny_...@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote:

> I'm sorry to hear Carey has been so sick.
> My first thought was not a good one -- cancer.

Thanks. Unfortunately, that's what my vet has said as well.
Having dealt with it with a few pets now, it didn't hit me
quite like the ton of bricks as the first time I heard that
diagnosis, but it still is hard to hear that it's a potential.

The last 2 days, she's been galloping and eating and acting
like "hey - I'm ok - no problem - don't worry about me!".

She's a tough little cat, but obviously not a well one.

She's adored by all beings in this household, so we'll do
whatever we need to for her as we find out (or not) more.
Right now she's curled up with her kitty-"brother" and
seems happy as she can be.

--
Janet B

Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats.health+behav
From: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)
Date: 24 Feb 2004 16:08:06 GMT
Subject: Re: Russian Blue running away - help!

> From: "Gail" g...@earthlink.net
> I wonder if a scat mat will help. It is a mat that is
> plugged in and emits a mild shock when the animal steps
> on it. I don't know if people stepping on it will cause
> the mat harm, though.
>
> Below is a link to it. I used them near bookcases when
> one of my cats started urinating there. They were great.
> Gail

A scat mat directly in front of the door, can be stepped
OVER by the humans, but teach the cat to avoid the door area.

I think it's a great solution.

BTW they can run on a 9V battery, so no wires are needed.

They are fixtures on my leather furniture to stop kitties
from peeing there!

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine

Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats.health+behav
From: Janet B <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com>
Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 14:18:15 -0400

Subject: Re: Electric shock pad

On 8 Aug 2005 11:03:01 -0700, "mystro"
<*.@gmail.com>, clicked
their heels and said:

>I'm trying to find a link or resource for purchasing training shock
>pad,a pad that gives a slight shock using flashlight batteries and
>perfectly harmless and from what little I've read..quite effective.
>Help :)

it's called a Scat Mat. Google that and you'll find several sources.

--
Janet B
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.co m
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/ bestfriendsobedience/album


Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats.health+behav
From: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)
Date: 03 Nov 2003 19:25:20 GMT

Subject: Re: Keeping cat out of room.

>From: "Iso" nos...@hotmail.com
>The mats, regardless of what you think WORK and are HARMLESS.

Just another opinion that Scat Mats are pretty useful tools.

Rather than have my youngest cat continue to ruin my
leather furniture, we have Scat Mats on the sofa and
chair.

When they are off, and we're sitting on that furniture,
Skip is allowed on and in our laps, etc. When the mats
are on, I can be happy with the fact that he's not
urinating on the leather!

The static charge isn't much at all - it's a deterrent,
and a good one.

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine

Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats.health+behav
From: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)
Date: 04 Nov 2003 21:35:43 GMT

Subject: Re: Declawing: glad I took the time

Kaeli wrote:

> Some of us feel that declawing a cat is tantamount
> to torture. You don't torture something you profess
> to love. Period. You don't even take the chance that
> it might be tortured. Period.

I fully understand that (and the analogy of other groups
who feel strongly about issue "x"). I think there is a
very, very large group of people who choose or think about
declawing, do so not because they want to take a chance
that the animal they love may be tortured, but because
of a variety of experiences/advice that says it's an ok
thing to do (not torture in general - declawing!).

Take the neighbor's attitude ("just" a cat? NO cat is
"just" anything! ;-D). One shared by many, to some degree.
Lot's of priorities. Interesting thread on RPDB recently
about people willing to die/put themselves in the line of
fire for their dogs.

It was interesting to read the range of thoughts on such
a thing. Obviously, people give different weight to
different beings and things.

While I am their caregiver and friend, I don't put
pets in the same category as humans.

I declawed my first cat, because my experiences said that
is what you did with an indoor cat (had lived with many
cats owned by others). She used her claws inappropriately
as a kitten, and my meager attempts at clawing devices
didn't work, so I thought nothing of it.

Since she exhibited no obvious ill effects, my experience
(and hers as far as anyone could tell) was a positive one.

Knowing more of what it entailed, I chose not to declaw my
next cat (owned in tandem with cat #1 and then cat #3).
He was an adult acquisition and I knew such a thing would
be more difficult for him, but also, he was very trainable
and I didn't even consider it.

Cat #3 was a claw maniac, and due to my experiences with
Cat #1, I went ahead with a declaw. Once again, I have
never seen any backlashes due to the operation, and I
would put up with anything if I'm lucky enough to have
her for many more years, which isn't all that likely.

She's doing well on meds currently, and maintaining,
if not gaining any weight.

Once I was ready for cat #4, I knew that I wouldn't choose
this route again. Not because of gory pictures, not because
of scare tactics about what my declawed cat would become,
but because I realized that more tools could make the
difference and it wasn't something that I really wanted
to do.

I didn't want to cause a kitten pain (even though others
didn't seem to experience any!), nor any physical or
emotional problems. So, I have a fully clawed cat who
pees on things - oh well! ;-D He's a wonderful cat in
every other way!

> If you love your furniture more than your cat's right
> to not be mutilated, you are going to draw some venom
> in a cat newsgroup.

Again, why is it either/or?

Can't someone value their belongings and their cat too?

I choose to protect my furniture with Sticky Paws (I forgot
they were there - probably time to take them off - it's been
almost 2 years with no interest!) and with Scat Mats (not
from claws but from urine).

Some folks posting here think that's a horrible thing to do.

People who have obviously never felt a Scat Mat! But balloons,
snappy trainers, etc are recommended. A lot of contradictory
thoughts here, so I can't say that it's all rational.

Passion rarely is though - and I actually appreciate
that for the most part!

It's obvious that each one of us has our own limits.

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine

gn.net/kae lisSpace


Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats.health+behav
From: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)
Date: 23 Jan 2004 21:21:29 GMT
Subject: Re: Protecting leather furniture

> But would a scat mat keep a cat from clawing
> the side of the couch?
>--
>~kaeli~

no - it's only good for the pee problem!

Never showed any interest in clawing, and
"launch" marks disappeared easily, as good
leather "heals" itself.

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine


Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats.health+behav
From: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)
Date: 04 Jun 2003 12:10:19 GMT

Subject: a few frustrations - a little long.
Mostly venting, but any thoughts are welcome!

#1 - Skipjack. 1.5 y.o. neutered male blue tabby.

Incredibly sweet and affectionate, sleeps against me
all night, on my lap every moment he can be. Eats well
(Solid Gold dry, various brands of canned - small amounts -
not much interest), uses his litter box, only scratches
his tree and a few mats that have been approved, and is
a very nice cat. Let's anyone carry him around forever
and is very social. Gets along well with 2 dogs and
another cat. But................

He also urinates on other things. Sofas (where we sit) -
frequency of maybe every few months. Wires. Phone or
speaker wires (thin), that are at floor level. Scrapes
around at them and urinates on them on hard surface flooring.

Maybe once every few weeks. Dog beds and dog's sofa
(I have baby mattress pads on these, under the covers
in order to just have to do wash!) - once every few
weeks. Guest bed - used or freshly washed sheets.
Full laundry basket - random, if available, not often.

Anything that can go in the wash has gotten soaked and
washed in hot water, Oxyclean added. Anything not machine
washable gets a thorough cleaning with Simple Solution Cat
Urine Cleaner (which I found seems to work better than Nature's
Miracle for this).

Feliway has been used to varying success.

Most recently, he urinated on a sofa cushion within a
few hours of spraying it with Feliway.

I have 2 cats, 2 litterboxes. One crystals, which he prefers,
one scoopable, which my other cat prefers. Both are kept
incredibly clean. No problem using the box, even when workmen
were in the room - I see him use it regularly and tell him what
a good kitty he is for doing so.

A little history - when he came home at 5 months old last
February (2002), he had a bad case of the squirts and managed
to fly around with liquid poop being released all over my sofas.

We cleared that up, washed everything thoroughly (sofas have
2 sets of machine washable slipcovers, and the leather sofa
he christened has a scat mat on it now), and thought we had
conquered any problems.

He is quite the perfect cat except for this issue and it's
very random as to where and when he decides to urinate.

I'm not happy with the situation of course, and can't quite
figure out what's going on. He doesn't have a UTI and has
normal elimination patterns as far as frequency.

He does not do this in my bedroom, the other guest bedroom,
the kitchen or dining room.

If you've read this far, I have another cat and problem! ;-D

#2 Carey. Almost 10 y.o. spayed tortie. Neurological problems
(probabl brain tumor, other things ruled out). Has been on Pred
and Valium for a bit over a year, and has dropped from a bit over
9# to less than 7# (all thyroid tests came back normal).

She's a happy and sweet cat who bugs me for her pills every
morning. She has a problem with raised (even happy) voices
where she attacks the dogs. I've talked about that here before.

The dogs are saints and have never reacted adversely to her
doing this. I can pick her up during these episodes and she
doesn't attack me, but is hell bent on trying to attack the
dogs. There have been times where the dogs noises have
triggered this. She gets along well with the younger cat.

She adores the dogs otherwise, and that's really the problem
more than the attacking (we've all kind of learned to live
with that!).

She obsesses over them.

When she was a kitten, she nursed on my Golden Retriever
so much that she needed surgery for hair blockage. She
ceased the behavior until she was 5.5 and when another
dog died, then she resumed.

She transferred that to another dog after the Golden died
1.5 years later, and now it's just increased to a difficult
level.

She does this to both of my dogs, mostly at nighttime or
whenever they are napping in my bedroom. She will do it
to the one dog in other locations as well. During the day,
it's not so bad.

The dogs look confused but tolerate it, even though she's
latched onto them with her mouth and rear claws. She
attaches herself to various parts of their bodies.

Nighttime is the problem - we're not getting any sleep!

Skipjack sleeps on the bed, the dogs sleep on their dog
beds or her favorite dog sleeps under the bed.

She will not leave her alone!

Poor Lucy gets up and leaves the room, only for Carey
to follow her, and she winds up pacing around, which
keeps us awake. She just isn't deterred. She can be
lifted off, tossed off, grumbled at, but she will not
leave the dogs alone until she's good and ready.

The only rooms that can be closed off are either across
the hall or under our room. She's a very vocal cat and
will meow like crazy if confined away from everyone else,
so that won't help sleep.

Any thoughts of novel things to try with either of these
kitties? I adore them but their habits are driving me
up the wall at times!

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine


Charlie
2005-08-18 09:56:37 EST

Thank you for the great advice! He seems to be getting better jumping
on me much less often.



On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:17:02 GMT, Kyler Laird <Kyler@news.Lairds.org>
wrote:

>Charlie <Charlie@myhouse.net> writes:
>
>>Is there a effective but gentle way to teach my German Shepherd not to
>>jump on people he likes?
>
>I appreciate your desire to do something other than give the dog a knee
>to the chest. I don't have any methods that are guaranteed to work but
>here are a couple of things to consider...
>
>If the dog is looking for attention, simply turning your back on him
>and ignoring him when he jumps might dissuade him from trying this
>approach. Make sure to give him some good attention if he stops.
>
>I like to redirect such energy. If you've got a treat (food/ball/...)
>that will capture his attention you might be able to get him to do
>something else when he starts to jump. I tend to go for downstays but
>one of our rescue Huskies just picked up a "sit up" from one of our
>dogs and it seems like that might be easier (and more fun) to go into
>from a jump - just entice the dog to keep his head far enough away
>from you that his paws don't hit you.
>
>And, of course...my answer to most behavior problems like this is
>exercise. (I usually take our current Husky biking twice a day. We
>went three times yesterday.) If he has a lot of pent up energy it's
>likely to come out in a behavior you don't appreciate. Try to find a
>mutually agreeable way to drain it.
>
>Good luck!
>
>--kyler


T*@AniMail.Net
2005-08-18 13:47:25 EST
HOWEDY kyler you freakin screwball, (freakin screwball
DOES S-HOWEND so much NICER than DOG ABUSING MENTAL CASE,
don't it???),

Kyler Laird wrote:
> Charlie <Charlie@myhouse.net> writes:
>
> > Is there a effective but gentle way to teach my
> > German Shepherd not to jump on people he likes?

Yeah. You can EXXXTINGUISH hyperEXXXCITATION by PRAISING
your dog IN ADVANCE and BRIEFLY, ALTERNATELY-VARIABLY
NON PHYSICALLY DISTRACT and INSTANTLY PRAISE him for
five to fifteen seconds and repeat till EXXXTINCTION,
usually four times in four different venues with four
different people, to be PRECISE, kyler... but you would't
KNOW NUTHING abHOWET NOT HURTING and INTIMIDATING dogs
as you and your MENTAL CASE RESCUE pals PREFER.

> I appreciate your desire to do something other
> than give the dog a knee to the chest.

Is THAT the only method you PREFER? You might
wanna consider SHOCKING or JERKING and CHOKING
them on pronged spiked pinch choke collars, kyler,
you freakin screwball <{); ~ ) >

> I don't have any methods that are guaranteed to work

BWEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!!

THAT'S on accHOWENT of you're a dog abusing BLOWHARD, kyler.

> but here are a couple of things to consider...
>
> If the dog is looking for attention, simply turning
> your back on him and ignoring him when he jumps might

It MIGHT REJECT the dog's BONDING ATTEMPT and
FRUSTRATE the dog and MAKE IT AGGRESSIVE, kyler.
Dogs JUMP on people to say "HOWEDY!" HOWE COME
you just don't SAY HOWEDY FIRST and the dog WON'T
NEED TO JUMP to SAY HOWEDY, kyler, you dog abusin
freakin screwball?

> dissuade him from trying this approach.

PERHAPS you can EXXXPLAIN HOWE WON might TURN
AWAY and IGNORE the dog's BONDING ATTEMPTS AT
THE SAME TIME? Your TURNING AWAY will prompt
the VISUAL ORAL REFLEX and may TRIGGER the dog
to BITE, kyler. It's KINDA EXXXACTLY PRECISELY
HOWE ATTACK DOGS ARE TRAINED, kyler.

> Make sure to give him some good attention if he stops.

So the dog will learn to JUMP on you to GET YOU TO
TURN (perhaps you should squeal like a pig also?)
arHOWEND and IGNORE his BONDING attempts till IT
STOPS and then you "give him some good attention"?

HOWE COME you don't just SAY HOWEDY like HOWE the
dog WANTS, kyler? DOGS JUMP TO GET ATTENTION like
you TURNIN ARHOWEND and IGNORING IT and THEN GIVIN
IT ATTENTION. S-HOWENDS like FUN to a DOG, kyler.
THAT'S HOWE we TRAIN ATTACK DOGS, kyler.

> I like to redirect such energy.

That so? This oughta be EXXXCELLENT!

> If you've got a treat (food/ball/...)

You mean, give the dog a REWARD for JUMPIN?

> that will capture his attention you might be able
> to get him to do something else when he starts to
> jump.

Yeah? BRILLIANT! You're SAYIN the dog STARTS TO
JUMP and you GIVE IT A COOKIE!!! BWEEEEEEAAHAHHA!!!

Hey? Know what? You mighta JUST FIGGERED HOWET HOWE
COME The Amazing Puppy Wizard calls you a MENTAL CASE.

> I tend to go for downstays

RIGHT! REPRESSING or AVOIDING behaviors ONLY REINFORCES
them and INCREASES ANXXXIHOWESNESS and MAKES THEM WORSE
or they CHANGE to OTHER, OFTEN WORSE, SEEMINGLY NON RELATED
BEHAVIORS... like CANCER, and FCR, like your own dogs got, kyler.

> but one of our rescue Huskies

BWEEEAAHAHAHHAHAAA!!!

The Amazing Puppy Wizard has DISCREDITED you "rescue"
dog lovers as FRAUDS LIARS COWARDS and DOG ABUSERS, kyler.

> just picked up a "sit up" from one of our dogs and
> it seems like that might be easier (and more fun)
> to go into from a jump -

IOW, the other dog LEARNED WHAT YOU COULDN'T TEACH
IT by WATCHING the other dogs whom you'd jerked and
choked and bribed for YEARS to get to greet folks
withHOWET jumpin on them, eh kyler?

> just entice the dog to keep his head far enough away
> from you that his paws don't hit you.

Oh, you mean hold a cookie up in the air in front of
IT so when IT JUMPS IT can GET HIS REWARD for NOT JUMPIN.

> And, of course...my answer to most behavior
> problems like this is exercise.

You EXXXCESSIVELY EXXXORCISE your dogs on accHOWENT
of they're HYPERACTIVE from ABUSE and IGNORING their
cries when you lock them in boxes, kyler.

> (I usually take our current Husky biking twice a day.

OtherWIZE he'll GO INSANE, kyler. THAT'S HOWE COME
dogs GET STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE like
HOWE YOUR OWN DOGS GOT IT, kyler.

> We went three times yesterday.) If he has a lot of
> pent up energy it's likely to come out in a behavior
> you don't appreciate.

Dogs DON'T GET "pent up energy" UNLESS they're
BEING IGNORED CRATED and ABUSED, kyler.

> Try to find a mutually agreeable way to drain it.

BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHAAA!!!

You mean like PRAISE THE DOG for sayin HOWEDY, kyler?

> Good luck!

Dog trainin AIN'T LUCK, you dog abusin screwball.
"Luck is for SUCKERS," The Puppy Wizard's DADDY.

Here's kyler, the HUMANITARIAN:

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.rescue
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Mon, 03 Nov 2003 00:22:58 GMT
Subject: Re: I NEED HELP FOR MY YORKIE! - Scribbles.jpg (0/1)

m155135chr03d3r <m155133sch03...@netscape.net> writes:
> I appreciate the fact that you are looking out for
>everyone's well being in regards to this matter.
> And although I do not wish to begin a war with words,
> I do wish to know, how you may only look at a picture
> that was taken 10 months ago and believe that the dog is
> perfectly healthy?

Some goof spams a picture to a bunch of inappropriate
non-binary newsgroups claiming it's sick and asking
for money. On that alone, my bets would be on "healthy."
(If it was for real, why post the picture at all if there's
nothing to discern from it?)

Then again, maybe you'd like to get together with Chad the GSD...

--kyler

Newsgroups: comp.home.automation
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org> -
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 20:18:27 GMT
Subject: Re: AMBER Alert! - Marrisa Janay Harper

"Fred" <nuts...@hotmail.com> writes:
> Why can't you understand that this is wildly inappropriate
> for any newsgroup other than alt.missing-kids !? World-wide
> readers don't care about a local incident, and can't do anything
> about it. Newsgroups have specific topics for a reason.

Welcome to the "But if it saves just one child" world.

Next we'll start seeing announcements for kids
selling cheese and crackers for their band trips.

--kyler

THAT'S KINDLY OF YOU, RESCUE DOG LOVER!

Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 21:18:34 GMT

Subject: Re: I just feel bad - my dog got a baby rabbit

Steve Cothran <d...@yahoo.com> writes:
> And they take advantage of technology too--- I have
> a neighbor lady that's close to 100 years old. Her
> husband died some time back, and I bushhog the fields
> around her house a few times a year.

Years ago, when we had "set aside" fields that I got
to mow, I enjoyed watching our GSD chase the rabbits.

As I would get down to the last few strips in the
middle of the field, they would come out in droves.

Our dogs now will chase and even gently pick up
rabbits, but they'll also drop them on command.

I've been told that the rabbits will still die of
heart attacks, though. (That's unverified.)

--kyler

IT'S VERIFIED NHOWE kyler, you ANIMAL ABUSING MENTAL CASE...
Bunny rabbits are VERY SENSITIVE CRITTERS and can DROP DEAD
from JUST SEEING an aggressive dog JUST LOOKIN at them locked
in a cage.

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.health
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 23:21:32 GMT

Subject: Re: My greyhound becoming bully of dogpark,help?

"Sharon too" <requestaddyfi...@nospam.com> writes:
>> Wouldn't a muzzle be an easier short-term change?
>
> A muzzle will prevent mouthing and biting but won't
> extinguish aggressiveness.

Yup. That's why I said "short-term".

> Dog parks are fun to go to, but not when one dog decides
> that it's a good time to exhibit his or her dominance roughly.

I travel to dog parks all over the country hoping to find dogs
who will entice mine to play rough. It wouldn't bother me in
the least for a muzzled brute to give them a go.

--kyler

THAT'S HOWE COME you're a MENTAL CASE, kyler!~


Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.rescue
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 16:08:52 GMT
Subject: Re: Save Abby

sighthounds etc. <greypigho...@ncweb.com> writes:
> I think that posting to a dog rescue list asking people to
> pay for his dog's surgery is irresponsible and shameless.

I agree. I get these requests weekly and I'm too annoyed
to even reply coherently.

I think it's quite possible that people do get confused
about what animal "rescue" is. That doesn't excuse not
taking responsibility for a companion animal's care but
it might be part of the problem.

--kyler

BWEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHHAAA!!! THE PROBLEM IS YOU and
your RESCUE SHELTER and FOSTER CARE ABUSERS, kyler.
tions

Newsgroups: alt.animals.dog
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 23:08:34 GMT
Subject: Re: Is there cure for 'Submissive Urination' ?

diddy <d...@nospam.diddy.net> writes:
> Confidence building. Don't scold him when he does this

seconded

> Put a belly band on him, so that when this occurs,
> he will associate sumbissive urination witrh getting
> wet, and he will make a conscious effort to stop it.

I'm not convinced that's necessary or helpful. I'm more
inclined to believe that providing no more stimulation
than the dog can easily handle will have so much more
effect that the "getting wet" part will hardly be noticed.

(I'll be happy to hear counterexamples.)

'course I considered dropping a high voltage source in a
diaper after a few years of working on this with my youngest...

I know the feeling of wanting the dog to associate negative
feelings with inappropriate behavior. I just don't think
that it really would do much good for the dog.

--kyler

SUBMISSIVE URINATION can be CURED NEARLY INSTANTLY
by simply DOIN EVERY THING PRECISELY EXXXACTLY
OPPOSITE of HOWE you been ABUSING your RESCUE
(KIDNAPPED) dogs, kyler. What makes you think you
got the right to just TAKE dogs you SEE and GIVE
THEM A GOOD HOWES with you or your RESCUE MENTAL
CASE pals, kyler? YOU MAKE MONEY HAND OVER FIST
comin an goin off of "RESCUE dog ADOPTIONS".

YOU'RE A FRAUD, kyler, a PATHETIC DOG ABUSING SCREWBALL.

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.misc
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2004 14:09:04 GMT
Subject: Re: Country Roads & DOGS

"Dave Mayer" <dave4...@hotmail.com> writes:
> A woman walking next to me today had a hard time
> controlling her big dog. The mutt obviously wanted
> to take a chunk out of me.

How did you determine that?

I'm trying to figure out if all of this fear
of dogs stuff has any real foundation.
ons

Newsgroups: alt.animals.dog, alt.pets.dogs.flame-wars,
alt.pets.dogs.pitbull, rec.pets.dogs.breeds, rec.pets.dogs.misc

From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 13:11:12 GMT
Subject: Re: To pitbull owners: you have failed ! BAN CHILDREN

h*.@whoever.com writes:
> PayBack <n_ly...@ev1.net> wrote in message <news:hr6sk0t0khtos5nbsb1tn03n0b6gr4q4hf@4ax.com>...
>
>> I hate your children, maybe pitbulls are designed
>> to clean up the gene pool....... Hope one eats your
>> silly fucking face !!!

>Keep 'em coming ! All the easier to make that banning decision!

So you *want* people to realize that your insistance
on a breed ban is about emotional issues loosely tied
to the breed instead of being about the breed itself?

I appreciate your candor.

--kyler

You're a BREED BAN ENTHUSIAST, kyler:

"A Rottweiler will exert 800 pounds-per-square-inch jaw
pressure and a Bull Terrier will exert 1200psi. A Pit
Bull will exert more than 2000 psi. You can have savage
Labradors and savage Chihuahuas, but none of them has
the potential to maim & kill that a pit bull does."

That means you're a lying dog abusing punk thug coward
mental case and your figgures are DEAD WRONG, kyler.
You're a PATHETIC ALARMIST on top of bein FULL OF CRAP.


Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.rescue
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:59:25 GMT
Subject: Re: Application "Points System"?

"Tee" <crappolagozh...@netscape.net> writes:
> I've gotten so many complaints from denied applicants,
> I've been personally threatened, cursed, and told that
> they'd make sure my rescue never adopted another dog again.
>
> Its all empty and quite frankly if someone is going to
> get so ticked off as to present a violent front then is
> that the kind of person I want one of my dogs to live with?

I think that's one of the best ways to judge someone.
Perhaps you should deny every application initially
and then give further consideration to those who react
reasonably.

--kyler

Oh, and that makes you a MENTAL CASE to boot.

Here's your Boxer RESCUE pal tara o. aka tee:

"Tending To Agree With The Positive Reinforcement Method"?

HOWEDY People,

Hello Tara,

"Tara O." <tara29...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:n%Zy6.30496$BC6.8869056@e3500-chi1.usenetserver.co
m...

> I tend to agree with the positive reinforcement
> method.

Oh, that's nice. I tend to think people who tend to
agree with positive reinforcement methods tend to be
pulling our chains... That's what I tend to think,
based on my experience working with people who tend to
agree with positive reinforcement who TEND TO
hurt their dogs when their tendencies to use positive
methods are outweighed by their tendencies to run out
of information or intellect and TEND to get frustrated
and TEND NOT to do the things they TEND TO believe are
right, when they TEND to be frustrated, or TEND to be
at a loss for INTELLECT, and TEND TO resort to
violence because they TEND to be shy on BRAINS... I
TEND TO view those folks as hypocrites, that's what I
TEND to do because I just happen to TEND to be HONEST,

> IMO, shock collars should be used only after normal
> obedience training methods have failed.

If your NORMAL obedience training TENDED to properly
train dogs, there would be a TENDENCY to have well
trained dogs. But that's not the case, becasuse NORMAL
obedience training TENDS to provoke, intimidate, and
confound your dog and inhibit his ability to think
and learn to want to work and think and learn... SEE?

That's what I TEND to think about NORMAL obedience
training which TENDS to FAIL because it TENDS to
resort to VIOLENCE instead of TENDING TOWARDS
THE MOST EFFECTIVE SCIENTIFIC METHODS AVAILABLE.

> It just bothers me to imagine shocking my dog, even
> at a very low frequency.

It bothers me less to think of shocking the dog than
thinking about what punishment and confrontation can
do to a dog's temperament. That's what I tend to think
based on my thirty eight years professional experience
training dogs.

> I will definitely admit that there are many dogs who
> either can't or won't benefit from training without
> such things as e-collars.

Is that based on your thirty eight years of experience
specializing in temperament and behavior problems and
protection training in giant breed dogs? Or is that
based on your TENDANCY to believe incompetent dog
abusing Thugs who tell you they TEND to get excellent
results from HURTING dogs to train them because they
TEND NOT TO be intelligent enough to outwit the
cunning of the domestic puppy dog???

OR IS IT BASED ON YOUR TENDENCY TO MURDER
YOUR OWN DEAD DOG Summer?

> I just hope its a last-resort, not a first.

And I just hope you figure out why your pals here who
hurt dogs to train them TEND to claim they have me in
their killfiles, because they TEND NOT TO be able to
answer my questions in good conscience...That's what
they TEND to do around here because our lying dog
abusing Thugs TEND to be INCOMPETENT, IMMORAL,
UNETHICAL, UNPRINCIPLED, DOG ABUSING COWARDS.

Like yourself.

That's what I tend to think.

Your pal, Jerry "The PHONY," Howe. j;~}
The Amazing Puppy Wizard. <{) ; ~ ) >

<*.@EarthLink.Net>
Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2004 17:12:11
GMT Local: Thurs, Oct 7 2004 10:12 am

"I'm Shocked That I Shocked"
tara o. aka tee,
NC Boxer Rescue Abuse

HOWEDY People

Here's WON of HOWER MENTAL CASES
hurtin dogs and lying abHOWET it again.

"I'm shocked that I shocked"

"Tara O." <nos...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bh9f81$vrac2$1@ID-92443.news.uni-berlin.de...

> Due to someone reprimanding Jar-Jar & the word
> "rescue" in the post, I decided to read down and see
> what he was spewing now. I was able to learn that
> besides choking, pinching, crating, abusing and
> murdering my dog, I also shocked her. I must be
> suffering from amnesia.

> Can someone point me to a post where I said
> I shocked my dog, or any dog, or that I even
> know *how* to use an e-collar....assuming I had one
> which must have been stolen at the same time I lost
> my memory.

> One would think Jerry would be happy with the
> "murder" part and all my other training sins but
> evidently not.
> --
> Tara

HOWEDY tara o.,

You didn't HURT INTIMIDATE and MURFDER
your own DEAD DOG Summer:

Date: 2003-04-28 18:09:04 PST

> "Tara O." wrote:

> > Labs are a breed that are normally trained for
> > field work with ear pinches, e-collars and other
> > forms of physical interaction without making them
> > fearful or aggressive.

==============

From: Tara O. (tara29...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Dane hyper when passing other dogs
Date: 2001-04-21 12:07:54 PST

I think its pertinent to mention that I've never had
any dogs who exhibited signs of aggression or were in
any way, shape, or form resistent to whatever
"training" I did with them.

I would not feel comfortable relying on my past
experience or a book to train a dog to stop biting,
snapping or growling.
--
Tara O.

===================

From: Tara O. (tara29...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Canine Behaviors For Dummies
Date: 2001-06-11 19:42:23 PST

"joshua" <jos...@ycsi.net> wrote in message
news:9g3uoi$sc7$0@63.90.193.133...

> I cant seem to understand why people believe prong
> collars are cruel and inhumane. They do nothing more
> than pinch, getting the attention of the animal.

> Choke collars, on the other hand, do permanent
> damage. They bruise the esophagus.

> Shock collars will eventually destroy nerve endings,
> much the same as electric fencing.

Joshua, you have just reopened a can of worms
that can quickly cause infestation here lol
--
Tara O.

===============

From: Tara O. (tara29...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: jerry howe
Date: 2001-04-04 11:58:06 PST

> People are tired of being abused and insulted simply
> for saying they use a prong collar, or a choke
> collar, or an e-collar, or a crate, etc. If you want
> to LEARN more about dog training and dog behavior,
> then listen to what they have to say, too.

"I've never not listened to what people say here.
I use a crate, am about to begin with a choke collar,
I'm not the bad guy here." tara o.

======================

From: Tara O. (tara29...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Electronic Training Collars
Date: 2001-05-11 17:29:33 PST


""Twzl, Sligo and Roy Happy Together"" wrote

> BTW, this is one of the frequent topics on obedience
> email lists. When people say that they haven't used
> corrections, it turns out that they feel that if
> they do it, it's not a real correction.

That makes sense in a weird sort of way. I don't
honestly think that its humanly possible to train
anyone or anything without correction. Its human
nature to say 'no' or to stop a behavior by doing
something. I used a tin can with coins to correct
Summer's bad puppy behaviors and the cold shoulder
to correct her other less desirable behaviors. I
have said 'no' so many times that I probably sound
like a broken record. Amie can attest to that
lol.

It seems to me that some people are automatically
equating the term correction with punishment. I
guess they can go hand in hand since my tin can
wasn't something Summer liked. My ignoring her
when she's misbehaving is also something she
doesn't like. Therefore it can be viewed as
punishment? And that term is 100% negative.

Maybe if more people saw it as correction and not
the total negative, they'd be less inclined to
want to be PP.

Don't know if the way I wrote that made sense, it
makes sense in my head but then again the men with
the white coats could come a'knockin at any
moment.

Tara O.

===================

From: Tara O. (nos...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Any hope? rage?
Date: 2003-03-26 05:46:02 PST

Yes I see and understand your point. There's no such
thing as 100% vigilence 100% of the time IMO. You
could call an e-fence company to find out if its
possible to wire only your front door so that if she
gets within a certain range of that front door the
collar will start working. I'd think there would be a
way to work that and it may be inexpensive to do
so.

There are also items called Scat Mats that you place
in front of doors or any area you don't want your dog
to proceed through. When stepping on the mat, it gives
off a vibration, something which most dogs hate.
They'll stay far away from the mats. I believe you can
buy them from
--
Tara

==================

Tara O. (nos...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Need advice--barking dog
Date: 2003-08-06 17:38:14 PST

you could consider installing an invisible fence just
inside the fence line so he cannot get too close. You
could talk to your neighbor about splitting the cost
of whichever alternative you both find most
acceptable.
--
Tara

=================

From: Tara O. (nos...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: Containment Collars
Date: 2003-03-11 07:12:57

I know people who have electric fences and it works
very well for them. I know people who have them and
whose dogs escape and refuse to come back in. From
the details I know of all involved, I wouldn't use an
e-fence on:

1. An adult dog that wasn't raised with the fence from
a puppy
2. A dog with a high prey drive
3. A very stubborn dog

If I put my female out in an e-fence, the very first
kid, cat, dog or squirrel she sees would have her
bolting through the barrier shock or not. When she
finally loses interest in whatever has caused her to
leave and her adrenalin has diminished, she will think
rationally and realize she's not willing to come back
into the yard because she knows the shock would get
her.

you have a dog who just has to go after or
up to any and everything that walks down the street
then I'd definitely not recommend one of these
systems. The people I know who it works for installed
them when their dogs were pups so they were brought up
trained to it. Two of the ones I know it didn't work
for have adult adopted dogs who weren't raised
with this kind of invisible barrier.

===================

From: Tara O. (tara29...@yahoo.com)
Subject: Re: escape artist, thunder, aggression
questions Date: 2001-05-12 07:56:04 PST

Since he got a taste of freedom and knows he can
get out I doubt you'll be able to stop him short
of tethering him or using a more sophisticated
device like an e-fence but I wouldn't recommend
going the electronic fence route without first
doing your homework on the pros and cons of them
and understand that they are not fool-proof.

=========================

MacKenzie's First Pinch Collar Class
Date: 2003-07-08 13:54:19 PST

I consider myself to be a pretty good basic obed.
trainer of Boxers with some learned but not necessarily
practiced, advanced training knowledge.

I think this because not only have I worked
with all the dogs I've had at my house but I'm also
the one in charge of all the dogs in our rescue, their
behavioral issues (identifying and working with),
basic training (done in the foster home) and a host of
other things. I'm the one who gives the advice and
walks the foster volunteers through alot of things.

Now I don't believe, for a second, that I would be
successful at teaching basic obedience to other dogs
in a class environment. Maybe I would but probably
not. Other trainers with class experience may think I
have no clue what I'm doing because my experience
has been primarily hands-on and with only one breed.


Newsgroups: alt.animals.dog
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 03:12:50 GMT
Subject: Re: Toy Dog Puppies Available

"Diana" <d...@dogstuffagain.fslife.co.uk> writes:
>
>> Pomeranians, Chihuahuas and other toy pups available
>> to purchase and ship o anywhere in the USA (except
>> Hawaii) and to Canada. AKC, CKC, UKC, ACA, APA. Free
>> information and advice. http://toys.azpuppies.com
>
>Ooooh, now there's a lovely web site <s>
>
>~ these people have the cheek to post on a dog lovers newsgroup???

Who do you think it is who funds such businesses?

If you really think all people reading "dog lovers
newsgroups" are educated thoughtful people who would
never be so stupid, I suggest you scan the archives
for enlightenment.

--kyler

INDEEDY~! The Amazing Puppy Wizard JUST DONE THAT, kyler...
It's called GETTIN JERRYIZED, you freakin screwball <{); ~ ) >

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.rescue
From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 02:53:46 GMT

Subject: Re: things I've noticed about dog rescues

"Support Your Local Community Band" <chuck_petter...
@spamxexcite.com> writes:

> it used to be very active. Unfortunately people like
> the puppy wizard have made the forum so unpleasant that
> many have moved on to yahoo groups.

People who are able to figure out how to log in to Yahoo!
should be able to figure out how to add someone to their
newsreaders' filters.

Taking rescue discussions "underground" is a loss
for many of us.

--kyler

Yeah, you won't be able to MAKE MONEY HAND OVER FIST
while DISADVANTAGING STOLEN DOGS from their original
HOWES, you punk.


From: Kyler Laird <K...@news.Lairds.org>
Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2002 17:24:30 GMT
Subject: Re: leash v no leash (ninnyHurt)

michael <c...@dogtv.com> writes:
>Since you make grand announcements of killfiling me,

Yeah, I hate the dumb killfile announcements, too.

However...I'm having a hard time adding you to mine.
It seems that my newsreader (nn) only uses the subject
or "name" for its killfile. Your "name" is just
"michael". I don't want to kill all messages from
anyone named "michael" so I'm left with trying to
change the newsreader to handle e-mail addresses (which
it should).

How 'bout using your full name to make this a little
easier on those of us with problem newsreaders?

Thank you.

--kyler

From: michael <c...@dogtv.com>
Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2002 18:15:20 GMT
Subject: Re: leash v no leash (ninnyHurt)

Kyler Laird wrote:

> michael <c...@dogtv.com> writes:

> > Since you make grand announcements of killfiling me,

> Yeah, I hate the dumb killfile announcements, too.

> However...I'm having a hard time adding you to mine.
> It seems that my newsreader (nn) only uses the subject
> or "name" for its killfile. Your "name" is just
> "michael". I don't want to kill all messages from
> anyone named "michael" so I'm left with trying to
> change the newsreader to handle e-mail addresses (which
> it should).

> How 'bout using your full name to make this a little
> easier on those of us with problem newsreaders?

> Thank you.

BWAHAHAAAHAHAAAHAHAAAAA!!!

If you want to stick your head up your ass,
it's entirely up to you HOWE you do it.

> --kyler
--
this is michael
reporting live...
from the new muzzle of dog training

http://dogtv.com
http://changethemuzzle.com


Here's your FREE copy of The Amazing Puppy
Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?G34D2527A

Just ASK The Amazing Puppy Wizard if you
need any additional FREE heelp. There's NO
arbritrary INFORMATION in your FREE copy
of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual so
study it well and do and follow ALL the
EXXXERCISES AS INSTRUCTED... it's a
PRECISE SCIENCE or it COULDN'T GET 100%
CONSISTENT NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS for all
handlers and all dogs in all fields or
utilities and behaviors all over the Whole
Wild World <{) ; ~ ) >

ALL Critters Only Respond In
PREDICTABLE INNATE NORMAL NATURAL
INSTINCTIVE REFLEXIVE Ways;
To Situations And Circumstances Of Their Environment
Which We Create For Them.

You GET The Critter You TRAINED

A DOG Is A Dog;
As A KAT Is A KAT;
As A BIRDY Is A BIRDY;
As A CHILD IS A CHILD;
As A SP-HOWES Is a SP-HOWES.

In The Problem Animal Behavior BUSINESS
FAILURE MEANS DEATH.
SAME SAME SAME SAME,
For The Problem Child Behavior BUSINESS.

Damn The Descartean War of "Nature Vs Nurture."
We Teach By HOWER Words And Actions
And GET BACK What We TAUGHT.

ALL Behavior Problems Are CAUSED BY MISHANDLING

Jer 21 And unto this people thou shalt say,
Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I set before
you The Way Of Life, And The Way Of Death.

2Ki 19:6 And Isaiah said unto them, Thus
shall ye say to your master, Thus saith
the LORD, Be not afraid of the words which
thou hast heard, with which the servants of
the king of Assyria have blasphemed me.

The Puppy Prophet <{); ~ ) >

The Amazing Puppy Wizard <{); ~ ) >


J*@imabadlittlegirl.com
2005-08-18 17:23:50 EST
I think you are supposed to put a ring through the dog's nose, tie
something to that ring, and then just jerk it hard when the dog
misbehaves or something , right? I mean, if the dog misspells a word or
something....


Johnny G da Man 2B!

Call now to claim your free prize! YIpYip Yipppeeeee!!!!!

John 732-264-6253
Joseph 973-616-7575
FFP 800-823-1030

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