Dog Discussion: Breeding Staffs

Breeding Staffs
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Jt
2004-11-21 05:40:24 EST
i have a four year old brindle male staff bull terrier i would very much
like to breed him and maybe have one of the pups.does anyone know of anybody
who would like to breed there female staff???
i am in yorksire area of uk..



Caroline
2004-11-22 04:46:52 EST
what is it about him that makes you think he is good enough to breed from?

"jt" <jt3009@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:cnpran$n0f$1@titan.btinternet.com...
>i have a four year old brindle male staff bull terrier i would very much
>like to breed him and maybe have one of the pups.does anyone know of
>anybody who would like to breed there female staff???
> i am in yorksire area of uk..
>
>



Caroline
2004-11-23 04:07:17 EST
jt....on newsgroups it is normal to reply to a post via the newsgroup and
not via personal email. I will let it go this one time because you might
have hit "reply" instead of "reply group" by mistake, but I'd rather you
didn't do it again ;o)

Here is your reply:

>From: "jt" <>
>To: "caroline" <>
>Subject: Re: breeding staffs
>Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 00:19:48 -0000
>
>he is from a pedigree father ,beautiful looking animal and very good
>temperament.would make lovely pups

I'm sorry jt but in a country where over-breeding of popular breeds,
including the staffie, is rife and with hundreds of the dogs ending up in
pounds and rescues every month...your reasons for breeding just don't cut
it.

He has a pedigree father...you don't mention his mother, so are we to assume
she is not pedigree/has no papers? Even so, a pedigree parentage is
absolutely no guarantee of quality of progeny. Mating even the best male
and female you could possibly find will still have a high percentage chance
of producing "pet" quality puppies.

Beautiful looking - in who's opinion. Have you done any showing with him,
do you have an independent knowledgeable assessment of his quality and
attributes as a representative of his breed? I fear not

A good temperament is a good start, but should not be the be-all and end-all
of quantifying a dog for its breeding qualities.

Would make lovely pups - well....of course there is absolutely nothing to
guarantee that is there....with any mating.

If you're serious about breeding, please look into it from all angles. Get
your lad fully health tested for all those problems prevalent with that
breed, your breed club can advise you of what test are required to show
that he is not carrying any genetic or hereditary health problems.
Get your lad in to the show ring, have judges compare him against his
peers...see if he really is as good quality as you like to believe.
Believe me, anyone with even a half-decent bitch would expect this from you
as an absolute minimum. If the male is good enough, the owner shouldn't be
looking for people with females....the bitch owners should be knocking your
door down to use your lad....if he's good enough...
Promise me you won't become 'just another back yard breeder' churning out
unwanted pups just because your lad "is from a pedigree father ,beautiful
looking animal with a very good temperament". That is simply not enough info
to justify breeding pups.




"caroline" <nospamplease@thank.you> wrote in message
news:30dqsfF2v1l70U1@uni-berlin.de...
> what is it about him that makes you think he is good enough to breed from?
>
> "jt" <jt3009@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
> news:cnpran$n0f$1@titan.btinternet.com...
>>i have a four year old brindle male staff bull terrier i would very much
>>like to breed him and maybe have one of the pups.does anyone know of
>>anybody who would like to breed there female staff???
>> i am in yorksire area of uk..
>>
>>
>
>



Jt
2004-11-23 07:10:59 EST
first of all sorry for replying by email,didnt realise it was such an
offence and secondly im only advertising due to people who have approached
me in past to breed him..i certainly was not looking for anyones approval ,i
thought your little essay was a little condescending-thank you!!


"caroline" <nospamplease@thank.you> wrote in message
news:30gcu9F2v78nrU1@uni-berlin.de...
> jt....on newsgroups it is normal to reply to a post via the newsgroup and
> not via personal email. I will let it go this one time because you might
> have hit "reply" instead of "reply group" by mistake, but I'd rather you
> didn't do it again ;o)
>
> Here is your reply:
>
>>From: "jt" <>
>>To: "caroline" <>
>>Subject: Re: breeding staffs
>>Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 00:19:48 -0000
>>
>>he is from a pedigree father ,beautiful looking animal and very good
>>temperament.would make lovely pups
>
> I'm sorry jt but in a country where over-breeding of popular breeds,
> including the staffie, is rife and with hundreds of the dogs ending up in
> pounds and rescues every month...your reasons for breeding just don't cut
> it.
>
> He has a pedigree father...you don't mention his mother, so are we to
> assume she is not pedigree/has no papers? Even so, a pedigree parentage
> is absolutely no guarantee of quality of progeny. Mating even the best
> male and female you could possibly find will still have a high percentage
> chance of producing "pet" quality puppies.
>
> Beautiful looking - in who's opinion. Have you done any showing with him,
> do you have an independent knowledgeable assessment of his quality and
> attributes as a representative of his breed? I fear not
>
> A good temperament is a good start, but should not be the be-all and
> end-all of quantifying a dog for its breeding qualities.
>
> Would make lovely pups - well....of course there is absolutely nothing to
> guarantee that is there....with any mating.
>
> If you're serious about breeding, please look into it from all angles.
> Get your lad fully health tested for all those problems prevalent with
> that breed, your breed club can advise you of what test are required to
> show that he is not carrying any genetic or hereditary health problems.
> Get your lad in to the show ring, have judges compare him against his
> peers...see if he really is as good quality as you like to believe.
> Believe me, anyone with even a half-decent bitch would expect this from
> you as an absolute minimum. If the male is good enough, the owner
> shouldn't be looking for people with females....the bitch owners should be
> knocking your door down to use your lad....if he's good enough...
> Promise me you won't become 'just another back yard breeder' churning out
> unwanted pups just because your lad "is from a pedigree father ,beautiful
> looking animal with a very good temperament". That is simply not enough
> info to justify breeding pups.
>
>
>
>
> "caroline" <nospamplease@thank.you> wrote in message
> news:30dqsfF2v1l70U1@uni-berlin.de...
>> what is it about him that makes you think he is good enough to breed
>> from?
>>
>> "jt" <jt3009@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
>> news:cnpran$n0f$1@titan.btinternet.com...
>>>i have a four year old brindle male staff bull terrier i would very much
>>>like to breed him and maybe have one of the pups.does anyone know of
>>>anybody who would like to breed there female staff???
>>> i am in yorksire area of uk..
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>



Diddy
2004-11-23 08:38:25 EST
in thread news:cnv9cj$7o8$1@sparta.btinternet.com: "jt"
<*9@btopenworld.com> whittled the following words:

> first of all sorry for replying by email,didnt realise it was such an
> offence and secondly im only advertising due to people who have
> approached me in past to breed him..i certainly was not looking for
> anyones approval ,i thought your little essay was a little
> condescending-thank you!!
>
>

it was facts, NOT condescending.
Since you have such a rudimentary comprehension of informed breeding, any
lecture would SEEM condescending to you. There is a major problem in over
bred dogs. Apparently you don't see it. And she was trying to educate you.
Obviously you are NOT looking for approval from anyone. You are simply
pimping your dog. Since he's in that high demand, you don't NEED to pimp in
in a group of informed dog owners who knows where and who NOT to be
interested.
Pander your puppy in the uninformed puppymill circles. They are the
audience who don't want to know about the problems of overbreeding.

Jt
2004-11-23 12:07:58 EST
fuck you dickface
"diddy" <diddy@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns95AA57B11A859danny@216.196.97.142...
> in thread news:cnv9cj$7o8$1@sparta.btinternet.com: "jt"
> <jt3009@btopenworld.com> whittled the following words:
>
>> first of all sorry for replying by email,didnt realise it was such an
>> offence and secondly im only advertising due to people who have
>> approached me in past to breed him..i certainly was not looking for
>> anyones approval ,i thought your little essay was a little
>> condescending-thank you!!
>>
>>
>
> it was facts, NOT condescending.
> Since you have such a rudimentary comprehension of informed breeding, any
> lecture would SEEM condescending to you. There is a major problem in over
> bred dogs. Apparently you don't see it. And she was trying to educate you.
> Obviously you are NOT looking for approval from anyone. You are simply
> pimping your dog. Since he's in that high demand, you don't NEED to pimp
> in
> in a group of informed dog owners who knows where and who NOT to be
> interested.
> Pander your puppy in the uninformed puppymill circles. They are the
> audience who don't want to know about the problems of overbreeding.



Jt
2004-11-23 12:09:04 EST
if your not interested then please play elsewhere
"diddy" <diddy@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns95AA57B11A859danny@216.196.97.142...
> in thread news:cnv9cj$7o8$1@sparta.btinternet.com: "jt"
> <jt3009@btopenworld.com> whittled the following words:
>
>> first of all sorry for replying by email,didnt realise it was such an
>> offence and secondly im only advertising due to people who have
>> approached me in past to breed him..i certainly was not looking for
>> anyones approval ,i thought your little essay was a little
>> condescending-thank you!!
>>
>>
>
> it was facts, NOT condescending.
> Since you have such a rudimentary comprehension of informed breeding, any
> lecture would SEEM condescending to you. There is a major problem in over
> bred dogs. Apparently you don't see it. And she was trying to educate you.
> Obviously you are NOT looking for approval from anyone. You are simply
> pimping your dog. Since he's in that high demand, you don't NEED to pimp
> in
> in a group of informed dog owners who knows where and who NOT to be
> interested.
> Pander your puppy in the uninformed puppymill circles. They are the
> audience who don't want to know about the problems of overbreeding.



Diana
2004-11-24 14:24:15 EST

"jt" <jt3009@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:cnvqpe$r6r$1@sparta.btinternet.com...
> <expletives snipped>

When looking for a breeder for your potential pup, consider their attitude,
openess and willingness to discuss their dogs in a polite and positive way
as much as you would any other aspect of responsible breeding... especially
with a breed that is close to being banned in much of Europe and in some
states of the US & Canada. Nice friendly dogs generally have nice, friendly
owners.

Seeing that the OP is in the UK, he might not be sooo aware of the huge dog
overpopulation situation in the US and why our US contributors are sooo
desperate to deter more people from adding to the problem. Though things
aren't so bad from that aspect in the UK, there are still many, many aspects
to consider before breeding your dog.

My dog's father gained his life qualification to Crufts this year (I think
he came 3rd in a Championship show, but I'm not up on the teccies of the
show world). Her litter mate Harley and her half sister have also qualified
for 2005 and Cin is every inch as good as they are, physically and in weimi
character - and people can't believe that I had her spayed and have not
chosen to breed from her. I've been approached by lots of people who say
they'd like a pup from her too - and I give them her breeder's contact
details.

My reason - the weim is not a dog for 'anyone', they are a particularly
demanding breed in terms of energy, intelligence, size and 'clinginess'.
Thats why so many end up on rescue and having had a rescue dog before, I
know how devastating that experience can be for a loving family dog who
landed up 'unwanted' just cos:

people didn't put enuff thought in to ensuring he would be born ;

that he would be placed to a loving home (ie, NOT the first person that
replies to a newspaper ad but the person who has really put themselves out
to learn about the breed, its demands and is happy to go on a waiting list)

and that that loving home would have all the help, guidence and advice they
need from an experienced breeder to ensure that if little problems do start
to occur, they can be sorted quickly and the dog gets to stay in his life
long home.

Good prospective owners generally go to experienced responsible breeders cos
they've researched properly and have learnt of the pitfalls of buying a
puppy from the bloke down the road (byb) who just wanted to breed his pet.
That leaves the rash and inexperienced / too ignorant to learn or to
arrogant to learn for the byb to sell his puppies to.

I love my dog - she's very special. I would hate to imagine her in a home
that didn't want to put themselves out to learn about her, and nor would I
want that from her prodgeny... so she's spayed.

While Staffies can be great family dogs, they can also be very difficult
with their low centre of gravity, powerful necks and tendency for dog
agresssion. They, like the weim, are not a dog for everybody so I would
strongly urge to to think very carefully... maybe these contacts can help
you:

http://www.staffords.co.uk (btw I just noticed there that they state: " It
is estimated that approximately 2000 Staffords pass through Battersea Dogs
Home and Welfare annually" - do you really need to add to those numbers?

Diana & Cindy the crazy weimaraner
http://cindy-incidentally.mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk



The Puppy Wizard
2004-11-24 18:29:09 EST
You're full of crap.

You're a lying dog abusing mental case just
JUDGING by your own posted case history.

"Diana" <diana@dogstuffagain.fslife.co.uk> wrote in message
news:co2n50$31u$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "jt" <jt3009@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
> news:cnvqpe$r6r$1@sparta.btinternet.com...
> > <expletives snipped>
>
> When looking for a breeder for your potential pup, consider
their attitude,
> openess and willingness to discuss their dogs in a polite and
positive way
> as much as you would any other aspect of responsible breeding...
especially
> with a breed that is close to being banned in much of Europe and
in some
> states of the US & Canada. Nice friendly dogs generally have
nice, friendly
> owners.
>
> Seeing that the OP is in the UK, he might not be sooo aware of
the huge dog
> overpopulation situation in the US and why our US contributors
are sooo
> desperate to deter more people from adding to the problem.
Though things
> aren't so bad from that aspect in the UK, there are still many,
many aspects
> to consider before breeding your dog.
>
> My dog's father gained his life qualification to Crufts this
year (I think
> he came 3rd in a Championship show, but I'm not up on the
teccies of the
> show world). Her litter mate Harley and her half sister have
also qualified
> for 2005 and Cin is every inch as good as they are, physically
and in weimi
> character - and people can't believe that I had her spayed and
have not
> chosen to breed from her. I've been approached by lots of people
who say
> they'd like a pup from her too - and I give them her breeder's
contact
> details.
>
> My reason - the weim is not a dog for 'anyone', they are a
particularly
> demanding breed in terms of energy, intelligence, size and
'clinginess'.
> Thats why so many end up on rescue and having had a rescue dog
before, I
> know how devastating that experience can be for a loving family
dog who
> landed up 'unwanted' just cos:
>
> people didn't put enuff thought in to ensuring he would be born
;
>
> that he would be placed to a loving home (ie, NOT the first
person that
> replies to a newspaper ad but the person who has really put
themselves out
> to learn about the breed, its demands and is happy to go on a
waiting list)
>
> and that that loving home would have all the help, guidence and
advice they
> need from an experienced breeder to ensure that if little
problems do start
> to occur, they can be sorted quickly and the dog gets to stay in
his life
> long home.
>
> Good prospective owners generally go to experienced responsible
breeders cos
> they've researched properly and have learnt of the pitfalls of
buying a
> puppy from the bloke down the road (byb) who just wanted to
breed his pet.
> That leaves the rash and inexperienced / too ignorant to learn
or to
> arrogant to learn for the byb to sell his puppies to.
>
> I love my dog - she's very special. I would hate to imagine her
in a home
> that didn't want to put themselves out to learn about her, and
nor would I
> want that from her prodgeny... so she's spayed.
>
> While Staffies can be great family dogs, they can also be very
difficult
> with their low centre of gravity, powerful necks and tendency
for dog
> agresssion. They, like the weim, are not a dog for everybody so
I would
> strongly urge to to think very carefully... maybe these contacts
can help
> you:
>
> http://www.staffords.co.uk (btw I just noticed there that they
state: " It
> is estimated that approximately 2000 Staffords pass through
Battersea Dogs
> Home and Welfare annually" - do you really need to add to those
numbers?
>
> Diana & Cindy the crazy weimaraner
> http://cindy-incidentally.mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk
>
>



The Puppy Wizard
2004-11-24 18:41:12 EST
HOWEDY JT,

"jt" <> wrote in message
news:cnvqrg$f3k$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> if your not interested then please play elsewhere

WELCOME to The Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Forums. You've
met a couple of the resident dog abusing mental cases.

If you're WONderin HOWE COME they HATE
you for wanting to breed your beautiful dog,
it's on accHOWENT of these are the same
cretins who MURDER dogs.

> "diddy" <diddy@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
> news:Xns95AA57B11A859danny@216.196.97.142...
> > in thread news:cnv9cj$7o8$1@sparta.btinternet.com: "jt"
> > <jt3009@btopenworld.com> whittled the following words:
> >
> >> first of all sorry for replying by email,

Yeah. That an top postin are a big problem on newsgroups.

> >> didnt realise it was such an offence

There AIN'T NO CABAL.

> >> and secondly im only advertising due to people
> >> who have approached me in past to breed him..
> >> i certainly was not looking for anyones approval ,

Decent people do not post here abHOWETS, JT.

> >> i thought your little essay was a little
> >> condescending-thank you!!

HOWER dog lovers are so miserable they'll
attack anyWON they can make HOWET to
be UNETHICKAL.

> > it was facts, NOT condescending.

diddler shoots hungry dogs and murders
innocent critters in leg hold and strangled
noose traps and bludegeons them and lets
her dogs mutilate them for fun and profit.

> > Since you have such a rudimentary comprehension
> > of informed breeding, any lecture would SEEM
> > condescending to you.

You'd have to know diddler's posted case
history to understand. She's a mental case.

> > There is a major problem in over
> > bred dogs. Apparently you don't see it.

Perhaps there ain't no over pupulation problem
in his neighborhood. Perhaps you'll send him
some of yours, eh diddler?

> > And she was trying to educate you.
> > Obviously you are NOT looking for
> > approval from anyone. You are simply
> > pimping your dog.

You got cash?

> > Since he's in that high demand, you don't
> > NEED to pimp in in a group of informed dog
> > owners

BWEEEAAHAHAHAHHAAA!!!

Every WON of the regulars here have been
DISCREDITED as liars dog abusers cowards
and active long term incurable mental cases.

> > who knows where and who NOT to be interested.

BWEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAAA!!!

diddler murders innocent critters for FUN.

> > Pander your puppy in the uninformed puppymill circles.

JT's O.K. here, diddler. You ain't.

> > They are the audience who don't want to
> > know about the problems of overbreeding.

WHEN YOU CAN'T FIND ANY CATS TO SHOOT,
SHOOT HUNGRY DOGS INSTEAD FOR GETTING
IN THE GARBAGE

From: diddy (diddy@diddy.net)
Subject: Re: Dog Shot, Neighbor Charged, Anchorage AK

Date: 2002-11-08 07:00:27 PST

I shot a neighbors dog one night for chasing my
horses and called him to help me find it. I would
do the same for threatening my dog.

My husband shot a dog that had been tearing up
trash up and down our road for years making an
unbelievable mess.

When we finally killed the culprit, the whole road
cheered. Animal control had never been able in
years to catch this critter. (we think it was feral it
was certainly unkempt enough to have been....
and it had been shot at by MANY of the neighbors,
but it never frightened it off enough to keep it from
NOT tearing up the road the next trash day)

---------------------------------

> Bradford, according to a police report, told Escambia
> County Sheriff's deputies that, after shooting three of
> the animals, he was "holding one of the puppies in his
> left hand and another one in his arms, when the one in
> his arms began to wiggle."

He should just bludgeoned them like HOWE diddler PREFERS:


From: diddy (diddy@nospam.diddy.net)
Subject: Re: cats : Crating/Caging: What constitutes abuse?
Date: 2002-08-23 09:18:08 PST

Lyn wrote:

> > You know I'm a cat abuser because I let my cat out.
> > Alison
> Well, it totally depends upon where you live, as to whether
> or not doing so is in the best interest of your animal.
> Abuser isn't a term I would use, and I am a "cat group"
> regular.

Here it would be abuse. If you like your cat you keep it
home. I run a state authorized and monitored nuisance
animal trapline.

This morning there was a cat in a snare. Ordinarily,
an animal caught in a snare can be released unharmed.
One of the animals I am targeting is coyotes (and the
complaint was that coyotes were killing area cats)

Duh.. If your cats are becoming lunch for wild animals,
to me .. It makes sense to keep your cats in where they
can't become lunch.. whatever.

Regarding this cat in the snare. It went nuts. It leaped,
and tangled itself, and most certainly strangulated it's
intestines. It had the snare pulled tight down to the
diameter of a dime (just large enough to encircle the
spine) around the waist area.

This cats snarled, and attacked. Trying to extricate this cat
was exceedingly difficult, not to mention dangerous. Because
I feared damage to the intestines and death of the gut, I
imagined this cat was not likely to survive.

It would have been much simpler to dispatch the unfortunate
cat and take out the dead body. Instead, this cat wore a
collar. it deserved a chance, and the owner deserved closure.
(no id on the collar) .

It escaped, just as I released it and it couldn't be taken to
the vet for examination. I will probably never know if this
particular cat survives the experience or not.

People in the area were aware that trapping was being done and
apparently still let their cats run free, b oth endangered by
the traps and by the coyotes being targeted that are causing a
problem with their cat population.

Had that cat not been wearing a collar, I would not have tried
to release this hostile cat. Releasing it may not have been a
kindness, but then... cats weren't supposed to be attracted to
this type of trap, in this position, and then they weren't
supposed to go ape, to get themselves in this situation.
If you like your pet, you keep them home.

======================================


> The animal placed its paw on the trigger of Bradford's
> .38-caliber handgun, causing the weapon to discharge.

A gun butt to the skull ALWAYS WORKS.

> Shot in the left wrist,

He shoulda saved the bullets. He was just tryin
to MURDER THEM HUMANELY like HOWE
HOWER RESCUE / SHELTER DOG LOVERS
PREFER, to PROTECT INNOCENT CRITTERS.

> Bradford raced to a Pensacola hospital, where he
> told cops he sought to kill the dogs because he was
> unable to find them a permanent home

THAT'S NORMAL here abHOWETS.



HOWEDY diddler,

"diddy" <diddy@nospam.diddy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9554DA8F98950danny@216.196.97.142...
> in thread news:cgshq9$u2n$1@uwm.edu: dermer@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu
(Marshall
> Dermer) whittled the following words:
>
>
> > Sad. Why do we love them so?
> >
> Because you will never again in your life
> experience so much honor, nobility, honesty,
> loyalty, and altruistic caring.and true love.

diddy wrote:

I certainly was NOT going to keep him, Nor was
I going to throw him away. I was going to go the
distance and get him back home (we fixed some
other problems while he was here) He's now a
happy and great dog, although I wasn't so fond
of him when he first came, and although we grew
close, the whole experience was not among my
fondest memories, until the end.

I needed to redirect his energies. He used escape for
entertainment. Once I gave him very many jobs to do,
and taught him LOTS of positive job skills to redirect
his energies. Once he found positive alternatives, he
finally forgot his negative behaviors which were severely
entrenched by the time I got him.

The first 6 months were awful for both of us.
-------------------------------------------------

All the "awful"-ness was caused by diddy. Just as all
the awfulness of the blood coming out of Reka's rectum
was caused by diddy and her INSANE need to prevent
her dog with "getting away" with anything (such as telling
diddy she was deathly ill).

Only she led you to believe that she was the hero.

Kind2dogs wrote:
> That's fine. I like to hear all different opinions.
> Now about that rescues dog doing such, how
> long was he alone for,to do such destruction?

diddy wrote:

I think 4 hours or so, I had put him in a supposedly
"Secure" place, while I had to leave. When I got
home, he had trashed my house. From then on,
when I left, he got put in the horse stall.

He trashed my horse stall.

He then got a new horse stall, wore a E-collar,
I electrified the perimeter of the stall and we
were finally able to contain him while we worked
on his escape problems.

Once he learned that I was more determined to
defeat him, he finally subdued. But escaping, to
him was a game.

Both of us had a throughly miserable time during
the stand off. The dog is actually now a very good
citizen. He just had to meet someone more determined,
and stubborn and willing to go the distance to do what it
took, before he would stop.

Like I said, I thought he and I were going
to grow old together.

I am not going to go into exactly where we
went before we got that accomplished.

Let's just say it was "ugly"

------------------------------

Next time we can talk abHOWET diddler
fighting with her shock fence for a year...
and finding some FAILURE and losin her
PRECIHOWES tracking dogs.

> (investigators later discovered three puppies in
> a shallow grave at Bradford's residence).

You'd prefer they go to a rendering plant?
Or HOWE abHOWET just feed them to a
bigger dog?:


From: diddy
(*y@nospam.diddy.net)
Subject: Re: What would you do in this situation?
Date: 2002-05-31 14:49:22 PST

Actually, I borrowed the vets office kitten once for a
couple days for school education on pet care and safe
handling as well as responsible pet ownership.

I kept the kitten over night in a crate within a crate
and yet my dog (yes, Angelic Danny, as well as Taya
and Toby tore that kittne to threads from between the
crate bars. (apparently he stuck his paws through the
crate to bat at the dogs. I was out doing yard work
and rushed in to find the little kittens pieces and
parts being torn through by ALL the dogs.

I called my girl friend to come get my dogs. I screamed
displeasure, and stalked out with the kitten. Danny, et
al spent 3 days in a kennel until I finally felt like I
could interact with them without doing bodily harm. All
three dogs were never touched, but knew they had done
something so unspeakable that I wouldn't associate with
them and they got banished.

To this day, Taya (mom and Dad's dog) and Danny will not
look at a cat. When confronted with one, Danny wees
himself and cowers hiding behind me for help.

I'm not saying this would work this way with all dogs, But mom
and dad now have a house cat, and she has never been
harmed by any of the dogs. Danny is there all the time,
unsupervised, and has no interest in harming the cat.

-------------------------------------------------------

> The four surviving animals were removed from the
> alleged puppy killer's home by animal control workers.

They'll take them to the SHELTER and MURDER them.

> After recuperating from the gunshot wound, Bradford
> was charged last week with felony animal cruelty

FOR WHAAAAT?

HE WAS SAVIN THEM FROM NEGLECT and ABUSE
JUST LIKE HOWE HOWER dog lovers PREFER. He
wasn't HURTIN INTIMIDATING and MURDERIN them
like THIS:


"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution
Will Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER"
lynn.

lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to it.
When he barks, use the line for a correction.

if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar.

Lynn K.

"I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in
one shelter.) But their ability to set their own
schedules and duties causes a great deal of
scheduling overhead.

And it takes effort and thought to ensure that
volunteers get the meaningful experience that
they work for.

Someone has to be responsible for that
Volunteer Program, and it is best done
by a non-volunteer."

Lynn K.
---------------------------------

From: Lynn Kosmakos (lkosmakos@home.com)
Subject: Re: They're called "privates" for a reason, yaknow
Date: 1999/10/06

Could very well be. Java won't let me have kittens around
the house. If I remember correctly, bunnies are just like
kittens - mysteries at birth.

Lynn K.

------------------------------

"You Lying Sack Of Dung.When Have I Ever Said
Anything About Using A Prong Collar, Or Any Collar
Correction At All, To Make Dogs Friendly To House
Cats? Don't bother. The answer is never," lying "I
LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.

lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn writes about kats and dogs:

"This Article Is Something We've Put Together
For SF GSD Rescue

From: Lynn Kosmakos (lkosmakos@home.com)
Subject: Re: I have a dog he has cats
Date: 1999/11/20

g*7@my-deja.com wrote:
> How can I get him to quit chasing the cats.

Okay - this is going to be a bit loooong - Lynn K.

"Put a prong collar with a six-foot leash on the dog. Don't
forget to put the muzzle on the dog. I think a prong works
better than a choke with less chance of injury to the dog in
this situation.

Electronics can be used to create an aversion to cats, but
should be used under the direction of a trainer who knows how
to instruct the owner in their proper use. Electronics can
take the form of shock, sonic or citronella collars. At that
time the owner will train with electronics instead of food or
whatever other reward system was being used."

8) Put a prong collar with a six-foot leash on the dog.
Don't forget to put the muzzle on the dog. I think a prong
works better than a choke with less chance of injury to the
dog in this situation. Have the dog in a sit-stay next to
you with most of the slack out of the leash and let the cat
walk through the room and up to the dog if it wishes (this is
why you have the dog muzzled).

If the dog makes an aggressive move towards the
cat, it must be corrected strongly with both your
voice and the collar.

This is important - the correction must be physically
very strong - not a nag. (PS: not many dogs need
to be corrected at all)."

"I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed
every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the
effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the
older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition.

Should I have refused to groom them?

Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who
had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter."

Lynn K.

Baghdad Bob <Baghdadbob> wrote in message
news:<04591a2c5d469ef78d35c89ed4ed58f7@TeraNews>...

> >> Lynn, looks like he got you there if these
> >> quotes are true.
> >> In the posts below you take responsibility for
> >> making those calls.
> >> In your post above, you state you do not
> >> make those calls.
> >>Which one is it?

-------------------------

> and briefly booked into the Escambia County Jail,

He needs to be booked into a gun safety class
And HOWER MENTAL CASES need to get
booked into secure mental heelth facilities for
the criminally insane.

> where he posted a $1500 bond.

The C-HOWENTY could provide a gun safety
class for abHOWET 20 bucks. HOWER criminal
justice system will pick up the tab for mental
heelth care treatment.


WORDS OF WISDOM
from our own Lynn Kosmakos
1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every day
For Twenty Years

I THINK I'M QUALIFIED TO TALK ABOUT LITHIUM

"I, too, have a bi-polar mood disorder (manic-depression)
requiring 1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every
day.

I, also, care about dogs and use this forum to learn
more, while happily sharing pertinent information
I have learned. But if I were ever to post such sh*t,
I would hope that every other reader of this group
would be rightfully outraged."

"Community is an evolutionary thing that we earn
the right to participate in by observing the
easily understood rules and contributing to in
constructive ways."

Lynn K.

-----------------------------------------

"It wasn't that meds didn't work for her
- she wouldn't take them. I particularly remember
a comment she made about scarey side effects of
Lithium. Hardly. After 17 years on it, I think
I'm qualified to say that the very low risk of
any side effect is far less frightening than the
very real dangers of life without it."

Lynn K.
-----------------------------------------

"Only the unenlightened speak of wisdom and right action
as separate, not the wise. If any man knows one, he
enjoys the fruit of both. The level which is reached by
wisdom is attained through right action as well. He who
perceives that the two are one knows the truth."

"Even the wise man acts in character with his nature,
indeed all creatures act according to their natures.
What is the use of compulsion then? The love and
hate which are aroused by the objects of sense arise
from Nature, do not yield to them. They only obstruct
the path." Bhagavad Gita, adapted by Krishna with
permission from His FREE copy of my FREE Wits'
End Dog Training Method manual.

Force training JERRYIZES dogs, and GETS THEM DEAD.

"Speech is a mirror of the soul: as a man speaks,
so is he." Publilius Syrus, First century B.C., Maxim 1073

"We are what we do."


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