Research Discussion: Earth And Moon

Earth And Moon
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HVAC
2010-06-08 08:22:11 EST
ScienceDaily (June 7, 2010) — Astronomers have theorized that the
planet Earth and the Moon were created as the result of a giant
collision between two planets the size of Mars and Venus. Until now,
the collision was thought to have happened when the solar system was
30 million years old, or approximately 4,537 million years ago. But
new research shows that Earth and the Moon must have formed much later
-- perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of the solar
system.

The research results have been published in the scientific journal
Earth and Planetary Science Letters.

"We have determined the ages of the Earth and the Moon using tungsten
isotopes, which can reveal whether the iron cores and their stone
surfaces have been mixed together during the collision," explains Tais
W. Dahl, who did the research as his thesis project in geophysics at
the Niels Bohr Institute at the University of Copenhagen in
collaboration with professor David J. Stevenson from the California
Institute of Technology (Caltech).

Turbulent collisions

The planets in the solar system are thought to have been created by
collisions between small dwarf planets orbiting the newborn Sun. In
the collisions, the small planets melted together and formed larger
and larger planets. Earth and the Moon are believed to be the result
of a gigantic collision between two planets the size of Mars and
Venus. The two planets collided at a time when both had a core of
metal (iron) and a surrounding mantle of silicates (rock). But when
did it happen and how did it happen? The collision took place in less
than 24 hours and the temperature of the Earth was so high (7000º C),
that both rock and metal must have melted in the turbulent collision.
But were the stone mass and iron mass also mixed together?

Until recently it was believed that the rock and iron mixed completely
during the planet formation and so the conclusion was that the Moon
was formed when the solar system was 30 million years old or
approximately 4,537 million years ago. But new research shows
something completely different.

Dating with radioactive elements

The age of Earth and the Moon can be dated by examining the presence
of certain elements in Earth's mantle. Hafnium-182 is a radioactive
substance, which decays and is converted into the isotope
tungsten-182. The two elements have markedly different chemical
properties and while the tungsten isotopes prefer to bond with metal,
hafnium prefers to bond to silicates, i.e. rock.

It takes 50-60 million years for all hafnium to decay and be converted
into tungsten, and during the Moon forming collision nearly all the
metal sank into Earth's core. But did all the tungsten go into the
core?

"We have studied to what degree metal and rock mix together during the
planet forming collisions. Using dynamic model calculations of the
turbulent mixing of the liquid rock and iron masses we have found that
tungsten isotopes from the Earth's early formation remain in the rocky
mantle," explains Dahl.

The new studies imply that the moon forming collision occurred after
all of the hafnium had decayed completely into tungsten.

"Our results show that metal core and rock are unable to emulsify in
these collisions between planets that are greater than 10 kilometres
in diameter and therefore that most of the Earth's iron core (80-99 %)
did not remove tungsten from the rocky material in the mantle during
formation," explains Dahl.

The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
the solar system.

Bert
2010-06-08 10:06:22 EST
On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
> ScienceDaily (June 7, 2010) — Astronomers have theorized that the
> planet Earth and the Moon were created as the result of a giant
> collision between two planets the size of Mars and Venus. Until now,
> the collision was thought to have happened when the solar system was
> 30 million years old, or approximately 4,537 million years ago. But
> new research shows that Earth and the Moon must have formed much later
> -- perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of the solar
> system.
>
> The research results have been published in the scientific journal
> Earth and Planetary Science Letters.
>
> "We have determined the ages of the Earth and the Moon using tungsten
> isotopes, which can reveal whether the iron cores and their stone
> surfaces have been mixed together during the collision," explains Tais
> W. Dahl, who did the research as his thesis project in geophysics at
> the Niels Bohr Institute at the University of Copenhagen in
> collaboration with professor David J. Stevenson from the California
> Institute of Technology (Caltech).
>
> Turbulent collisions
>
> The planets in the solar system are thought to have been created by
> collisions between small dwarf planets orbiting the newborn Sun. In
> the collisions, the small planets melted together and formed larger
> and larger planets. Earth and the Moon are believed to be the result
> of a gigantic collision between two planets the size of Mars and
> Venus. The two planets collided at a time when both had a core of
> metal (iron) and a surrounding mantle of silicates (rock). But when
> did it happen and how did it happen? The collision took place in less
> than 24 hours and the temperature of the Earth was so high (7000º C),
> that both rock and metal must have melted in the turbulent collision.
> But were the stone mass and iron mass also mixed together?
>
> Until recently it was believed that the rock and iron mixed completely
> during the planet formation and so the conclusion was that the Moon
> was formed when the solar system was 30 million years old or
> approximately 4,537 million years ago. But new research shows
> something completely different.
>
> Dating with radioactive elements
>
> The age of Earth and the Moon can be dated by examining the presence
> of certain elements in Earth's mantle. Hafnium-182 is a radioactive
> substance, which decays and is converted into the isotope
> tungsten-182. The two elements have markedly different chemical
> properties and while the tungsten isotopes prefer to bond with metal,
> hafnium prefers to bond to silicates, i.e. rock.
>
> It takes 50-60 million years for all hafnium to decay and be converted
> into tungsten, and during the Moon forming collision nearly all the
> metal sank into Earth's core. But did all the tungsten go into the
> core?
>
> "We have studied to what degree metal and rock mix together during the
> planet forming collisions. Using dynamic model calculations of the
> turbulent mixing of the liquid rock and iron masses we have found that
> tungsten isotopes from the Earth's early formation remain in the rocky
> mantle," explains Dahl.
>
> The new studies imply that the moon forming collision occurred after
> all of the hafnium had decayed completely into tungsten.
>
> "Our results show that metal core and rock are unable to emulsify in
> these collisions between planets that are greater than 10 kilometres
> in diameter and therefore that most of the Earth's iron core (80-99 %)
> did not remove tungsten from the rocky material in the mantle during
> formation," explains Dahl.
>
> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
> the solar system.

Much better clues prove capture theory. TreBert

Hagar
2010-06-08 10:09:08 EST

"bert" <herbertglazier79@msn.com> wrote in message
news:014ba262-5f1a-4050-88f0-2d15e67bb0a1@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:

< snip >

> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
> the solar system.

Much better clues prove capture theory. TreBert

*************************************
How about naming just one, TreNumbNutz ....



HVAC
2010-06-08 10:22:56 EST

"Hagar" <hagen@sahm.name> wrote in message
news:oICdna7TG_ea0pPRnZ2dnUVZ_jKdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> "bert" <herbertglazier79@msn.com> wrote in message
> news:014ba262-5f1a-4050-88f0-2d15e67bb0a1@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> < snip >
>
>> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
>> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
>> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
>> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
>> the solar system.
>
> Much better clues prove capture theory. TreBert
>
> *************************************
> How about naming just one, TreNumbNutz ....



Painus told him.

That's good enough for Bert and AA.



Brad Guth
2010-06-08 12:52:14 EST
On Jun 8, 5:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
> ScienceDaily (June 7, 2010) — Astronomers have theorized that the
> planet Earth and the Moon were created as the result of a giant
> collision between two planets the size of Mars and Venus. Until now,
> the collision was thought to have happened when the solar system was
> 30 million years old, or approximately 4,537 million years ago. But
> new research shows that Earth and the Moon must have formed much later
> -- perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of the solar
> system.
>
> The research results have been published in the scientific journal
> Earth and Planetary Science Letters.
>
> "We have determined the ages of the Earth and the Moon using tungsten
> isotopes, which can reveal whether the iron cores and their stone
> surfaces have been mixed together during the collision," explains Tais
> W. Dahl, who did the research as his thesis project in geophysics at
> the Niels Bohr Institute at the University of Copenhagen in
> collaboration with professor David J. Stevenson from the California
> Institute of Technology (Caltech).
>
> Turbulent collisions
>
> The planets in the solar system are thought to have been created by
> collisions between small dwarf planets orbiting the newborn Sun. In
> the collisions, the small planets melted together and formed larger
> and larger planets. Earth and the Moon are believed to be the result
> of a gigantic collision between two planets the size of Mars and
> Venus. The two planets collided at a time when both had a core of
> metal (iron) and a surrounding mantle of silicates (rock). But when
> did it happen and how did it happen? The collision took place in less
> than 24 hours and the temperature of the Earth was so high (7000º C),
> that both rock and metal must have melted in the turbulent collision.
> But were the stone mass and iron mass also mixed together?
>
> Until recently it was believed that the rock and iron mixed completely
> during the planet formation and so the conclusion was that the Moon
> was formed when the solar system was 30 million years old or
> approximately 4,537 million years ago. But new research shows
> something completely different.
>
> Dating with radioactive elements
>
> The age of Earth and the Moon can be dated by examining the presence
> of certain elements in Earth's mantle. Hafnium-182 is a radioactive
> substance, which decays and is converted into the isotope
> tungsten-182. The two elements have markedly different chemical
> properties and while the tungsten isotopes prefer to bond with metal,
> hafnium prefers to bond to silicates, i.e. rock.
>
> It takes 50-60 million years for all hafnium to decay and be converted
> into tungsten, and during the Moon forming collision nearly all the
> metal sank into Earth's core. But did all the tungsten go into the
> core?
>
> "We have studied to what degree metal and rock mix together during the
> planet forming collisions. Using dynamic model calculations of the
> turbulent mixing of the liquid rock and iron masses we have found that
> tungsten isotopes from the Earth's early formation remain in the rocky
> mantle," explains Dahl.
>
> The new studies imply that the moon forming collision occurred after
> all of the hafnium had decayed completely into tungsten.
>
> "Our results show that metal core and rock are unable to emulsify in
> these collisions between planets that are greater than 10 kilometres
> in diameter and therefore that most of the Earth's iron core (80-99 %)
> did not remove tungsten from the rocky material in the mantle during
> formation," explains Dahl.
>
> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
> the solar system.

This only further proves my argument(s), that planets and moons can be
not only created out of lithobraking encounters, but also subsequently
captured by an existing solar system.

So, let us talk about the relatively recent and sudden evolution of
the nearby Sirius(B) solar system, and of its demise.

~ BG

Brad Guth
2010-06-08 12:55:14 EST
On Jun 8, 7:09 am, "Hagar" <ha...@sahm.name> wrote:
> "bert" <herbertglazie...@msn.com> wrote in message
>
> news:014ba262-5f1a-4050-88f0-2d15e67bb0a1@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> < snip >
>
> > The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
> > been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
> > 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
> > years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
> > the solar system.
>
> Much better clues prove capture theory.  TreBert
>
>         *************************************
> How about naming just one, TreNumbNutz ....

The matching Arctic ocean basin to that of the lunar south polar
crater of 2500 km.

Otherwise, several moons of Jupiter can only be of those captured.

~ BG

Brad Guth
2010-06-08 12:56:18 EST
On Jun 8, 7:22 am, "HVAC" <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Hagar" <ha...@sahm.name> wrote in message
>
> news:oICdna7TG_ea0pPRnZ2dnUVZ_jKdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > "bert" <herbertglazie...@msn.com> wrote in message
> >news:014ba262-5f1a-4050-88f0-2d15e67bb0a1@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> > On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > < snip >
>
> >> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
> >> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
> >> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
> >> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
> >> the solar system.
>
> > Much better clues prove capture theory.  TreBert
>
> >        *************************************
> > How about naming just one, TreNumbNutz ....
>
> Painus told him.
>
> That's good enough for Bert and AA.
and Guth, plus a few thousand others.

~ BG

Bert
2010-06-08 15:06:52 EST
On Jun 8, 12:56 pm, Brad Guth <bradg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jun 8, 7:22 am, "HVAC" <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Hagar" <ha...@sahm.name> wrote in message
>
> >news:oICdna7TG_ea0pPRnZ2dnUVZ_jKdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> > > "bert" <herbertglazie...@msn.com> wrote in message
> > >news:014ba262-5f1a-4050-88f0-2d15e67bb0a1@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > < snip >
>
> > >> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
> > >> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
> > >> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
> > >> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
> > >> the solar system.
>
> > > Much better clues prove capture theory.  TreBert
>
> > >        *************************************
> > > How about naming just one, TreNumbNutz ....
>
> > Painus told him.
>
> > That's good enough for Bert and AA.
>
> and Guth, plus a few thousand others.
>
>  ~ BG- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Moon very little iron,and Earth lots of iron. Earth core iron moon's
cre no indication of iron. Moon rich in Iridium Earth has little.
Earth plenty of water,and not one molecule of water in the 830 lb of
moon rock tested. All other planet moons go with capture. Reality is
Earth's does . TreBert

Painius
2010-06-08 15:14:18 EST
"HVAC" <mr.hvac@gmail.com> wrote...
in message news:huljnv$lmj$1@hvac.motzarella.org...
> "Hagar" <hagen@sahm.name> wrote in message
> news:oICdna7TG_ea0pPRnZ2dnUVZ_jKdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>> "bert" <herbertglazier79@msn.com> wrote in message
>> news:014ba262-5f1a-4050-88f0-2d15e67bb0a1@x21g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>> On Jun 8, 8:22 am, HVAC <mr.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> < snip >
>>
>>> The result of the research means that Earth and the Moon must have
>>> been formed much later than previously thought -- that is to say not
>>> 30 million years after the formation of the solar system 4,567 million
>>> years ago but perhaps up to 150 million years after the formation of
>>> the solar system.
>>
>> Much better clues prove capture theory. TreBert
>>
>> *************************************
>> How about naming just one, TreNumbNutz ....
>
> Painus told him.
>
> That's good enough for Bert and AA.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Listen, Harlow, Bert expressed his capture theory long
before i ever did. It was in fact his expression of the
Moon getting captured by the Earth that started me on
the road to my little idea. This was back *before* the
present mainstream expression of the Giant Impact
Hypothesis. Then, when that mainstream idea came
along, both Bert and i rejected it out of hand. And we
both think that anybody in their right mind would, at
the very least *consider* the possibility of my Gentle
Capture Hypothesis. It's a probability item, Harlow.

What's the probability of a spherical Mars-sized object
coming in on just the right trajectory so as to cause a
collision that would result in the Moon? as opposed to
the probability of the Moon and Earth forming in very
similar orbits from the Sun and eventually very gently
capturing each other?

People who follow the mainstream like a sheep would
continue to adhere to the GIH, and people who have
developed their critical thinking skills would continue
to follow the mainstream while seriously considering
the possibility that the GCH did occur.

And Bert is older than i am, so if it's anybody following
anybody, it's me following Bert. If you don't like that,
then you can just stick it.

happy days and...
starry starry nights!

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine Ellsworth

P.S. "In my experience, there is only one motivation,
and that is desire. No reasons or principle
contain it or stand against it."
> Jane Smiley
Pulitzer Prize-winning American novelist

P.P.S.: http://www.painellsworth.net
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Paine_Ellsworth



HVAC
2010-06-08 15:30:52 EST

"Painius" <starswirlernosp@maol.com> wrote in message
news:4c0e968a$0$4830$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>
> People who follow the mainstream like a sheep would
> continue to adhere to the GIH, and people who have
> developed their critical thinking skills would continue
> to follow the mainstream while seriously considering
> the possibility that the GCH did occur.


This coming from the traitor that thinks that
the USA bombings of Japan that ended the
war and SAVED millions of lives is equivalent
to the Nazi holocaust?

Go astrally project yourself..... Sideways and backwards.





--
"Science isn't about revolution, it's about evolution" -HVAC


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